Episode 10 - Mindful Workspaces: Navigating Mental Health Challenges in the Workplace

Barbara Giesling, CEO of BAG-HR Consulting, discusses the rise of anxiety, stress, PTSD, and burnout in the workforce. She highlights the stigma around mental health and the need for open conversations to remove the stigma and provide help. Shockingly, a large percentage of adults and youth with mental illness do not receive treatment, with Texas having high numbers. Stress is a response to external causes and can be positive, whereas anxiety is more internal and persistent. Stress and anxiety can both have negative effects on physical and mental health. Workplace factors such as low wages, lack of opportunity, and lack of inclusivity contribute to stress and anxiety. It is important for employers to provide mental health coverage and create a variety of opportunities for support. Welcome to CoachingOmics Presents Podcast, a part of the ECS Network. I'm your host, Laura Perez Earhart. I'm a management consultant and executive coach, and I've been consulting and coaching executives for a couple of decades. My guest is Barbara Giesling. Barbara is a seasoned professional with over 30 years of experience in all facets of human resources. She's currently serving as a CEO of BAG-HR Consulting. Her impressive credentials include licenses as a SHRM SCP and SPHR, along with being a CPSP and certified in small business management. She holds a bachelor's degree in journalism, specializing in news editorial writing and a master's in public affairs. Always striving for growth and expertise, Barbara finds joy in collecting acronyms to her name, although she humorously acknowledges that it may be confusing occasionally to her audience. Under her leadership, BAG-HR Consulting offers comprehensive HR solutions that drive efficiency, accountability, and overall success for companies and organizations. Barbara has successfully collaborated with diverse entities, ranging from small-scale operations to global enterprises with thousands of employees. Beyond her professional pursuits, cherishes work alongside her trained therapy dog, indulges in marathon running, and surprisingly finds enjoyment in the scorching Texas heat. Barbara, it's a great pleasure to have you on my show. There's a rise of anxiety, stress, PTSD, and burnout more than ever before. How different is this issue today as opposed to pre-pandemic? Well, first of all, thanks so much for having me here today, Laura. I do appreciate it and I'm looking forward to the conversation. Mental health is such an important topic and what the effects in the workforce and on society. And hopefully we can start getting rid of the stigma if we talk about it more so that people can get the help that they need when they need it. Ironically, the California News came out with a report today on findings from the Commonwealth Fund that noted that nationally, 55% of adults ages 18 and older with mental illness don't receive treatment. So more than half people with a mental illness. The best state reported 41%, unfortunately Texas, which is where I'm from, reported 62%. It's not receiving help. For youth, 60% of youth, 12 to 17, with major depressive episodes, don't receive mental health services. That's just appalling. The best state there was 33%, which that's getting much better. Again, unfortunately Texas came in at 75%. So this is a very topical issue. We've got to find some answers to and figure out how to do a better job with working with people with mental illness and stress and anxiety. Yeah, Barbara, those numbers are alarming. Whether it's Texas or anywhere else, 75% of the population that are dealing with mental health are not receiving any kind of care. Why do you think that might be? Again, unfortunately I think there has been a stigma attached to mental illness. Our thought process and our brains are so integral to be us and who we are as a human, and especially as a worker, when that's how we're making our living for the most part. It's scary to put ourselves out there and say we need some help. So people try to just internalize and often that doesn't work. They need external help and they need that support. So that's why it is so important that we have these types of conversations so that we can remove that stigma and allow people to get the help they need. Yeah, absolutely. That's devastating. Just the shame alone, and I think that people feel shameful of having some type of mental disparity or illness. As a society, adding more, having more educational events to really bring this to the forefront and to educate folks around mental illness and the disparities around mental illness. Right. Instead of feeling reluctant, they can lean into it and say, you know what, I do need help and it's okay for me to reach out for help. Right? Yeah, absolutely. And companies, there's a lot companies can do to help with that as well. Yeah. And we're going to dive into that in a bit, but something else that I thought of is how do you define stress versus anxiety? Well, I'm, first of all, I'm not a psychologist or mental health expert, but I've got lots of years of HR experience, so I've been working with people for a while now. And from my understanding, stress tends to be a response to an external cause. So things like, you know, we've got a project at work that's kind of a little bit stretched for our abilities or we're going on a job interview or we're up for a promotion. Those are things we tend to get stressed about. Those are specific events. And stress in this particular situation can be positive. It doesn't always have to be a negative connotation with stress because it can be motivational, it can help us get on our toes and that kind of thing. And it does typically stop after the specific situation is resolved. Anxiety, on the other hand, is more internal, where we have these kind of feelings of apprehension or fear or dread and it's, you know, we can't say it's just based on this one thing. It's just kind of, you know, internalized on life. It typically doesn't resolve easily. It's often persistent and can interfere with life activities. And then there are anxiety disorders that can be actually diagnosed and these can be things like panic attacks. But regardless of stress or anxiety, either one can cause lack of sleep, loss of energy, physical issues like headaches, blood pressure elevation, heart palpitations, digestive issues. So there are a lot of concerns regarding either one, anxiety or stress. And it's been reported that one in five adults in the United States have anxiety. And this has also just been in the news in the last couple of weeks that now they're recommending anxiety screenings for all adults under the age of 65. So that's something new that when people go to their checkups, they're going to start screening for that, which I think is a good thing. But to your point, I know that stress can be a positive thing. It can be good meaning in the short term and it can inspire and motivate us at times. Absolutely. It helps us to focus on our energies to enhance performance, for example. Also, it helps us to really dive into what the potential issue or problem might be. Some of the causes around stress. What causes people to become anxious or stressed out? Well, again, it can be such a variety of issues within anybody's life. It can be personal. It can be professional. It can be societal. So all of those things can cause it. As far as the workplace, the things that we see that are more definitive signs of stress or anxiety, absenteeism is a huge one. If a company is dealing with a lot of absenteeism, they need to look at that as one of the potential issues. Is there a lot of stress or anxiety in the workplace? Attrition is another one. And we actually had over 50 million Americans quit their jobs in 2022. That is the highest number in history since they've been counting those numbers. For 2023, today, we are not quite as high as 2022, but we're still in historic numbers. And, of course, not all attrition is due to stress or anxiety, but it absolutely is a contributing factor. It's also low productivity, lack of creativity, decreased job satisfaction, and then increased disciplinary issues. All of those are tangible things that we are reporting in the workforce that we can see. And some of the things that cause these at work is if an employee is not matched with their skills and knowledge in a particular job, whether the employee maybe exaggerated their knowledge getting into the job or the employer kind of changed the job specifications once the employee started. That works both ways. And if the employer doesn't provide the training needed for that to help the person become knowledgeable for that particular role, that can absolutely exacerbate stress for the employee as well, or if they aren't supportive in that. So that can certainly make a difference. The World Health Organization came out with a report this year that said the highest causes of stress or anxiety in the workplace are low wages, lack of opportunity, and too much work. These were the three top stressors from what they said. Another thing that can cause stress in the workplace that gets a lot of press for different reasons is lack of inclusivity. And that can be diversity. That can mean so many different things regardless of background, regardless of culture. If someone, again, doesn't feel supported or feels like the outlier for whatever reason, that can be an issue that is caused within the workplace. But the good thing is there is more awareness since COVID-19. You know, that's kind of like stress overload for the entire world in dealing with that. And so we've become more aware of the issues and what causes and what happens with stress and anxiety. It also increased the availability of digital wellness platforms so that in the past you pretty much had the option of going to a counselor. Now there's a lot more digital wellness things available for individuals that they can use 24-7. And with the different generations in the world that need this now, that's a great thing for us to have. And the studies are showing that the telehealth options are as productive as in-person. So that's really good. So the other thing we are finding out is employees are looking to their employers for mental health coverage. So there is an expectation that the employers are going to have that available for them. So we need to know that. So we've got to remember we've got multiple generations in the workforce. There is no one-size-fits-all. We have to make sure that we are having a variety of opportunities for people. And the other thing that people don't think about from a company standpoint either is Occupational Safety and Health Administration, OSHA, requires a safe workplace. And this does include addressing mental health issues. So we need to address it emotionally. We need to address it from a societal standpoint. And we need to address it legally. My next question around OSHA regulations and what organizations are doing to address mental health in the workplace today. I'm curious to learn, what's the organization's responsibility to address mental health in the workplace? So it's a two-part. The second part is, what are some of the things companies are starting to do today to take action? Absolutely. Well, as I mentioned, we've got the absenteeism, the productivity, the creativity, the attrition. All of those things are affecting the workplace. So if you put everything else aside, organizations need to address it for their own success and benefit or they're going to have a problem. Some of the things that they are doing right now, EAP programs, which are Employee Assistance Programs, this is probably the most common. And many of these provide a counseling mechanism as part of that. They also may have some other services available. But that's probably the most common thing. Some companies are also providing wellness seminars or webinars. And these can work on various aspects of life. They can be physical, spiritual, financial, and then specifically mental and emotional health. But I would also say physical, spiritual, and financial absolutely affect emotional health as well. If you are feeling good and healthy, you're more likely to have a positive frame of mind if you're in a good spiritual place. Same deal. If you're not obsessing about finances, obviously that's going to help. So any of these factors can help. So companies are looking at that as well. There's also a trend of increased mental health benefits through medical plans. And these are including things like telehealth and additionally counseling services, both inpatient and outpatient. And then, as we've mentioned now, fighting the stigma of mental health issues, making it okay in company cultures to discuss these concerns are some very definitive things companies can do to help move this forward. And it is so important. So, you know, again, since COVID, we've got this expanded awareness, fortunately, which I think is helping. And then also Generation Z moving into the workforce. And this is a generation that has increased expectations of work-life separation, which will help, I think, in the future for mental health issues. They also tend to be more willing to discuss these. So that's a great thing. Companies really need to look at their particular workforce and what suits them. What are the benefits and the challenges within their organization? Because it does vary from industry to industry and company to company. And we have to be able and willing to address these issues for both company and employee success. That's really so important. There was a report that the Society for Human Resource Management published in October of last year on employee mental health. And they talked about organizations offering resources, but they also need to provide a supportive culture to be really successful. That only one in four were succeeding in both. And what they found was 18% of companies reported high resources but an unsupportive culture. So, hey, we've got plenty of resources for mental health, but we don't want to hear about it. We don't want you to talk about it. We're not going to help you from a supportive standpoint. 21% reported low resources but a supportive culture. So, hey, we're here for you. We don't have anything you can do about it, but we're here for you. 38% – this is what's really sad to me – reported low resources and an unsupportive culture. So that is a way too high number. And then, again, 24%, as I mentioned, reported both high resources and supportive culture. So we've got a long way to go to make both of these things work. And, again, I think stigma is part of that. Yeah, and that's, you know, what we mentioned earlier, you know, educate, educate, educate. Absolutely. Asking the questions, organization's responsibility, but also the responsibility of the employee to speak up. You know, the great thing is it's evolving. It's very slow. What I've noticed is when I'm consulting or coaching in these organizations, whether they're small or larger, and we've talked about any kind of mental health and wellness programs that they have, some of them have on-staff wellness programs. They've also started incorporating coaching, which I've been coaching. Mental health, well-being has been a big part of the conversations when I've been coaching folks at their companies. So it's good to see that they're starting to provide that support. And you're right, Barbara, a lot of them still don't know what they don't know, meaning that they're not sure how to progress. Right. And I think, you know, providing education for you as an HR expert, for me as an executive consultant and coach, is to be able to provide these organizations and smaller companies with even just general information that will really align with their employee needs. Right. It's always about we always talk about putting the employee first. Right. Sounds good. By the theory, it's like, no, you actually have to practice this. Oh, darn. I'm curious, for your research, Barbara, what did you find about real concrete impacts of anxiety, PTSD, and stressors for people in their personal and professional lives? Right. Well, as we talked about earlier, some of the different things in the workforce that a lot of people have heard about, and, again, part of the people quitting that I talked about earlier, but there was a report by McKinsey Institute that employees facing mental health challenges are four times more likely than others to want to leave their organization. So, again, clear effect there. And then a third of United States workers, 35 percent, are noting that they're experiencing high levels of burnout. That's a huge aspect of the workforce. We're seeing signs of depression. Of course, there's inflation, financial stress. This is very clearly affecting a lot of people. Homelessness, this is something that's been repeated. It's on the rise since 2017. And they're reporting that between 25 percent and 45 percent of individuals who are homeless have reported as having some sort of mental illness. So that's another aspect from a societal standpoint. And then, unfortunately, we're seeing this rise in violent crimes. It's just really scary. Almost weekly now we're dealing with some level of violence that we haven't seen as much in the past. And, again, whether the incident itself is caused by stress or anxiety or PTSD or whatever, the outcome certainly is creating anxiety and stress and PTSD. So, unfortunately, those are all factors. It's alarming. Listen to the news, the overwhelm of violence that's happening. But the other part of this is the alarming number of suicides during the pandemic and post-pandemic. Suicide does not discriminate. Right. And we have seen suicides. The person is a high achiever, top performer, an executive. They've been very successful and for their colleagues to learn that he or she, you know, ended their lives. Absolutely. Which leaves people stunned. That's devastating. A major devastation. I hear this often. I never knew. I would have never thought that she or he had an issue. Absolutely. People are really good at masking deep wounds, not reaching out for help. And a lot of it can be due to shame. You know, this is alarming. So I just say, even with those folks that we work with or their colleagues, maybe we don't see them all the time. But, you know, to just lean in and to make sure that we're touching base with people that are friends or colleagues or family members and just to see how they're doing. What are some of the things that people can do proactively that are dealing with some kind of burnout, stress or anxiety? Well, you know, I'm going to throw in a couple of examples of things I've seen at work as far as individuals dealing with stress or not dealing with stress, so to speak. Many years ago, I worked for a global organization and we had locations all over the place. But in one particular large city, we were in a multi-tenant building and building management, which was not part of our company, was having an issue with their elevators being damaged. So they put cameras in their elevator bank trying to figure out what was going on. And after they'd done that, they came to tell us that it was one of our employees causing this issue. And they showed us the tape. And when this person was alone in the elevator, they were pulling out a knife and carving up the lining of the elevator. This was a young female professional who was overwhelmed and she didn't know how to handle the stress and the anxiety. So that's what she was doing to cope. And she at that time just did not feel like she could speak up or do anything. And, again, this was years ago when it was even more of a stigma. So, again, you know, we talked about it's not the people you think it's going to be necessarily. I had another time where we had an individual who, unfortunately, was drinking to cover his stress and anxiety. And eventually he lost his job over an altercation he had with a client when he was intoxicated. And, again, this individual was a highly educated, high-level management professional. I've had several employees over the years break down in my presence due to pressure from all levels of organizations. And the easier ones to deal with are, as we talked about, with stress, if it's related to a specific issue or project or whatever. You know, those are tangible and you know they're going to end soon if they haven't already ended. So we can usually work through that fairly easily. The more difficult ones are this pervasive anxiety where it's just this overwhelming feeling of, you know, I don't know what to do or how to cope. And any time we have dealt with that, we've certainly tried to provide any kind of resources we can to help. But, as you mentioned, the key is that individuals really do need to reach out and they need to feel comfortable and confident in being able to do that, which I know is still difficult, and take advantage of the resources that are available, getting help where they can. Larger organizations often do provide the benefits, even if they're not touting them as much. But even small organizations can provide listings. There's lots of national or state or local resources available. And if we can make a list of all the organizations that we can reach out to, we can make a list of all the organizations that we can reach out to, we can make a list of all the organizations that we can reach out to. There's lots of national or state or local resources available. And if we can make sure we're posting that and putting that out pretty commonly, then that can help. Managers have to be open to conversations to try to help. Unfortunately, not all organizations think to provide this information, and many managers, as we discussed, are still uncomfortable having conversations about mental illness. That's why we need to remind the employees of our resources, because often with anything, whether it's mental health or physical health or whatever, if we don't need it, we don't pay attention to it. But then when we need it, that's when we need to hear about it. So sending that information out at least quarterly, I think, is a really good idea, these constant reminders. Is there somewhere on your website that you list this information? I haven't put it up there, but I will certainly, because I do think that's such an important thing to have. And, again, there are so many national organizations out there that can help no matter where you are. And there are a lot of local resources in a lot of big cities as well that can help. And those are free resources that people can turn to, and it covers all kinds of – it can cover mental issues, it can cover financial issues, of course, domestic abuse, which we're not so much talking about today, sexual violence. Any of those things obviously can cause mental issues as well. And there are plenty of resources out there. I did want to mention – I did look this up from the Mayo Clinic. They were saying anybody that's having these issues needs to see a doctor when their worrying interferes with their work or with relationships or other parts of your life. So if you're finding that you're having issues that are ongoing, if fear, worry, or anxiety is a setting and difficult to control, you need to see someone. Certainly if you feel depressed or have trouble with alcohol or drug use or any other mental health concerns. Or if you think it's linked to a physical health problem. Again, physical health issues can cause mental just as mental can cause physical. So that's another good reason to get checked out. And, of course, anybody that's having any kind of suicidal thoughts or behaviors would need to seek emergency treatment immediately. Music Otherwise, some things you can do is try to figure out what's causing it. Why am I stressed? Why am I feeling anxious? If you can pinpoint that, that might help you come up with some answers. Again, seeking out support through managers or peers. Going to your company where you can. Finding out what the resources the company has to offer and take advantage of those. Those are things people can do. Great advice, Barbara. But what if the employee is reluctant to talk to someone at work? They might be scared of retaliation. Absolutely. I'd love to say, well, that would never happen. But, unfortunately, that absolutely can and does from time to time still. Employers absolutely need to be providing training and resources to managers and to employees. And I do think it's important to do both on mental health issues, resources, and ways to help. If they're training their managers, which, again, they absolutely need to do. And it can maybe be some separate training. But if they only do the management training and not the employees, then the employees don't necessarily know that's being emphasized. And that managers are supposed to be helping on this. So I think it's good to train both. And then we need to make sure in HR, I think this is one of the places that we need to step in a little bit better, helping managers understand how to check in with their employees, whether they're remote or on-site or whatever. You know, what does that mean and what does that look like? Company leadership absolutely needs to be encouraging a culture where mental health can be discussed. Again, providing those resources frequently. This is another key that I don't think companies are doing enough. We need to be seeking feedback from our employees as to what their specific needs and stresses are and then create action items on that. Because, again, it varies so widely based on population, based on age, based on industry, that it's really important that we look at our specific target to see what we can do for them. And we need to address these to be supportive. There was a shooting very close to where I live on Day 6 at the Allen Outlet Mall. And I know that got a lot of national press, so I'm sure several people are familiar with that. Nine people were killed, including the gunman. Seven people were injured. It was a nice day. People were just out shopping, you know, kind of minding their own business type things. What I found interesting after that, there were some area companies that addressed this tragedy, offered resources, even if none of their employees were directly involved. Others said nothing. So which do you think is more supportive? So companies, again, need to be thinking about not only what's affecting their employees personally and directly, but societal issues that can be affecting us and making sure we're addressing that and letting people know we're here for you and here's things you can do. As far as employees themselves, they absolutely should reach out to their manager or HR. But if they are working in a culture that is not conducive to mental health, then I would suggest they consider leaving. And I know that sounds drastic, and it kind of is, but we are at a point of labor shortages. They will likely be able to find a better job, and it is too important that they work somewhere where they feel supportive than to hang on to a job where they're not. That's just too key these days. Absolutely. 100% agree with you, Barbara. There's more opportunities out there for employees today. They can be a bit more selective. It's important to align with an employer that you have shared values with, right? Absolutely. Those managers, those leaders that you work for that actually have a caring and compassionate approach. They're empathetic. Absolutely. They take the time to learn and understand what's going on in your world as an employee. For you as a stakeholder, you matter to the individual. You matter to that leader. These are great leaders, and these are individuals that I've had the privilege of working with. And I'm currently working with a couple of companies where they are addressing mental health and weekly or once-a-month huddles, if you will. Generally, they'll spend 30 minutes, and having each one of their employees talk about what's going on in their world, it's kind of just a session where they can vent. They're literally given a stick, if you will. I pass on the stick once I've vented, and I get maybe 45 to 60 seconds to just say what's on my mind. And again, it's not a problem-solving session. This is where it helps both the team, but it helps the leader understand the mood of the team. Absolutely. And I think the managers that are doing those kind of things are going to be much more successful. For those that may not want to speak, and we would also address this, is for the employee who might be a bit more timid or who does not feel comfortable sharing anything with the team. The leader just sets some time aside for a one-on-one. Individuals can talk about challenges or stress going on, and then the leader provides any kind of feedback or follow-through for coaching. But also, they started putting out a list of services, mental health services, that they provide at the company, which is outstanding. I love the fact that they took it an extra step. Absolutely. And as I mentioned, finding different ways to help people, because it is not one-size-fits-all. Not everybody wants to talk about their issues with someone they work with, and that's absolutely fine. But let's give them other resources. We've talked about the physical impacts of stress, the emotional impacts. I recently read something that came across called micro-stress. And here's what I learned about it. It's not about just one big thing stressing you out or getting you down. It's a bunch of little things that pile up, such as a co-worker missing a deadline, client complaint, unexpected traffic, or getting a call from a child's school. These are called micro-stresses. They're small annoyances that can snowball into bigger problems due to poor performance, productivity, physical and mental health, without us even noticing it. Karen Dillon is a former editor at the Harvard Business Review and Bob Cross is a professor at Babson College. Together they wrote the book, The Micro-Stress Effect. They explain how this differentiates stress from micro-stress. And Dillon explains that the stress is something that we recognize, which she terms macro-stress. A micro-stress is a major life event. It can be around losing a job, the health of a loved one, being in jeopardy, or having a sick child. We recognize them and know how to respond to them. And this is where we talk to loved ones or friends and they provide empathy. The micro-stress are things that happen so quickly and briefly with routine interaction in our day that the brain rarely recognizes them. Dillon went on to explain that what happens is that the micro-stresses are taking a toll on us. And we don't have the language to complain about all those small things. It's just life. So she states that the frontal lobe of the brain does not recognize them in the same way a macro-stress would. So macro-stress triggers a fight-or-flight mechanism for protecting ourselves. But micro-stresses happen so briefly that we don't remember that they even happen. But at the same time, the body starts to register it as if we were layering upon layering more macro-stresses that adds up to something more significant. And by the end of the day, our body feels the impact because the body feels the micro-stresses throughout the entire day. So what other physical impacts people might feel? You know, besides, again, the health issues that we've talked about, the other aspect of it that we need to remember is it doesn't just impact the individual. It impacts their loved ones. It impacts their peers, managers, anybody interacting with the individual's life. So I can absolutely see how that could be added to the micro-stressors in that you have this other person is stressing, and that's putting the stress on you. And so it's not necessarily something from a macro level, but it's just going to add into that. And I do think that we are being bombarded with so much information every day and so many different ways to find information and deal with it, that I think that is helping add to, unfortunately, the stress and anxiety that we're feeling. So that makes perfect sense to me. The micro-stressors would be adding up. Just the other aspect of the whole stress and anxiety, whether it's macro or micro-stressors, the effects are absolutely real, and it can create physical issues as well as mental issues that impact the workplace environment, personal life, and society at large. That's, again, why this is such an important topic, and we need to make sure that we're addressing it appropriately. ♪ This brings me to my next topic around burnout and high performers. Talk a bit about why people who are achieving at a high level and have a lot of people they can rely on to help them suffer from this more than others. Absolutely. Well, when people get to, especially at certain levels, it can actually be kind of isolating. And you mentioned they've got all kinds of support and people around them, but they have found themselves at an upper-level position, maybe a company owner or just a high-level executive, and that can actually feel isolating. And so that can, unfortunately, feed into the thought that, well, if I reach out for help, that's a sign of weakness or conveys a lack of skill. That's part of what keeps them from getting the support they need. And then the other aspect of that is kind of along the same lines. They've got people surrounding them that depend on them as well, so they feel like they have to be the rock. They can't show weakness because they don't want to affect others by scaring them or shaking their confidence. So both of those things, unfortunately, can exacerbate that and make it that much harder for individuals at those levels to seek help and to get what they need. That's also where we can really make an impact, because if the individuals at these higher levels are feeling this burnout, this stress, anxiety, and they're willing to admit their concerns and reach out for help, and the organizations are supporting that, facilitating that, then this is going to help everybody else feel like, hey, if they can say they're hurting, if they need help, then I can too, and I don't have to worry about losing my job. So that's why that is such an important thing to get out there and to be willing to admit that people at the upper levels have the issue. The actual reports right now are showing, though, that the younger generations, the kids just coming out of high school and college who are less likely to be at these upper-level positions, they're actually the ones who are reporting the highest incidence of burnout and stress, which is interesting to me, because I can certainly make an argument for people with a lot of stress based on their position. But, again, they're getting bombarded with all this technological data and all these things happening in the world, and we find out, and it tends to be depressing news or bad news that we hear about, because that's more dramatic. And so when you just get hit and hit and hit with all of this, it can absolutely add up. Like you said, the micro-stressors as well as the macro-stressors. So these are the ones that are reporting the problems. But, again, if the higher-level individuals will reach out for support, that is going to help the younger generations as well. So I think that's really key to think about. Agreed. Earlier this year, I had an executive who I'm working with. High-level position has about 126 employees that report to this individual. I'm just going to call her Sarah, and Sarah reached out to me via her organization, who were backing her and completely supporting her because she had a major stress level. The good news is when she came to me to coach her, she talked about the challenges, mental health challenges, how it was affecting her sleeping patterns, eating patterns. I mean, literally, it was just high stress. The good news, by the time she and I met, she had started seeking counseling. I applaud her for that. The bonus was hiring me as a coach because not only does she have that mental health guidance, but she also has an expert coach who can help her set up those actionable plans, set those strategies, how she is proceeding forward. She's done dynamic. Anybody out there, Barbara, that is listening to this podcast, absolutely, there are resources. Seek therapy, absolutely. Seek a professional who is certified in psychology, but also if you have the resources, additional resources to get a professional coach, also complements the therapy, you get the action plans in place, and you have an additional expert helping you out. Something that you had mentioned earlier about employees or stakeholders who tend to see the lack of opportunity or lack of inclusivity in the workplace, I learned earlier this year about something called quiet quitting, which don't outright quit your job, but you're quitting the idea of going above and beyond, right? So that person is used to being a high performer, and we see them high performer. All of a sudden, we see them easing back. They're still performing their duties, but they're no longer subscribing to the hustle of the culture mentality. So this movement started earlier this year as employees across the U.S. pushed back against overwork, underpaid, given limited advancement opportunities, as you've mentioned before. The phrase refers to the idea that people should do the work they get paid for and nothing more. So ultimately, it's an engagement issue. It's about setting boundaries for themselves. I'm going to underline that. Setting boundaries. I've seen the effect it has on the stakeholders, their mental capacity, and how it begins to erode their overall well-being. And some of the telltale signs of quiet quitting, by the way, are disengagement, performance only to a minimum, isolation, withdrawal from any non-necessary conversations, activities, or tasks, and also attendance at meetings. They're not speaking up, and they're not taking action. Yeah, I mean, that's a definitive issue today. There was a Gallup poll that came out this year, and it said that 59% of the world's employees, 59% are quiet quitting, and only 23% report as thriving at work. And this, from a cost standpoint, this cost the global economy $8.8 trillion. So there's a mental effect. There's a financial effect. There's a physical effect. You know, it obviously makes a difference. They, unfortunately, are showing trends of elevated stress. And the other thing they found in this research was that the stress levels were about equal whether the employee works remote, hybrid, or onsite. Because I hear some people say, well, it's going to hit the remote people because they are isolated. It's going to hit the onsite people because they don't want to be coming in. It's about equal, again, regardless of that. The other thing they found in this report, as a global report, that, unfortunately, the U.S. had the highest percent of daily stress. And we were tied with East Asia on that. And the highest percent of female employees experiencing high levels of stress. Very clearly, this is an issue, and the quiet quitting is certainly a problem. Another thing that came out recently, and this was a Harvard study that came out this year, talking about management skills that need to be improved. And I think these all can directly correlate to mental stress and anxiety in the workplace. Communication skills and style. This is a skill that's lacking. I would imagine anybody that's hearing this has worked with some manager who was not the best at communicating or their style was not very good either way. So we all have seen that in action. That is absolutely a skill that needs to be developed. Providing meaningful recognition for employee work and achievement. And this is something in HR that I have grappled with for a long time. Because I have worked with all kinds of different employee recognition programs. It is really difficult to find something that is ongoingly meaningful and fair across the board. Because you're going to have some people who recognize their departments constantly and others who never do. And some people who, you know, bring up their peers and others that don't. So it's really hard to get to the root of that and really recognize people as you'd like. Showing empathy. This is another skill that we have to develop. And this is something that, again, from an HR perspective, I think we need to do a better job with. Unfortunately, there's been so much litigation from an employee standpoint, employer, that managers are afraid to be empathetic. Because that may get them in trouble. And there are places where that could. So we need to figure out how to make that work better for everybody. This is another thing that I thought, to me, is interesting and absolutely can go to job satisfaction. Is delegating authority versus delegating tasks. And we've got to allow employees to make up their own, have some responsibilities of their own that we're not just feeding everything to them. So these are certainly some things I have found and that this study talks about that are lacking and need to be developed. This is a robust conversation and we could just keep going. Oh, absolutely. Thank you so much for your wisdom and your expertise. And I know that folks could go onto your website and find a lot of this detailed information and resources so they could reach out for help. But also if they're looking for, you know, an HR professional to give them some guidance. I can't think of a better person. I appreciate that. Yes. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you. I appreciate the conversation. And, again, hopefully this will help some individuals that need help get it. That's really the bottom line. Thanks, Barbara. Thank you. For more information about BAG Consulting and to learn more about the mental health and wellness resources, go to www.BAGHRConsulting.com. Here's some final actionable steps listeners can take to prioritize wellness. Number one, remember that there's no shame in asking for help. At some point, we all need guidance to get through the hard stuff. Be empathetic with yourself. Shame cannot survive with a healthy dose of empathy. Shame is a disconnect and it pulls us away from connection and throws us into isolation and fear. Author and writer Renee Brown defines shame as the intensely painful feeling or experience of believing we're flawed and, therefore, unworthy of love, belonging, and connection. Lean into those friends and trusted advisors whom you trust to share a bit about what's going on in your life. Get a different perspective and be open to it. Surround yourself with people who are supportive of you. And number two, be brave and courageous. Do what's right for you and ask for what you need. Don't avoid this. Don't dismiss it. It will not go away unless you take action. Reach out to your employer and find out what resources are available to you. Number three, it's okay to feel vulnerable. It's uncertainty, risk, and emotional exposure. Vulnerability is about showing up and being seen. Don't concern yourself with what others think they know about you. Number four, set boundaries. Remember, it's okay to say no. And if you're overwhelmed at work, it's okay to decline additional work. Number five, stress is a part of life. The further up the ladder you go, it's going to be more stressful. Create some quiet space and consider what's triggering the stress or anxiety. Identify it and acknowledge it. Don't run from it and don't try to mask it. Suppressing anxiety and stress does not help. So, for example, I might tell myself, this is a stressful situation. And by naming it, it helps me deal with it. And I follow up with, how can I manage it? Also, figure out what's causing the stress, burnout, or anxiety. And think about the action steps you can take. Or talk to someone professionally to find out how you can collaborate and what kind of remedies they might provide. And then finally, number six, practice wellness. Get active. Get outside. Do a great workout. Go for a run or a beautiful walk. Do some mindful meditation if that works for you. Fire up your favorite scented candle. Journal in the morning or more so in the evening before you go to bed. Get all that bullshit out of your head. And sleep well. Or even listening to your favorite tunes. That's it for this episode of Coachmama's Presents. If you're interested in being a guest or you're a subject matter expert, please go to my website, www.EpiphanyConsultingSolutions.com and submit your request on the Let's Chat link. You can also find me on my LinkedIn under Laura Perez Earhart or my website, EpiphanyConsultingSolutions.com. We hope the content and conversation will give sparks of inspiration. If you love the show and learn from it, pay forward and share my podcast with your colleagues and friends. I'm Laura Perez Earhart. Until next time, stay safe and live well.