episode 6 season 2

The conversation revolves around the topic of control, particularly the struggle for men to relinquish control. The speakers discuss societal expectations and the pressure on men to be in control. They also touch on the importance of vulnerability in relationships and the role of a helpmate. The conversation highlights the need for men to turn to God and trust in Him rather than seeking control through other means. The speakers also discuss the consequences of trying to control everything and the importance of maturity and self-reflection. Overall, the conversation explores the complexities of control and the importance of surrendering control to God. In the famous words of Nate, what it do, what it do, word of mouth, Nate and Shelby, yo, we've been talking about control. Janet Jackson's song. I actually can hear it now in my head. Control. What's the lyrics? Yeah, what's the lyrics? Control. Wow. Anyways, so we're going to go back to our chat, and I believe that when we ended it, I asked Mr. Nathan the question of, is it harder for men to relinquish control? Hmm. All right. Fellas, I'm going to tell the truth. Uh-oh. To answer that question, yes. It's very, very hard for men to give up control because we are either told or someone has mentioned or someone has, maybe we're taught in school that men are in control. We have the control. I'm not going to use the word authority as of yet because I didn't learn that until later, but we have the control over everything. We were made first. It's us. Well, he did give you dominion. Yes. Yes. We have power. We have dominion over everything. Dang, you men. You just got it going on. Man, we thought, hey, we got control, so is it hard to give up that control? Yes, until you learn how to humble yourself. I was going to say, where does the ego come into that? Well, I mean, I think it's branded in us because of what we see. Even with cartoons, I mean, it's the male thing. If you're not in control, you're a wimp. I remember times we would play games like you had to pick a team, whether it was, you know, playing basketball or whatever, you just had to pick a team. I wanted to be the person that was picking. Well, of course you did because then you get to control who's on your team. Boom. I was always the last one picked. I just wanted to be like one or, you know, two or three if I could be, but I was always the last one. Oh my God. But I guess because in our mindset, we were told that if you don't have the, if you're not the person that's picking, you're less than. For a man, in which everybody don't have the same gifts. No. Everybody don't have the same talent. No, that's why we're a body. Absolutely. Can I just mention this about the church? I think the church got that twisted as well because we think that every church has to teach the same thing. That is not true. What's the purpose of the body? Well, it's just like every preacher has to preach the same way. No, they don't. That's what I'm saying. Some are brimstone and hellfire because that's what their people need to hear and some are the love of Christ and some are all kinds of a mess, but anyway. But I think that we get that so mixed up and we think that everybody has to have this certain way and that's not true. No. How do you reach everyone? If you're supposed to reach everyone and preach to everyone, how are you going to do that if we're all cookie cutter? Preaching the same thing. Thank you. Thank you for saying that. That part is, that's a whole nother really, really, really touchy conversation when it comes to how people perceive the preaching or how they ought to be taught. There are certain people that are called to the healing ministry. There are certain people that need teaching because they're babes and they start at the beginning. There are mature people that are already on milk and they need meat. There are some people that are all about worship. That's why we're a body because we all need the members, the individual members. With wanting that control as a man, I realized that I don't have to be the one in charge and I can accept authority now no matter who it is. That's a hard conversation to talk about too because a lot of men don't want to accept authority from a woman. He just said that. He just said that. I don't want to touch that one on this one, but we're going to circle around to that one because we had that conversation before and we're going to circle back around to that. Let's go back to a conversation we had earlier today when we were off mic about control, about men having a struggle with that, and about in a relationship or in a household how difficult, well everyday, everyday life, how difficult is it for men to give things up to God and relinquish the control? For men, I think we see with blinders on. If it's not happening right in front of us, everything is taking too long, so we're just doing it ourselves. If we lose control in that, then we feel like we're less than. Now we're either in shambles or we're chaotic, we're confused because now we don't know what to do because all hell has broke loose. We fall into a desperate state. Man, I'm sorry. Forgive me, but I'm going to tell the truth. We fall into a desperate state, and then we just start doing any and everything because now we're desperate. Because you're grasping at straws. Yeah. Panic. Very, very much so. We're panicking. We're freaking out. We're like, I don't have any control of my house no more. I don't have anything. Nothing is happening the way I want it to happen. Then we just go into a panic, and eventually that leads to something. Well, in my perspective, that would be humbling, and that would be God trying to tell you, excuse me, sir, I'm here. I don't want to have to humble you, but you're putting all the onus on yourself, and it should be with me. You would think that we would turn that way and want to hear God. Guess what way we turn? Opposite. And we go either to the bottle, we go to drugs. Island. We go to the island. All the above. Everything. We reach out to everything else instead of turning to God and saying, hey, I need you. Well, and not only that, but this also goes back to what we also talked about, that the help mate was designed to be the help mate. And if you, as a man, are getting crushed in spirit and having all of these things that are piling up on you, you have a help mate who you are supposed to be able to entrust with all of those things so that you can release them and get them off of your shoulders. Say that word one more time. Release. Help. Oh, help mate. Yes. Now, like we talked about earlier, that help mate has to be worthy and able. To help. To be trusted. Yeah. Absolutely. And allow your vulnerability. Well, I'm going to allow that back to you now since you're pulling it out. Go for it. I'm ready. All right. So, men, so we accept that sometimes we turn the opposite way and instead of saying, God, we need you to direct, to put us on track. Wait, is that because you feel it's weak? Yes. Okay. Absolutely. I just, because we said that earlier and I just want to, that's what we're talking about. Anyways, I didn't want to interrupt your thought. No, I'm glad you said it because we do. And when we, when we get an inkling of weakness, you know what men do? Thank you for that gesture. They didn't see it. I know. But yes, that's exactly what we do. Curl up in a ball. Or we go hide up under a rock and I can give a number of scriptures of some great men in the Bible that did exactly that. We curl up. Elijah. Yeah. We curl up and run and go hide. My God. But at the end of the day, if we decide or if we make the right choice and turn to God and say, God, we need, as men, we need you. God will remind us. I gave you a help. And this is in our household now. Yes. Because we didn't already ask you and the kids out. Well, this is if you, if you have a household, if you're single, then yes, you have to rely on God and God. Yes. I mean, you should regardless, but he should be your first go to. Amen. But we turn out the other way and go to everything else. But once we at least go to God and he reminds us of who we are, then he'll let us know that's why I created that for you. Now, here's the lob over to you. That beautiful creation that he designed for us. What happens when they're not help and they're a hindrance? He just threw that like a grenade at me. Well, it's not a good thing. And I think, you know, there are obviously women out there who have salty reasons for doing things they do. It's just I really don't know how to answer that because I can't. I would like to think that people are going to be honest and authentic in their relationships, but I really know they're not for the most part, which sucks and it goes both ways. But I think it's so very important. And I've said this before, that if you truly love the man you're with and if you truly want to honor the man you're with and respect the man you're with, then whatever vulnerabilities he shows you are yours and yours alone. And those don't go outside of that relationship. My God, I would ask you to repeat it, but I'm going to go back and listen to this myself. Because if you, I mean, they have to be able to entrust you with everything. If you want them to bare their soul to you and truly let their soft underbelly show. Their guard down. Yeah. Then they have to be able to rely on the fact that that's going to stay within the two of you and it's not going to go any further. Don't you think? From a male perspective, if I let my guard down and you catch me while I'm in that vulnerable state and you tear that state apart. Oh, you're ruining the whole thing. It's so hard to let my guard down again. Yeah, you've undermined everything. Yeah. Right. And I think it's difficult for women because as women, speak for myself, we're social. And so when we have issues, like we like to go to our girlfriends or whatever and be like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. What do you think? You know, get their perspective. I don't think men work that way. No. And I think that's what we have to understand is there's a difference there. And so when they're exposing themselves, if they're exposing their soft underbelly to you, it's not so that you can go ask Peggy Sue what her opinion is on it. It's just because that's their way of getting it off of their shoulders and releasing that. I agree. But you know what? And I said no to something. I think that men should be able to do the same thing as women when it comes to having that vulnerable group. Troubles with other people? Yeah. Comradery? Why can't I talk today? Camaraderie. Oh, thank you. That vulnerable state with other men because we really can relate to one another. I was in a Bible study a couple of weeks ago just talking to guys, and we were all saying the same exact thing. But why? Why don't you guys do that, though? Why isn't that like a normal thing? This goes back to season one because we're sizing up. Well, stop it. I wish. That's easier said than done, and it sounded so great when it came from you. It was just beautiful. It really don't happen that way for us. We tend to size up all the time, and we make the mistake of thinking that we have to either be like that person or be better. Or better, yeah. And it tears up the mental of a man because now we're competing. Or now we're, you know. It just makes it worse. Having a person, a partner, the helpmate aspect to really let your guard down with and be vulnerable enough and they don't rip you apart. When the opposite sex rips us apart, that messes it up, man. I'll be honest. It really tears it apart. Yeah. I'll use me for an example. I've already had a complex when it comes to other men because men are thinking, you know, either this or that. I have a great personality, so I had friends to say, and I'll go on record and say this. I had friends to say, man, I don't like when you come around because everybody loves your personality. Gravitates towards you. Everybody gravitates towards you, and I'm jealous of it or I'm envious of it because you have something that I don't have. I want it, but I don't have it. I'm like, man, but you have what? Such and such, yeah. Yeah, and I don't look at it as though it's a competition, but then I lose friends because they don't want to hang out with me because I'm the cool guy. But that's on them, too. I mean, and that goes back to realizing that we all bring something to the table, that we're all part of the body. Yes. And we all serve an equally important role. We all have a purpose. We all have a calling. We all have all of that, and just because it doesn't measure up to or it doesn't look the same as someone else's doesn't mean it's any less. I agree. I agree. I know I'm not the only one. And I think society programs us to. Especially men. To do that, to separate and divide. Especially men. As you said that earlier, just about men, is it harder? Yes, that's why. We've been programmed as kids. If you don't measure up, if you don't, you know. Previous marriage I was in. This was my first marriage. Uh-oh. I was told by my spouse that if I wasn't like her dad, I was less than a man. Wow. At that early age, I had to do everything exactly like him or better. Wow. To be a man. Wow. That's a heavy load there. Yeah. Yeah. And that was pretty bold of her. You think? Wow. You think? Thank God for transparency that I can say it out loud. I look back on that time, and I'm like, man, what the hell? Put on his pants the way I do? Uh-huh. Ain't no different than him and me? But I thought that because she said it, the way she viewed me, if I don't measure up to him, then she's not going to view me even as a man. That tells me that she didn't love you for who you were. Boom, boom. I get it now. Oh. I didn't get it then. I don't like that. But women have the capability to snatch vulnerability from a man, and it can create their entire future if they don't face it, like if men don't face that thing. If I didn't face that years later, I would still think the same thing today. I would try to become him every day, and I would think that, well, man, if I ain't got to that status, whether it's physical, financial, definitely not spiritual, all these other things, then I'm not a man. I think women have that to a certain degree, but I don't think that it's at the core of our existence. The only thing that we compare you all to is our moms. Okay, well, yeah, there are some men, though, that are, they ain't no one like their mama. And they could say the same thing to a woman that your ex said to you. Yeah, that's true. You're right. That is true. And how would that make a woman feel, though? I feel like y'all are going to say, okay, I ain't your mama, and I ain't trying to be. Some will, but it depends on the strength of the woman and her character, because some will say that, but some will just suck up and try and emulate. Tell that dude to go be with his mama. I know, but did someone tell you that when you were young? There are some lessons we have to learn by living. And it hurts, and it sucks. It does. It does. You're right. Looking at it from both ways, you're right. And a man listening could say, well, Nate, why didn't you just tell her to go be with dad? At that time, I didn't know how to. I thought that he was the epitome of a man. There's a lot of learning that goes into our whole life. You know, every day is a journey, and every day is part of our journey, and every day you can learn something new and figure stuff out about yourself. Like I said, the self-help tour of Shelby has been going on for about three years now. The tour, though. Yeah, the tour. So, y'all, sorry, you just have to take a little ride on the train with me. But, yeah, you know, maturity plays a big part in a lot of things, figuring a lot of stuff out. Oh, yeah. And it creates, maturity creates a better perspective. When you said control today, I think a lot of my control as I was, especially as a young man, I felt like I had to have control because if I didn't, I wasn't like him. I wasn't, you know, this person or that person. I just didn't want to lose control. You didn't want to lose the appearance of control because it would make you look like you were less than. Say that again. Because none of us have control over things. We just think we do. And I'm talking to myself. Oh, you're talking to me, too. We just think we have control. We ain't got no control. We have control of certain things, little things, but we have control of ourselves. How I look at it, and I have to be honest with myself, I said, Nate, today's Tuesday. Wednesday's going to come whether you like it or not. That means you have no control. It's going to come. So you still got to get up and make it happen or do what you got to do. Yeah. God does. If we allow him to. I guess that. And can I say that, you know, and I think I've kind of spoke on this before. I think that, you know, God knows everything and he knows we're going to get in the way. And he diverts plans around us. But we can postpone blessings because we're trying to control things. And, you know, I postponed a lot in my life thinking I was doing the right thing. But I was controlling everything. When you look back on that, how does that make you feel today? Stupid. I wasn't expecting that. Wow. Well, it kind of gives you some regret, you know. Yeah. And you think, well, what would life have been like if I had gotten out of the way? Well, can you also look at it as a lesson? Oh, absolutely. I wouldn't be who I am today. That. Yeah. And, you know, God does all things for the good. Yes. All. All. All things. The key word is all. That means the grief, the loss, the divorce, the cancer, the sickness, whatever. He does all things. He turns all things for the good. And I know that's hard for people to wrap their heads around when they're in the middle of the not good thing. That is hard. That is hard when you look at really, really terrible things that you've been through in life. It is hard. But all things do work together for the good of them that love the Lord and are called according to his purpose. I know that's a touchy sentence. But when you expound upon that, that means everybody don't fit in that. Because it says of them that love the Lord and are called according to his purpose. Everybody don't fit in the of them. That love the Lord. Right. And are called according to his purpose. I think the love the Lord is the most important part. Yeah. Amen. Because if you love the Lord, you're called. According to his purpose. Yes. You just need to love the Lord. That's the important part. Please. And that goes back to what we're talking about with control and self-sufficiency. If you really love the Lord, wouldn't you be submitting that to him? One hundred percent. The very first thing we said when we were off mic, I shared it with Shelby. It's kind of hard having two people in the driver's seat. Because everybody wants to steer. Everybody wants to take the wheel. Yeah. It's kind of hard to... I mean, especially to adults. I can see you putting your kid in your lap and be like, okay, turn this way, turn that way. But you still have one person that's controlling the pedal. So they can stop. You can still be turning the wheel, but they can stop. I think we're old enough now. Jesus, take the wheel. There it is. I should get you to sing that. Jesus. Man. So I can say today was uncomfortable talking about, especially with control, because it allowed me to think of things that I still have a full grip on and not giving God any leeway to touch. Because I want to control this. This, I'm doing it myself. This is me. Yeah. This is just me. And yeah, it's time to relinquish that. Well, I think what you said earlier about God's timing, it makes it so difficult to not take control of something. You know, kind of like Sarah. Oh, come on. And she was a woman. She was not a man. And if she's going to take any control, she's going to have a kid. They won't have a kid. Look, might not call them her. Yep. But God said we're going to, and I'm going to. We're going to do this my way. It didn't work out real well. Yeah. Yeah. That's an Old Testament for all you know. But that's a really good scenario to talk, especially when it comes to women, because are you all impatient? I have to check the time because Shelby can go there. Are we all impatient? How about just people? Oh, you think people are impatient? Yes. I think all just cross the board. I think that's part of our humanity. That's part of our flesh issue. I agree. I think it's cross the board. For now, women might be a little more so. I don't know. I am not patient. I say 60, 40. Maybe 70, 30. I had someone tell me I'm patient the other day, but I don't think I'm patient. You're patient? I had someone tell me that the other day, but I don't think I am. I think you're patient. Do you really? On certain levels. Certain things. Yeah. Yeah. I've heard you're impatient before. You'd be saying something and I'd be like, Shelby, just wait. In my head. You've said it out loud, too. You have said, Shelby, just chill. I'm like, I promise you it'll be okay tomorrow. I know. That's why I don't think I'm patient. It's only in certain things. If you focus on, I would say in business, you're probably not impatient. No. In ministry, you are. In ministry, you definitely are. I mean, we work together in the place. Well, not work. We minister together in a place that I see you're patient all the time. Business? No, no, no, no. I experienced that. Affairs of the heart? No, no, no, no, no. That's a whole other level. But even like dealing with people, I don't think I'm patient. I don't think I have patience. I think you do. Y'all must see something different. You're heart driven. It doesn't matter. I get snappy. I have pettiness all in here. I'm pretty damn good at being petty. But because you're heart driven, your patience is because you're passionate. Like you're like, yeah, I hear you, but God got something better for you. So shut up and let's do this. But that's the passion that you have because you know that God is going to do it. So when you're talking to people and you're like, okay, you're listening to their, oh, woe is me story, you're like, oh, okay. But God is going to do it. Yeah, I think you're super patient. I am. I saw it in real life the other day. I am. I am. I am. I am. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't, I really, you think that at 60-40, women are less impatient, are less patient than men. Yes. And you would say that it's the other way around because you all bore children. But I think that's what makes you more impatient because you all can have children. Elsie, I think it's the opposite. I think that we're raising these kids that drive us absolutely crazy some days and men couldn't do it. No, I mean, I agree with that. You're right. We can't. I'm not saying you can't. I mean, don't come at me. I'm not saying you can't. You can, but. In certain aspects. I had a situation where I was watching the kids one day and they were younger and they were just kind of, you know, doing whatever. And I was sitting on the couch watching the game, like, chilling, like, I mean, everything was good. Then my mom walked in the house and she freaked out. And I'm like, man, chill. It's all good. We're just hanging out, boxing up in a minute. Yeah, I've been that woman before. So, in wrapping this up. And we didn't even touch self-sufficiency. We didn't. We might have to do partly. Yes, we do. I would say, and thank you for asking that question earlier. Is it harder for men to give up control? Yeah. But we have to learn that God needs to be in the forefront. And we're not talking about human. Like, we're not talking about giving up control according to the world. Like, we're talking about relinquishing to God these things. We're not saying that you have to give control to the women or anything like that or your co-worker or whatever. Well, that's why I wanted to clarify. Okay. Like, we're just talking about giving control to God. Yeah. And letting him have it. We're not talking about the other way around. Yeah. Because that can turn bad. Yeah. Very bad. Not the design. Yeah. Yeah. Man, we've talked about that before, so. Yeah. We're probably going to do a part three on a particular added to control is self-sufficiency. So, we'll probably come back here in just a minute to add to this. So, word of mouth. Name's Shelby. See you in a minute. Love ya. Bye. Bye. Bye.