Midterm PODCAST

A group of seniors from Carroll College discuss the importance of ethics and etiquette in golfing and fishing. They talk about how learning from experienced individuals and following unwritten rules can greatly impact one's ability to play the sports correctly. They also discuss the different views and seriousness people have towards the sports and how it can affect the enjoyment of the game. The group shares personal experiences and examples of etiquette on the golf course, such as not walking in front of someone's line and letting others pass. They emphasize the need for flexibility and understanding in these sports. Alrighty, we're live. What's up, everyone? Coming to you from the Carroll College podcast recording room, St. Charles 2023. Let's go ahead and start off with some introductions. I am Jake, senior. Yeah. Next. I am Tucker Jones. I am also a senior. I'm Garrett Worden. I'm also a senior. Connor Quinn, also a senior. It's a bunch of seniors. It could be something like a capstone project here just doing podcasts. Yeah, so today we just kind of wanted to talk to you guys a little bit about ethics and etiquette when it comes to golfing and fishing and then kind of how we kind of learned how to golf and fish and how like the credibility and the ethos of golfing with someone that actually is trustworthy in the sport as well as fishing with someone that actually knows what they're doing has like a huge impact on how you're going to learn and if you know how to golf or fish correctly. Yeah. Yeah. And I think it's not even just like the correctness aspect either. I think it's just like kind of the unwritten rules. We talked about this is like unwritten rules of what it's supposed to do, what you're supposed to do and what you're not supposed to do. And that all comes down to who you're with. I feel like like if we start on golfing, Garrett, you talked about your grandpa golfing with your grandpa. And I feel like that same thing, like if you enter into a tournament with four guys, like the credibility of those guys you're going to be in the tournament with, like you're going to show up and you're going to be dressed properly. You're going to follow proper game rules, etiquette and just kind of like all the little things. And we'll go more into that. But, Garrett, why don't you touch on a little bit what you think or what you've learned in etiquette wise from your experiences golfing? Yeah. My grandpa has been golfing his whole life and he taught me at very young. I wasn't very good at golfing. I kind of just wanted to get it with him. And he taught me from a young age, just stuff like he's very against golf carts, like he will never buy a golf cart no matter where he goes in the world for golfing. He'll walk everywhere. He it's like when you're putting like the line of sight, you're like a line. I walk. We were golfing with another double and I just was young. I just walked in front of it and I will never forget how mad he got me because I stepped in front of his line. And ever since then, no matter who I'm playing with, I will never walk in front of someone's line. I'll always walk around. Yeah. It's just a bunch of little stuff that you wouldn't learn from people that don't know the sport that kind of eat those part. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. One thing that I think is kind of interesting about that is it really depends on who you're with and how they kind of view the sport. You know, you got people that are super take it super seriously and will actually get mad on the course. Whereas I kind of like to have fun. Yeah. Yeah. I agree. And so, yeah, I don't know. You can just get two very different aspects from just depending on who you're with. Yeah. Like I think that kind of changes the enjoyment of the game. Like I think golf's very fun, but I did not like to take it that serious where I actually get upset a lot. I like to just be very relaxed. So kind of take those unspoken rules. So other people in the golf course don't get upset on there. But also I'm not taking every shot so serious or every everything. All those unspoken rules so serious. Yeah. I think it's also based on location to like you go to Bill Roberts for like I'm going to drink some beers. We're going to have a good time. But if I get like I went in the summer and played a quarter lane and it was like very to the T. Everybody was like wearing a collared shirt. Like no one was talking on the course, especially as like not only like another thing, like no talking on the box, like the whole entire course is quiet. And so like stuff like that. And I wasn't even golfing with a serious person. I was just I was golfing with my girlfriend. Yeah. And so it's like I think it's based on location. You kind of learn. I mean, you show up and you kind of get the feel. You can you can tell when you're like Bill Roberts, you can golf and cut off and get some dirty looks. But yeah, I actually had a weird experience with that with location this summer. I didn't really realize that that was like a thing. I just thought it was kind of universal. Whatever. I mean, obviously, there's going to be nicer courses compared to some other courses. But this summer I was golfing at a private country club in Boise. And these two probably like younger teenagers, maybe like 16 or so. And they were with two girls and they took off in front of us. And the girls weren't wearing like those cut off like shirts. It's like supposedly what you're supposed to wear as a woman when you're golfing. And all of a sudden I see the the pro hop in a cart and just rip after him down the fairway. And he grabbed him and just kicked him off the course right in front of me. That's the thing. Yeah, that's a crazy rule. Yeah. It's also I feel like with golf, with a lot of stuff, I feel it's kind of got changed with the times, which I feel like kind of golf is kind of behind where you got to change with everything else. It's just I feel like there's so many golfers out there that are just angry old people that get mad at young people trying to come play, taking a little more loosely and they just get upset and it kind of just ruins golf for everyone. I'm just like, fuck, I don't want to. Yeah, go where a bunch of old dealers don't look at me bad and give me dirty ass looks. One one person that I think that is very credible. Also, like demonstrates goodwill towards the overall golf community would be Rex. Yeah, like he's a on the golf team. He's very good golfer, very successful golfer. And he does everything by the books like he only walks. He plays. He does all the little things right. But when it comes down to golfing with a group of guys that you're with, like you can still have fun within aspect of the game without being overly to the T and making it so serious that nobody's enjoying it. I don't know. I think that's something that is essential and almost everything where there's examples. But there's it's not a tight written rule. I feel like there should be some leeway. And so, yeah, because I think all of us have golf together and it's I mean, I've noticed I'm not the the best golfer. It's new to me, but like like the putting rule, like walking like in front of someone's line is I didn't learn that until I think last summer. And then it wasn't even that someone told me. I just I remember seeing a video of it and I didn't understand what the person did wrong and then just like noticing it. And I was like, oh, like that's not supposed to do that. But yeah, you can. I mean, we definitely have fun when we go out there, but you can still like we don't talk when we're on the tee box. I mean, every now and then. But yeah, I feel like you pick up little things each time going with somebody that is like exhibiting these characteristics, like Rex, for example, I just thought of this rear golfing and you have you put like chip on the green. You it was pretty rainy that day. Lay down a chip where your ball is. Drive off. Set your ball down. So one thing that I learned is like once you put your chip down, pick up your ball, put your set your ball, set your line or whatever. If you want to move that ball again, you have to set your chip down. So like that chip has to stay there no matter whether if you just rotate your line just for placement of the ball. So I was like one thing that I like I set my chip down because we were playing it. We were playing pretty serious game. I think we had money down and I like wrote to pick set my chip down, put my ball down. And I was like, I want to change my line a little bit, rotated it and didn't put an after pick up and I was like, oh, what the hell are you doing? I was like, yeah, I've always found, you know, like putting your ball marker down and then picking it up. It's kind of, I wouldn't say it's something that I do very often. Like I'll really only do it unless I'm directly in like the putt line of someone that I'm playing with. But another thing is there's some people that'll get, you know, mad if you don't pick it up like anywhere on the green, no matter where you're at. Like I was golfing with Rex one time actually, me, Rex, John, and then this other single, he was a older guy that hopped on with us and my ball was nowhere near like his line to the hole, like anything like that. And he was like, hey, can you pick your ball up? And I have a ball marker on me, it was in my bag and I was like, I don't need it. So I like run back to my bag and it's just like, come on. I feel like another etiquette thing that's like a really big thing that I run into every time on the golf course is letting people pass. Like there's, I don't know what there needs to be in like some sort of rule where if you're, I don't even know how you manage that shit, but if you're like holding people up or, I don't know, you'll get two like older guys that are walking that will not let you pass. It's like, oh, this is my tee time, this is my time in line, I'm just gonna golf and that's gonna take you however long, no matter how long it takes us. That's one of my bigger pet peeves about golf actually, is just let people pass or people pushing up behind you and getting balls hit like next to your fucking head. Yeah, it was like, ugh. Another thing is there's times when like there's a difference between you're playing up right on someone and they're like, oh, you can go ahead and pass, but then the people that are in front of them are right there as well. Like I feel like if you're gonna let someone pass, there should be no one in front of you. Like that's one thing that pisses me off because now it just created like an even bigger traffic jam because now they're waiting for me to finish up the hole so I can go tee off in front of them while the person behind me is catching up and I have to tee off with this other group watching me. Yeah, I hate, I will not actually tee off in front of another person because every time it's a shit show and I'm just like, I'll just drop the ball and throw it up there. Yeah, but there's actually been games, there was a game this summer me and my brother were playing. We got behind this group of old ladies, like three or four of them, and they were so slow and we were like playing right up on them, you know, so maybe they would get the memo and like three or four holes went by and we were like, all right, let's call it. And so I just hopped up on the tee box and they were still like on the fairway and I just smacked a ball and it lands probably like 10 or 15 feet from one of them and we just drove up, picked up my ball and we just left. There's no way you should be golfing 18 for over, I mean, three hours, most of the time it takes like four. Yeah, but like on like a pretty slow day. Yeah, but like if you guys are going and what it comes down to is the pro, I'm pretty sure the pro is meant to keep pace, which is something that I really never see them do. Yeah, well and I feel like there's two different ways to respond. Like we were on 18, or not 18, 9 at Bill Roberts by the pond, headed back to the clubhouse and Colin is up on the tee box. There's like a little swell and we thought they were in front of us because we've been playing behind them all day and just like kind of like good pace, like nothing too slow and they like went down through and we teed off and Colin hits a nuke down the middle and we see it bounce and it bounces over their cart. They're like down in the swell hitting when he is teeing off and the cart comes up and it hits the ground and bounces over. We like ride down there and one guy's like, what the hell are you doing? He's like, sorry, like we actually didn't see you. Like we've been playing pretty like, I don't know, good pace with you guys the whole time. I haven't had any issues and the other guy's like, holy shit, that was your drive? That was like 350 yards. So, I don't know. It's all about how you respond. So, however you go. A little bit into fishing. Yeah, a little bit into fishing. I can kind of start that off. So, I feel I run into a lot of the whole ethical side of when you're fishing, being on the river every day in the summer, you see some weird shit. Fun floaters. Fun floaters. And that's the thing. People floating. Oh, just like tubers floating down. Flamingos. Or even amoebas with tubes. It's like, there's a common courtesy of giving people space whether you're working or not working. I feel like guides know that a little bit better than people that are within the industry. Give people their room. They may be pushing through, rerowing an area. There's a whole river. You're floating. You're going to cover a lot of water. So, I understand how people get pissed where it's like, alright, this guy's been on my ass all day floating. I understand that. It can get frustrating, but at the same point, let them pass. It's the same thing as golfing. If you're going to be that slow and want to take your time and enjoy it, let other people pass. I go down the river and I cover twice as much water as everybody else does in a full day fishing, but I only fish certain spots. So, it's like I'm sitting there log jammed behind a 50-year-old guide that's rowing through every hole bobber fishing. It's like, I only want to fish dry fly holes. Let me go past. If you guys want to touch a little bit on wade fishing, I feel like that's another big one. I feel like this summer, well, just continue about floating. When I'm learning to row, there's a couple times I felt really fucking bad. I would just destroy someone's hole that they're just sitting out trying to hit. I'm just learning how to fucking row and I can't get away. I've done that a couple of times where I felt really bad. I knew I was doing something bad. I just had no way to control it or stop it. I've heard this story from Connor. He was glaring at me and I was like, dude, I'm sorry. This is my second time on the river. I really didn't mean to do that, but I didn't know where else to go. He was like, dude, I'm sorry. This is my second time on the river. I really didn't mean to do that, but I didn't know where else to go. He was pretty understanding. The dirty look kind of went away and he was like, oh, it's all right, man. Don't worry about it. I feel like that's what it comes down to is communication. If you're going down the middle of the river full speed and you don't know how to row, you don't know what the hell's going on, and you come up to a guy wade fishing or even another boat and be like, hey, coming up behind you or whatever, pretty new to this, forgive me a little bit. I might fuck this up a little bit. That goes for wade fishing. You come up on a guy fishing a hole and you don't know if people are out there. It's like coming up and being like, hey, where are you headed? Where are you going? That gives you a sense of credibility where you're taking responsibility of what you're doing and your actions. It's not like you just blow by a guy and fish right above him. He's been working that stretch up. I don't know. I feel like that's where you get into those verbal arguments. It's like the wade fishing. Every time I try to go out and you look at an access point, if there's a car there, I will go to the exact opposite place because I get a little upset when you have a small access and someone just parks right behind you and hops in the same river and fishes the same spot. I'm like, dude, there's so many other places you can go. When I try to have an option to go somewhere different from someone else, I definitely try to take that. One thing back to the floating in boats that drives me nuts, and I know I've heard you talk about it before. You were talking about letting people pass, but what drives me absolutely insane when you're floating down the river and someone's anchored up on a hole, so you go past them. As soon as you go past them, they lift the anchor up, front row past you and go low hole you. You just keep doing it the whole time. That's like the epitome of the Missouri River. There'll be people anchored up. It's a different etiquette on each river. I've guided on a lot of rivers in western Montana. I'd say the Bitterroot's probably the best one etiquette wise where you pass somebody and it's not a super busy section. You're rowing until you're out of sight before you start fishing. I'm just kind of used to that. This spring on the Mo, I was anchored up on the inside corner. We were doing pretty good, just pulling fish out. I was with clients and boat after boat floating, bobber by bobber. I was on the inside and they were on the outside and they were just fishing the same seam all the way down. Just packed with boats. I think we kind of covered everything that we wanted to talk about on the ethical aspect. Is there anything else you guys kind of want to conclude with, kind of tying that into ethics and etiquette? I think we covered everything we wanted to cover. We covered in class. I think it was good. I agree. Just to touch on the ethos again and kind of how that just connected. We were pretty much just talking about etiquette the whole time, but going back to that knowledge of the subject. We're all not pro golfers here, but we've definitely golfed before and know a thing or two. When it comes to the fishing, we probably have definitely some very, very experienced fly fishermen in here. Other than that, thanks for tuning in. Catch you in the next one. Later.