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Talk: 19890607-Larry_Rosenberg-UNK-come_what_may_seeing_come_what_may_doing-1569 Leandra Tejedor (1).json Start_time: 01:11:35 Display_question: It seems that the anger should diminish through this watching, it doesn't seem like I should just be going around angry at them all the time? Keyword_search: frustration, interpersonal relationships, irritability, anger, suffering, samadhi, unbiased, mindfulness Question_content: Questioner: I just especially related throughout, how you said, whenever we come up against the frustration, or something that's bothering us, that's a limitation. That's where the limitation is. So, the idea is to develop… to me the way I saw that right, is to develop this mind, right, which can go around and sort of get beyond that frustration. It's very difficult. Especially in the very beginning. Larry: How do we do that? How does this practice help us do that? You're right. It's exactly it. Questioner: Well, I mean…I imagine you start with, if you do this, and watch that, and then go to some harder things, and watch those. Larry: Before we move on, can you give me a particular example. In other words, you said you could relate to it. Does something specific come up, for you? Questioner: For instance, I have problems with people that I live with. Problems, you know, I mean, my own, in my own life, you know, I immediately thought of several sort of difficult interpersonal relationships that I had causing me frustration. And I like sort of the ability to say, okay, that's a place where you're very limited. Why don't you just sort of open up, and get spacious, to go beyond this frustration. Larry: Okay. To connect what was said, to what you're saying, is to allow that, let's say if it's irritability. I'm just whatever…it doesn't really matter, to allow that irritability to be the way it is. See, it's not that we now have a new ideal that we try. I'm going to be a person who's not irritated. The spaciousness enables irritability to be there. And for us to understand, this is the way it is. This is the way a person feels when they're irritated. The starting point for it, is to get in touch with irritability, in a way that allows it to be just, what it is. It's no more than or no less. It's just what it is. It's irritability. Good. Let's find out what that problem is. Questioner: The problem is, okay, look, for some psychobiography, I can be a very angry guy. And so, to go around angry all the time, is a real drag. I mean, it seems to me that I should be able at a variety of points, sort of like, diminish the anger. Larry: May I intervene? So, anger is no good. Questioner: Pardon? Larry: Anger is no good. Questioner: So, it seems that it should diminish through this watching, I mean, it doesn't seem like I should just be going around angry at them all the time. That’s what my problem is. Larry: Yes, okay. But what I'm trying to get at, is that I think common sense would have that starting point. In other words, what am I going to do to get rid of the anger? Now, the truth is, the best way for your anger, or irritability, or what have you, to begin to fall away is, for you to learn how to begin to allow it, to be there. Step number one, it's not for you to act it out. We're not saying that. Step number one is, for you to feel what it's like to be angry. See, come what may seeing, has to do with… remember all some of the things that were mentioned. It's unbiased. So that can you get in touch, and allow that anger, to be just what it is? Now, most people quit before that. They act out because they don't like the feeling, of what it's like, to be angry. Break_line: First of all, it's extremely unpleasant. Now, part of how anger starts to lose its power is, we begin to see that we're suffering when we're angry. See, but it's not an intellectual thing. You've got to really dig it out of the marrow, of your own bones. At any rate, what's being said here, you don't have to agree with it, but the application of the practice. Step number one is, to learn how to be with so many of these states that we really don't want to be with. I'm not saying be angry forever. I agree with you. The way to come through, to go beyond anger is through it, in this teaching. And for most of us, we want to say goodbye, to these very unpleasant states, but we don't want to say hello. And unfortunately, you have to say hello, before you can say goodbye. And so, it's the hello part that's difficult, for all of us. So, can you say hello to anger, or irritability? Do you see what I'm getting at? Break_line: Can you learn to feel what that is when it's there. Anyway, try it. But that's what I've been saying, that's what I've been talking about. It's learning how to experience things as they are. That's the starting point. You may act in one way or another, you may have to protect yourself, you may have to tell someone exactly how you feel. But the starting point is, especially if it's in sitting, then there's no one else in it. You're sitting and you're feeling it. The starting point is to learn how to get comfortable with every conceivable state of consciousness that's possible. That's where the unbiased thing is. Because we have a lot of biases. We only want certain things to visit us. And this one you have to open your heart, so that whatever visits consciousness, is welcome. Break_line: That's why it's not so easy, because we shut down. Oh, I don't mind this, but I don't want this. And again, the practice, the unfolding of the practice, is more and more developing the capacity to do just what I'm saying. It's not like you do it overnight, all at once. It’s that you keep seeing how much you're intimidated, and tyrannized, by particular emotional states, and that we don't deal with them as a result, because we don't like to feel uncomfortable. And the practice is learning how to be with, what most people don't want to be with. Break_line: Now, I have to add to that. We don't have time to bring all the other factors. Let's just add one factor. Supposing there's strong samadhi. Those of you who are new, samadhi is a stability of mind, a concentration of mind. Let's say you're feeling irritable or angry. If there's not much samadhi in the mind, and you attempt to do what was just suggested here, to open to it, probably at the beginning you'll be overrun by the anger, because it's much stronger than… the mindfulness doesn't have the strength of samadhi, in back of it. And so, for those of you who at times may wonder why you spend hours just following the breath, or just doing the walking meditation, some of that, since it doesn't seem to be working on wisdom directly. Some of that is to prepare the mind, to make it fit, so that when it looks at a difficult state like irritability, or anger, it can just experience anger. Not try to make it less, not try to make it more, but allow it as a natural phenomenon, to fully register. End_time: 01:19:23
