Ep 2: Small Talk

The speakers discuss the concept of small talk and its role in social interactions. They mention that small talk is often used to establish connections between people and fill spaces in conversations. They also discuss the importance of small talk in maintaining positive face and avoiding abrupt conversation endings. The speakers touch on the idea that couples in intimate relationships may have less need for small talk as they are more comfortable with each other. They briefly mention static expressions as another aspect of communication related to social relationships. We are now live on the air Good viewers. Oh, it's you. What do you mean? It's me. Yeah, who did you expect to be on this episode? You know How's it been? It's been fantastic. How's that? How's that? How's the weather been I? Would say roughly the same where you are. They're slightly To the to the right to the right not on your left No, you're right. Oh, okay My left and right always been something that I mean we are in the circular table, I guess it could Yeah, well quite literally quite literally How's the wife? How's it? Non-existent as always. Oh, okay. So we had to go that far No, oh you see violated one of the great great tenants of small talk immediately Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I'm sure you found out as well. There's there's rules to small talk apparently, okay Well, that'll be looking at say, but yeah, I'm talking a little so To begin that we'll start with a lovely definition Because okay, we love we love our definitions Cambridge Dictionary Classifies small talk as conversation about things that are not important Often between people who do not know each other very well Is that just this podcast? Very more and more. Yeah If it will graduate from small talk to just conversation eventually when we know each other like we know each other Reasonably. Well, I'd like to think so. I would like to think so Also, it's things that are not important. And as you know, don't you only discuss things that appear unimportant? Oh, that's true Vital. Yeah, but it's secretly really interesting and small talk ended up being one of these One of these things. Yes. I think we I think I think we can both agree There's all the episodes we decided you want to do quite early on as we thought Wow what is so inane and so rarely talked about it is so always talked about and We have gone dived headfirst into this steaming pile of Psychology and linguistics social and The glue of social interactions I wouldn't say it's the glue I'd say it's the crappy drawing pin the loom the thing that gets the conversation going I Mean that I that's why I mean it's not it hasn't been described to me like that But that's essentially all the articles that I would say It's how the icebreaker is I think more. Yeah a palatable free Conversation, I don't know. I think you might catch him. Hey, we'll try and introduce it and we'll want you now Next week. Yeah when we started moving up our conversation, so you already don't like that Do you I don't know I kind of want to stick by okay. Well, I'm glad you're you're sticking to your morals I I can appreciate that. Well, thank you for that definition. It was I'm sure on how it was So I went to wiki how yes to really ensure I knew just what was going on And it was as as I always discover with wiki how very very useful and One thing they stood out for me other than the beautiful images, which I will talk about every week Is how it says find some common ground and reveal something about yourself And that is a direct quote Again, they're trying to I see what they're going for. They're trying to form that Bond between the two people have that conversation But um, they have their experiences that they went for what horseback riding Travel destinations obscure music artists as long as it's light-hearted and forms a connection. It's fair game It's light. All right Yes, because they go off because it's the whole thing about sorts of is it not supposed to be very person's with me as a Personal yeah, yeah, it's very impolite. Well polite to the point of impolite as possible I would say and with you wiki how goes on say my your own experience be casual. We're not confessing our darkest secrets here. I Have been doing small talk wrong. I think by saying I Don't know what's the dark secret Running up to people and confessing your crime and then just say I killed him. I killed How's it going with you? What a day at the office? Am I right? Yeah, so thank you with you how I wasn't sure about that but again once again, I'm wrong You know that that's a clarifying as a we say what exactly what did you? What did you find? Well, I'm in the Wikipedia. Ah What what information did you clean that so Wikipedia is for usual and is the mother of all rabbit holes So all kinds of like interesting little side notes and sort of branch off from small talk So it's related to apparently it's related to the need for people to maintain a positive face and feel approved by those that are listening to them Right Just say I'm reading here verbatim. It lubricates social interaction in a very flexible way But the desired function is often Dependent on the point in the conversation At which the small talk occurs so it and then it talks about things like the conversation opener and then the end, you know, it can be used to end a conversation or it can be used to sort of Avoid silence in that way And I think that links back to the point of we need like positive face time and to sort of feel a connection But I personally am actually quite comfortable with silence Yeah But I understand that I wouldn't say that in every scenario. I suppose it depends on the dynamic That you have with the person so like it's I Would feel uncomfortable if I was sat in a room, you know If I was in a meeting with them one of my professors and I've just sat there silently But I think we're both just yeah, I mean, it's a bit like Larry's just why am I here? Yeah, absolutely, or it's like if we were just like I sat on the sofa on an evening or something Yeah, that's that's all right, I mean, it's not that we won't have a conversation at all that evening No, it's good. No, that's that's that's silent evening. Yeah, that's I'm not talking to heads down But yeah, no it like it's used To lubricate social interactions To either begin them and them or to fill spaces. Why you put the lube at the end? You mentioned small talk. Oh, yeah Yeah, so why are you leaving afterwards? So it sounds wrong? What are you making a mess? Wasting a good product. Well exactly So yeah at the end of a conversation, um, so yeah suddenly ending an exchange may risk appearing To reject the other person. So if you just like by then fuck off That's you know, someone might take that the wrong way. I'm small talk can sort of be used to mitigate that rejection But it's weird having a conversation with something important and then saying oh, yeah, that's okay. I'm such today was Yeah How's the weather? Okay. Bye I don't have to say that you always go with the weather. It's something like oh, well, you know, where where what are you? Gonna do now kind of thing like because that implies that I want to end the conversation Yeah, but without sort of just leaving, you know, and I'm like not even care and probably don't care about what you're going to do You know But but it's that it's that it makes it easier rather than I just sort of nodding at each other in silence and then leaving So yeah, I can understand and you know when I read that it made a lot of sense to me Yeah, as to it, you know, you don't really you don't really notice how often you do small talk with people I think no, I think it's it goes over your head. Yeah. Yeah, because it's so mundane It's so sort of just waffle most of the time. Yeah Yeah, just like even if it's just like a good morning. How are you? Just to cap off the first part of Wikipedia Extended and sort of built. I think quite nicely what the Cambridge definition and provided for us in terms of people who don't really know each other Where Wikipedia says, you know? The need to use small talk depends on the nature of the relationship between the people having conversation and Then make the point that couples in an intimate relationship Can signal their levels of closeness by a lack of small talk, which I think is really interesting So like if you are beyond The need to feel the need to say something. So this links back to like The fear of rejection when you just end a conversation abruptly, yeah a couple in an intimate relationship Doesn't have to fear that Conversation ending abruptly because they know it doesn't mean, you know, you know, there's no there's no sort of emotion You're so comfortable with that person that it's not like oh god. I hope he talks to me again Yeah, not like yeah, so I think I think it's interesting that we can you can measure your intimacy With the level of small talk that you have. Yeah, I think that is a good indicator I think that's a good indicator because that because then that's an interesting question is when when is small talk? I'm saying how are you doing? And You have knowing where to draw the line of saying I'm doing fine. Thanks. How are you or going? Further where that line is is very different everyone else. That's quite interesting When small talk no one was become small talk and it just becomes a conversation becomes something more deeper more meaningful Yeah Yeah, I think I think I think that's interesting yeah, I mean we'll bring it up again But um, I think because it's kind of the recurring point But sure, I mean what do you What's next time I do it should we talk about static expression? I don't know what that is. Well, that's so that's that's a link on the Wikipedia page for anyone who wants to go and look at Themselves, but you have static expressions It's a sick and a he kind of struggling to express himself right now It's essentially Huh? It's the communication which primarily serves to establish or maintain social relationships, right? So It's So, I mean it says here in my notes that it's mostly socio-pragmatic rather than rather than has like semantic function Wow, that's a lot of words Okay, so and essentially what that means is, you know, socio-pragmatic is you know, what pragmatic means and then it's social It's a social thing. It's like a it's a necessity to do For a thing rather than have semantic function, so I'm not reading you poetry I'm not you know, it's not sound right. It's not it's not well-developed speech But it's just sort of it's essentially what small talk is. It's it's the expression of how we classify the linguistics of patterns of small talk Right, so when I say I mean, okay, so the article ads are the page the page here Gives the example Like hey, how's it going? Yeah, I think so And I suppose we can you know returning back to the intimacy point if I say to an occur if I say to an acquaintance You know, let's say I bump into I well, no, you're not an acquaintance, but let's say I bump into you in the morning Thank you Like, you know in the kitchen and I say hey, how's it going kind of thing? I can see that you're like getting ready to go on campus or something You know like it's but it's a how's it going? He's like, oh, yeah, it's fine Yeah, how's it how's it going kind of and you would ask me in return? Yeah, whereas if we were in an intimate relationship Oliver When When we get there Where's my mistake viewers? Well, but that's the thing So, you know going back to the going back to the point where couples don't have to you can measure intimacy by lack of small talk Classic expressions makes the point That just because how's it going? You know? Hey, how's it going is? We would classify a small talk It's the inflection Specifically in English and this is a this is a really important point that I will build on later But in English the inflection in the voice And how I ask that question is really important because I could say to my partner Hey, how's it going? You know, how was your day kind of thing now? That's not small talk because the inflection in my voice the you know The way that I'm asking that question. I am asking for a detailed response. I'm not expecting them to go I was fine, you know, yeah, how was yours kind of thing? You know, you're asking for a deeper emotional response. Yes Yeah, so that's how it's more. That's not small talk, but I said something that if I said differently to you Yeah, that would be small talk. Yeah So and I think I just think well, that's the thing. That's how it is in English Anyway Because we don't have sort of a well-structured Inflection is a really for any linguists out there. That's in the English language It's not crucial. Yeah, no, it's so compared to other languages It is non-existent So like emphasis on like in between, you know in the spaces between words and things like that I happen to know that Icelandic is something like this. They don't because I knew when I started go They don't get the sort of applying emphasis to certain parts of the sentence and how that can change the meaning of the sentence Yeah, they just don't have that because you know, and they actually have an Icelandic example here in on the on the And they have Phrases, you know, which are formal so, you know how often you know You have formal and informal sort of ways of greeting people. Yeah, I think German has it I'm not sure if French does I know how to have it. I didn't Spanish and I remember there's the There's a personal you and then there's yeah. Yeah, precisely. There's always We share that. Yes with German. That's like a like a formal and an informal way of greeting people They usually are I think French is the same whereas we don't really have No, no Verbs divided in that way, but that's a whole different. Yeah. Well, it's not as rigid as a sort of like a linguistic Yes of a platform I'm Korean as well. I think Korean is another one interest Um, okay, they have like a you're supposed to you call someone something depending on your relationship to that. Yes It's like how well you know, yeah And it is and it is sort of like a social transgression if you get that wrong kind of thing It's like hey, we barely know each other So that's what we're talking about here, whereas I can call you, you know, my friend my mate my but then, you know Let's say we work together. I could also call you my co-worker I could call you sir, if you were in a you know, I hear a position, but we could still be friends Yeah, you know, it's um It's a little bit more messy Yeah, what is it very messy be very circumstance that is the that is the thing I and I think this is one of the reasons that English is one of the tougher languages to learn if it's not Definitely because especially if you're coming from one of these languages that we've listed Where inflection in the voices is is absent It's not a thing and so you can end up sort of struggling to express yourself and bringing this all the way back to small talk How are you supposed to be able to have small talk with people if you know? you're not familiar with How we do it in the English tongue, yeah, well, and then we get my point it was I will come back to culture as well I'm actually going to talk about the maxims of quantity now. Okay, we're doing something. Yeah So essentially it is an etiquette of conversation Thought up by a guy who grease Great country. No, no, no, no grease doesn't rice with a G in front of it I don't know why I thought that that way anyway You give no more information in your conversation in your small talk conversation than is offered to you It has to be an equivalent exchange The analogy is you're assisting me to mend a car. I said a country which means neither more nor less than is required All right, you don't have extra screws or less screws and is needed at any one stage when you're It's don't make it more informative and don't get a less informative. Yeah, it's equivalent exchange and that's a very Common thing yet. So she is you you expect what you give what you expect back and it works both ways, right? Yeah, but as soon as you see how it applies so precisely to small talk But you have that and that's one about these maxims of quantity also of quality and things like that Yeah, it is very very large part of small talk. For example, when you're doing small talk you don't Go overly in-depth because then it was a conversation and people may well appreciate that everyone I've not been the circumstance or you might not have the knowledge of a person intimately or otherwise To be able to make that but it will say if you say if I ask how are you you just go? You Like someone from the stage I will also go well I was less informative and so specifically doesn't want our conversation Yeah, and then you would leave and I would be there left grunting alone. Yes. Well, maybe that's what I want Maybe that is what I just want to run you want you just want to go out to the stage grunt the people and just large slabs of steak I Can think of worse ways to live? I I think so tonight But that's the that is the general general theory and it is a theory because although that sounds all well and good Yeah, English speakers. Yeah, that is not always the case. Yeah, so Some person went about refuting this. I didn't there wasn't a name attached But I went some but some I'm gonna tear up this theory. It's the last thing I do and he did was in Malagasy Malagasy sorry in the Malagasy culture because a very reluctant to share information at all And so these maxims just don't work in a lot of the other actually Malagasy yes, it's it is oceanic culture, I believe from the Austro-Indonesian Isles somewhere over there but they avoid and if a direct questions completely don't share information at all and People give a lot of incomplete answers, but people don't lose face essentially because sharing information is Exposing yourself and information is prestige. You don't want to give that up and That is something that happens and you can see that conversation with people obviously don't want to talk Even in the evening English speaking you see that the people don't want to talk. They just withhold any information they Sort of close themselves off not only as you can see as you might be able to see physically They would like tell up or just walk away or something like that But their responses not even just their responses and their intonation even if you took all that away You'll be able to tell just by how much conversation. Yeah, they offer and by what they yeah What the information is it offer like getting blood out of the stone? That's yeah Exactly. Yeah, you put a nail in there. Yeah, we ever feel like you're talking to a brick wall. I Need to open to the Talking to brick wall I had to and just a clarification that actually is the people of Madagascar I got like yeah, I was gonna say you I was googling it and I was like this place. I Okay, well, I thought okay. Well my mistake you said Austronesia, which is why I said Indo Austro-Indonesian because I just thought that was a hyphenated thing. I mean, it's you're not No, I'm gonna jump over the Indian Ocean Indian Ocean is very small Yeah, the reiterate the people of Madagascar not the mythical land of Malaxi Well, I'm sure My geography perished in you know, I'm doing it which was about oh, I don't know Eight years ago since I've done geography and I haven't and I've been happier ever since so if anyone's hating on me for this Hey, the people of the the Malagasy people. Oh, well, they want to say the nice mistake you pedants out there can go do That that's my response to that that's fair enough I also found a fantastic article from very well mind. Oh, yeah, are we doing that? Yeah, because I also looked at that. Oh, yeah, I think I could I could well a good way to like do this is now that we've discussed the hardcore linguistics of small talk and The nuts and bolts we have gone very hard. Let's let's let How do we let's let's try small talk. No, I mean not us you and I but what are the do's and do nots? Okay, you know now now let's because yeah, they had best topics and worst topics this very well Yeah, that's cool. You see I disagree with some of the worst topics because I can't have small talk about them. Okay? Oh, okay Yeah, right. Should we do the best topics that should we just let's list the best one I think we can we can go over we can go we'll go over both of them Okay, what's the worst or best first? I mean you let's go best. Okay, I'll do best first so surprise surprise The weather yeah, it's off the list off the list as always because it's Britain especially It's always out the weather. You know what? My grandparents will even talk about the weather as a whole conversation They will make the small talk the entire topic of conversation. I will get especially weather updates when I call them from a safe two-hour drive away That I don't In the asshole of nowhere So if you ever want to know what the weather is in summer and Northamptonshire I can I can absolutely tell you and I will also tell you it's gonna be terrible because my grandpa's will complain about it Yeah, I mean, okay. Yeah, that's so just I don't let's not dwell on every single one of these. No, no Yeah, no, no, but I want to do on a weather because it's the cliche yes I'm doing well today, but I'm I'm insulting the people in the night scene and my grandparents I'm really already hitting up Ironwood all cylinders. Yeah, what do you want to say? Well, I just think I I mean you mentioned there that they complain about it And and that strikes me as a there's a particularly British thing to do that as we have shit weather That is also true So do you think small talk in? countries where the weather is consistently sort of nice Do you think that just? Shapes the small talk. So do you think they just talk? No, I didn't I read on this actually actually came up so in Countries where the weather is not all varied This works very well as it varies a lot. So you can actually say oh and do relative Oh, it is rain today. But yes, they were lovely fun and Britain does have that it does. Yeah Well, it's all or nothing. Yeah welfaring heart or ridiculously wet. Yeah, and that's what there's a great cloudy in between. Yeah Awkward moment. Oh, yeah, like where you're not sure which way it's gonna go. Well exactly fun Especially Eurocentric. Yeah small talk. It's just not the thing that is much more consistent So it's mortal just not it does not rely as much on weather a lot of the time Cool it is very it and The gist I got from a lot of my research was that it was a very culture dependent You will most of them set ones are very similar family. Yeah Work every TV. Everyone's got those of some kind but things like weather things which are a bit more regional hometown Hobby and sports those will be vastly different than one culture As a culture that it's difficult to think of what sort of will be in other cultures because you're not so immersed in them But but whether it's one of those ones, which is all or nothing. I suppose. Yeah, like if you're in Greenland Like I feel snow today Wow. Yeah, no shit Well, exactly well exactly But most of the best topics are just pretty standard stuff. You know, I wasn't insane. Yeah, but then I don't know if That's right Yeah, that can like slip into what do you do as your hobbies? Well small talk is usually designed to slip into something deeper. Anyway, like a lubricant I I thought that and I said it and I just and I was hoping you wouldn't say that and you said it anyway So thank you for that. But yes, like a lubricant is usually meant to Go further Continue this without making Me dead in the eye and that was a special moment and I enjoyed that Very much. Yeah, but but yes mortal is designed to be a Temporary stage stop it. Stop it. Let me finish It is I do every stage you're not supposed to be stuck at small talk for us Yes, you're supposed to move on to either a proper conversation or leave if there's an intermediary Into me into me into me interim. Yeah bits of the conversation, you know, I'm in So yeah, it's next. Yes. Well, I guess just links done again all family food work travel. They all just travel Yeah, I think yeah, I was there over the weekend. Well, exactly. It's just so how's the train journey? Oh, that's terrible. Yeah Yeah, that's very good. That's very good. Yeah, we have shit trains shit trains. I've shit travel in general Just all the traffic jams and everything Potholes, you know, I don't know should say hot holes that have become a Cornerstone. Yeah Because the potholes and I will rant about them for a second the potholes here are terrible Yeah, you could if you go into them on a bike you will be thrown off your bike Seriously, it's not just that they're frequent. You've got children. Yeah, it's it's the fact that they go Good 20 30 centimeters down. Mm-hmm. Probably about 12 inches for you Americans out there I don't know. Well, we gotta make we've got to make sure this is accessible. Oh, yeah, I'm the ostrich in using imperial units Shadows all my no, we're not doing sorry. I'm sorry. We're that is gonna be a different. I will be an imperial versus metric Well, we know what's winning that it's not even close a little bit bias. But yeah Okay. Well, I feel like in order to level out the debate. You should represent the Imperials. I Love representing the Empire No Okay digression next one celebrity gossip Well, if you're partaking that sort of thing It's such disdain Celebrity gossip. I hate I don't go back to that because I'm intrigued by not specifically celebrity gossip But we'll get back to that and their hobbies and hometown So I guess like where you're from I'm just sort of what you've been doing like again the potential to lead out. Yeah. Yeah Yeah, okay, so those are the best things is there anything that isn't on that list potholes Okay, I stand by that. Yeah Complaining against the government should probably I think that I agree. It's actually in Britain This is why we just you know, we're laying or any money. Well, I think I do a country I'd any country actually at that point So nice and I'd say they're pretty chill more any of the Scandinavian people will find something to complain I suppose that's true. There's always you know, even if it's a good government, there's always something to complain You can always do better. Yeah, and they never do and they never But the worst the worst topics gone you well, I'm gonna say Finances doesn't have to be but I can get that being very touchy. That's very taboo, especially in Britain I think it's like intimate intimate finance, isn't it? Yeah, you don't start a conversation by saying how does your bank account? Yeah Looking looking suitably shriveled The cost of living hitting you hardly empty is a Politics and religion but like Sorry, don't go on that point though. It's like people complain about the cost of living It's like I I paid well this much about who for a pint the other day. Well, again, that's economy run the finances That's rather cut supplies is your personal finances the economy and the general state of everything If you're complaining about spending like five six quid on a pint That's like that. That's indicative of your personal finances because you know, I doubt like billionaires are sat there going. Oh Well, I'll lose quid for a pint, yeah, but they don't know what a pint is they just having it say to them in fact It's in a tube. Yes, but I Think it is a thing across the board. Yeah, but many excluding million billion and a trillion has what you have in the finances your finances is very different to economics people will still go to a pub and whether they're on 200,000 pounds a year or 10 yeah, they will still complain about the price of the pint being too high because it is relative to previous and they Still know. Yeah, you're right there. So yeah, I think not to go Good topic. This is a random step. Oh, yeah. The only reason I bring out this because I found out today I don't that's my favorite. Do you Remember what a pint was in 2010? No, cuz I wasn't drinking. Yeah. Yeah No, I was underage What we were seven so yeah The reason the reason I bring this up because obviously that's when Those last conservative government going and the economic crisis and they've been and yeah You know that the conservatives have been in power Since 2010 a pint in 2010. Think about what it is now was Ranged from about two pounds fifty to about three quid That's very depressing. Yeah, that's very true. Yeah, and now it's upwards of like six maybe eight pounds Depending on where you well Get a better drink Beer is disgusting and tastes like wheat juice We out alcoholized wheat juice It's watery and it's like liquid. Cereal is disgusting Good I'm glad that the cost of living is affected by this. I'm gonna say it I say the things which everyone else is too afraid to say not exclusively bear Well, I don't like that. That's your only stat. So you have no evidence for anything else. That's true But yeah, that's it's pretty hard. That's a horrifying bill. Thank you so much. But anyway, let's give it like finances Yeah, I agree with you. I feel like that definition is vague and I'm convincing Well, that's why we we you're you're very welcome. Very well mind. We have improved your list. Yeah politics and religion Again causes your master government thing is you complain about generally the government. Yep, but so long as again, it's not getting too personal And I would die for Rishi Surnik. Well Whoever's doing my what? Yeah, that's the whole point. Yeah, if you don't say that Yeah And religion you don't know what's going on There's whole again these things where the general things are the worst obvious is there's a pre There's a very personal background where you might not know something and that could be very offensive Yeah, and also remember, you know going back to the definition You know our rock our foundation. Oh, yeah It's Someone that you don't know very well small pockets, you know people who are not overly familiar with so or it's something that's very quick And it's an interim. Yeah, something more important. Yeah, precisely where it's supposed to be important ending a conversation or filling a science you know, these are these are the domain of the small talk and you know going to Beliefs and religion is well, I'll be very nice and then the next one. Yeah Going deeply into someone's personal sex life. Yeah, not a good idea for the devil before for strangers. Yeah for acquaintances Yeah, that's pretty weird friends. What if you're leaving up the conversation? Yeah. Well, you've got to introduce it like that. Oh, okay I'm going to lube up the conversation now. Let's talk about it. Thank you. Okay. Well that also works that does also work see Death yeah, that's it. Not a very small talk sit down next to someone. Oh boy the mortality rate really up, isn't it? You ever thought about how we're all gonna die one day Mm-hmm. Yeah. No, it's a no-no. It's a no personal gossip bad See, I wanted to link this Celebrity gossip. It's interesting that gossip about people that you do not know personally is Permissible whereas gossip about people that I assume both Parties are familiar with not always acceptable I suppose the amount of times you hear gossip about people you have no idea who they are what's going on But then is that acceptable for like small talk, but they still know them Yeah, no. No, I mean like it's that good small talk like if you if you know, let's say we've met a few times Your acquaintances and then I start complaining about you know, oh That bastard that works at the office. Yeah Because I feel like I have the potential to be again has the potential to launch off and yeah Well, that's I mean, that's right. Shut it down. Couldn't you could shut it down with actual small talk like yeah Well, good luck with that. Yeah. Well, exactly. Oh boy. That's I think it gets better Yeah, yeah agreed But I just think it's interesting that um, it just kind of reaffirms that what we know of It's a it's an intimacy thing Yeah, also could be the amount of small talk is measured by the amount of intimacy between the two well Yeah, and it yeah, it's just gossip of this is tied to that gossip about celebrities. I mean, yeah I'm with you on that one. Well, of course the fuck cares, but like But personal gossip, yes, please. Oh, okay No, no, I don't know Also tracks well, how many cavemen have you met recently? They've all been trapped in ice. So not great conversation. No Exactly, and if I was to make an offensive joke about how all your friends were trapped in ice That would also be very bad small talk offensive jokes That's not very good jokes is on the list. I mean, that's like this is the sort of social interaction Well, no, this is something to become common sense. Yeah, exactly Thank you, yeah, I was very sure about that James, so thank you no, but past relationships That's that is bad Because You do again you don't know what's going on by that goes again This is too personal, but then you feel about the family so you could go when it comes family and then it which is good topic Good small topic talk Small talk topic. I got that little topic. Yes a bit of a family to past relationships that that position is not Guess what? It's good small talk to that. It's just too personal. Yeah, it's actually it's kind of dangerous, isn't it? Well, you don't want to stray into that show didn't talk about family never asked about someone's family Yeah assumes that they are estranged from that family strange that they've just gotten out of a relationship Assume that that was not always assume that always assume the last relationship they were in Immediately ended the moment you left that relation. Yeah, and I think you might be directly responsible. Yeah That can be something you'd be very proud of if you so wish or not or not that is also an option but That's something to be proud of. Mm-hmm be proud of yourself every day Yeah, and your ability to destroy other people through well, exactly that is important that marble very Very much so and lastly health. Oh, that's bad I mean, that's like to death. What kind of but yeah, it gets very well not very good so Don't don't be all personal Yeah Mm-hmm. They also said the three parts of small talk. Yeah, I found very interesting the icebreaker Yeah, the rapport. Yeah, and the exit. Yeah, and the exits my favorite part of it It says gracefully leave the conversation rather than just by the end. I mean again It's sort of reaffirming Wikipedia said yeah, so there are three parts of small talk and yeah, there are I Do they differ? I mean aside from the obvious What Wikipedia and no, I mean like the small talk at the beginning of a conversation and the small talk at the end of a conversation and Aside from the obvious is hello and goodbye. Well, I mean looking at these topics It's all you would you start on whether and sort of end on travel or would you well again? It's too circumstantial I'd say but I'd say a lot of small talk at the beginning is for you what you have done At the end of it was probably what you were. Yeah, that is my half officer. However, I can't test this I'm a psychologist and I do yeah, we don't have better things to do Yeah, we'd have to do small talk with a lot of people and I get other people to do a lot of stuff And then that would be even more boring. Imagine listening to two people doing small talk for like an hour Can you imagine anything would not be an hour? Okay. Well I Was just Shit we run out of content Anyway, oh I did discover also is there is a program language called small talk To Horrible, it's very it's very finicky and complex and designed to be Require lots and lots of thought put into it unlike small talk and it did take sacrifice on those pro most love programming language And then in a survey in 2017, but then weirdly enough it dropped off in 2018 because it wasn't even in the top 26 Wow, so yeah, like it's more fleeting face. Yeah, pretty much small talk died in 2018. No So rip small talk that is very sad But yes You you found a fun times article didn't you it's time magazine time. I'm not the time. I'm not the time No, okay different We wouldn't go to such a Stable the British slander such a high staple of British culture. Oh wait now we would we absolutely yeah, what do you find? it's It's pretty interesting. I mean, it's more just the point that Time magazine has bothered to write on small talk and I suppose we could like use that to broaden The conversation more generally like putting small foot like let's go meta. Oh Okay, let's talk about people talking about small talk so like because I'm not sure about you, but I Found there was a lot There was a lot this week when it came to like Looking at like the Wikipedia article alone. We barely scratched the surface. Yeah Such a combination of linguistics and psychology. Well, yeah, but you know There's what I mean the time article doesn't do anything like that. It's you know I mean you you heard me reading it earlier before we were recording, you know, it's They have all kinds of sort of social experts Where you know, you're told to reframe the conversation as a treasure hunt, you know And then they have some paragraphs sort of saying it's a social ritual that you engage in with strangers that you don't know that Well, why strangers you do know? Okay No, I think But then, you know you reframe the you know, it's like you it's like making a game of it making it a treasure hunt You're trying to find out more about that person trying to get to the treasure that they're hiding it You know the juicy tip bit underneath it says here and small talk is the biggest barrier to that So why are you doing small talk? No, we did. It's the icebreakers small talk at the beginning of the conversation It's the it's the teasing them out of their shell kind of thing And I think it's just interesting that because the articles in there's an eight-minute read at the top And you've skimmed it in how long? Again just showing the amount of effort we put in to bring you this Important information, you know, it's it doesn't explore anything that we haven't talked about. It's not If you know they might as well have just read the Wikipedia page And they've written an article and I think I know what I really wanted to talk about. It's like why why is that happened? Why is there a need you know, why are we we to you know idiots sat here? talking About small talk. No, why did we choose it as a topic and I think which which I think is in there because time magazine Yeah, it's like, you know Well, I think it's so ingrained in our lives Something that we do so much But we don't give very much thought to and then everyone complains about it on a first date and say I hate small talk And they go. Oh, so do I I don't know do small talk. Anyway, is that not in itself? Small talk small talk when you like so I hate I hate small talk. Yeah Yeah, I hate small talk. It's like that is small talk. Yeah, there's a beautiful sense of irony there Yeah, you're saying nothing. What do you know? Trying to break the ice on the you hate breaking the ice. Yeah, it's we're on so many levels where we have achieved Meta beyond the capability or the section we've achieved method beyond the capabilities of Facebook. Yeah Well, that's what I was hard Not really That's like a bird Kind of stick it to it at least one billion every week Exactly, but I've also did my grandparents of the people and the people of Madagascar as well this week I'm doing really really well. You've got a helper a nice light for right? You want exactly I like to I like a lot Variety is the spice of life. I Have been told that because it um, it talks about exiting the conversation gracefully Oh, please exit this conversation gracefully James It's been recommended that we should conclude something like this Please excuse me. I have to I have to talk to so-and-so or It's been great talking to you, but I don't want to monopolize on your time Thank you. Wow, that's a very heartfelt way to end the conversation. I don't want to monopolize your time Remember time is money and capitalism is forever. You are nothing. I didn't also know we should end. How did we look? Anyway, that's what I don't want to monopolize Someone said that to me and thought that I had joined a cult I don't like yeah I was like a greeting or like a you know, like a pass phrase. It's like what do I yeah, like shake their hands now See friend in it. Yeah Think I will not monopolize your time and end them. I mean I take it to the burn it being a nice club. We've discovered it That's a small talk. That's a small talk I'm Sam. So I think we should say let's not monopolize your timing and all yeah We're gonna put a lot of life in people. Yeah, I'm putting yeah. Well, we're not getting paid for this anyway, so Wasting let's stop. Let's stop wasting our time Let's do something else cool. Oh shit. Um, what's next week? Well, we did have a plan. I think we're gonna make a title You know Because we haven't done that a title a title for this podcast. Yeah, we will wake with welcome suggestions Oh, it's that full episode. Yeah Yeah, we could drive yeah, we could it might be slightly sure Depends how good we are Yeah, the title I guess well, I mean we can't we don't have to just do a title do we could do this? Can a theme tune I'll bring my kazoo. Yeah, come bring the kazoo. I'll bring the kazoo. I know I will No, I don't my harmonica somewhere. You know a harmonica. Yeah, it's not it's at home. Oh Guys Disappointed I can't play it and also Just blow into it. Well, maybe we don't do that. I can't she play the kazoo. Really blow into it. It's very easy I won't reveal the secrets of kazooing on live air hang on, but forgetting what to do You've got more kazoos. It's building you Yeah, everyone everyone can fucking play that exactly that's why I wasn't trying to brag I can play the kazoo it is not the brag Very well, I'm very well. You can look forward to my brilliant kazoo playing Okay, I Will This is a threat I'm bringing is it anyway? Yes. Um, I don't know bombshell. Goodbye. Goodbye. Yeah