PODCASTOfficial

The speakers discuss their personal experiences and perspectives on gaming. They talk about gaming as an escape from reality, a way to form relationships, and an opportunity to be someone else. They share their favorite consoles growing up, such as Xbox, PlayStation, PSP, and Nintendo DS. They also touch on the evolution of gaming and the shift from physical copies to digital downloads. They mention the convenience of online purchases but also express nostalgia for the experience of physically going to a store. The discussion concludes with a mention of the Oculus and their interest in virtual reality gaming. Good morning, gamers. Good morning, good morning. How's everybody doing today? I hope you're having a wonderful day today. I'm here with Jay Sheldon. I am a senior marketing major with a minor in both advertising and business analytics. My name is Sebastian Surreal-Diaz. I'm a cybersecurity major, class of 2026. So, what are we gonna be talking about today? So today, we're gonna be going over VR, AR, and XR, pretty much just the whole evolution of gaming. Oh, that's sick. So tell me, what does gaming mean to you? So, gaming to me, honestly, is an escape of reality. We're all human, we all go through things, and it's a great feeling being able to go home, turning on a console, and being able to just escape reality. It's like I'm in a whole different world. I could be myself and not have to worry about others. What does it mean to you? Honestly, one of the biggest things is, I see it as a form of making relationships. It's a great way to play with friends, family, heck, even strangers. You can form these relationships, you can talk to them, you can get to know them, and your friends, it's just a great pastime to do with them. You know, like, because I remember hopping on and playing Call of Duty with the boys was always one of my favorite activities to do as a kid. I mean, I still do it now, just not with Call of Duty as much anymore. It's more than anything, Rainbow Six Siege. Yeah, I find it amazing how you can just meet somebody online, and the next thing you know, they're like your best friend, and it's like you never met them in person, but it's like, it feels like you've met them for so long, you've known them for so long. It's crazy now. Yeah, like, that is really crazy. And actually, building on top of what you said about escaping rowdy and being yourself at the same time, some people also can see it as being someone else. Yeah. You know, you could be this cool assassin killer guy, you could be all these different people, and really feel immersed within that world, and really build your own. That's one of the coolest things about video games for me, is you can be someone else. Yeah, it's like you're this own character, and it's like nobody's gonna really judge you, you know? You can be yourself, honestly. So, talk to me about your personal experience growing up. What consoles did you play growing up? Oh, I played a lot of the Wii and Xbox. That's a good one, that's a good one. I was never a PlayStation player. I am now. Now that I got a PS5, I am a PlayStation player, but I was always playing Xbox. Call of Duty was the game for me. I owned pretty much every single Call of Duty game there was, and I would play the campaigns, and one of the games that I loved in particular was Call of Duty Black Ops 2. That's a great one. Yeah, that's where I spent a lot of my time with my friends whenever I was gaming, and where I formed a lot of those relationships, because it was a way for me to connect with my friends outside of school, because this was when I was 10, 11, 12 years old. I didn't have a cell phone. Yep, yep. Times were different back then. It would always be like, in school, you'd say, be like, oh, what time are you gonna be on? This time. Yeah. And you had to be there, because there was no way for me to tell them, oh, I can't be on tonight. Or remember when you had to write down your username on a piece of paper? Oh, yeah. And you had to go home, add you? Yeah. Yeah, now you have social media, such as Snapchat and stuff, where you guys just add each other, and then just text each other, and bam, it's safe forever. Yeah, and even building on top of that, Discord. Yeah. Discord. That's a huge one, yeah. Yeah, especially for the computer gamers. Yeah, yeah. So, do you like to use Discord, honestly? I mean, I'm not really much of a gamer as much as I used to be. Yeah. Discord, it's, don't get me wrong, great idea, great concept. I just feel like it takes too long to set up. Honestly, same. You got things like servers and stuff, especially if you plan to manage your own server, it's so much things. You have to worry about bots and stuff, adding your own bots and stuff. Yeah, it's, I just don't wanna, by the time I'm done setting up, I don't feel like playing anymore. Yeah, exactly. I wanna just go to bed. Yeah, it feels more like a community, pretty much, when you have your own Discord server than an actual source of communication. That's what I used it for. I used it to communicate with friends and stuff, and all that. Yeah, whenever I would use Discord, it was always communication. I would never use it while I'm actually in the game. More than likely, we would just probably FaceTime or call each other and just be on the call, or even be in the in-game lobby, because the whole cross-platform gaming doesn't always work sometimes. I remember a constant issue when I was playing Call of Duty with my friends was they would be PS5 players, and I would be an Xbox One player. So they couldn't hear me unless it was in-game chat. Yes, yes, and when you're loading out the game, there's, in the loading menu, you can't hear each other. So it's just completely quiet for you guys, yeah. Yeah, exactly, and so they would be like, hello, can you hear me? Hello, hello? And then they're cutting out of nowhere. Yeah, and I'm like, guys, I'm here, I promise, I'm here. Yeah. But in terms of technical experiences, do you really have any? I'm not much of a tech guy. Yeah, so honestly, when it came to all the technical stuff, I've always been a huge fan and stuff. I always like to keep up with the latest technologies and stuff, learning about new things, especially when it came to video games and video games consoles. I remember when the PS4 first came out, that was a huge jump from the last generation of gaming. We had the PS3 and the Xbox 360. That was really the last generation. You could include the Wii, but when it came to games that were more modern, like Call of Duty and stuff, they were meant to be played on the actual consoles, handheld devices, not the Wii, where it was more like motion-wise and stuff. When it came to growing up with gaming and stuff, I messed around with a lot of consoles. So I started off, I remember my first actual console was actually the PlayStation Portable, the PSP, the handheld device. That was way ahead of its time. I was about to say, PSP was so ahead of its time. I especially remember when they came out with movies for the PSP. You could have the little discs for the PSP. I had this special edition one where, and now that I think about it, this was way ahead of its time. It was this blue edition PSP, and it came with this camera on top. It was kind of like this Pokemon game that was literally, it was an AR game. Like an augmented reality game. So when I would scan my table, let's say, with my PSP, through the screen, I could see the little monster. Yeah, and I was like 10 years old. I'm like, this is the coolest thing ever. So basically, it's Pokemon Go, but however many years ago. Yeah, yeah. That's crazy. Yeah, it really is, honestly. I never had a PSP. I wasn't a PlayStation user, but I did have a Nintendo DS. Yep, yep. The DS was, I would say that was a little bit ahead of its time as well, because you could have chat rooms and stuff, and you could play games. You just couldn't talk to each other. You'd have to type everything, but it was like portable gaming. Yeah, that made it so unique. Yeah. I also had a Game Boy when I was a kid. Yeah, I remember that. It was my mom's Game Boy, and I played it, and it was so cool to me because it was so retro. Yeah, especially now how you can just buy a modded one for like 300 games now. Yeah. Yeah, that's amazing. I remember when you actually had to buy discs and cartridges. Like, you remember how back then you would actually have to physically go to GameStop to purchase GTA 5 when it came out? Yeah. People would actually do lines and stuff. Now everything's digital. Yeah, you don't have to wait in line anymore. Kind of takes away from the fun of it, in my opinion, but it makes it easier, especially for people who just don't want to go out and go get things. Yeah, but honestly, I mean, I wish it still stayed like that. You know, it's convenient being able to just log in, purchase your game right there, bam. You just have to wait for it to download, but it puts companies like GameStop out of business because nobody's coming into your stores and stuff now. That's true. I mean, you can actually go in and buy the non-physical copy, which, like, it's weird to me because you can still buy it online. You just can't buy, like, it's just weird. Like, why would you have a non-physical copy in the store when the whole point of having it on the Xbox is that you can buy it without having to go in the store? Yeah. It's just weird to me. But I still collect the discs. Oh, really? Yeah, I love having the discs. Yeah. It depends on the game. Yeah, that is true. I feel like you value it more. Yeah, exactly. Like, all of my Call of Duty games from when I was a kid, I still buy the discs for Call of Duty games because it's part of the collection. Yeah. You save storage as well. Exactly, you do, actually. Yeah. But I don't really have too many technical experiences. Like I said, I'm not really much of a techie guy. But I want to get an Oculus, which goes more to our topic. Yeah. So, before we jump into that, so you said you messed around with the Wii. How was that for you growing up? The Wii was one of my favorite things to do with my family. Because, like, one, nobody could beat me in Wii Sports Baseball. That's a good one. Wii Sports Bowling, eh, different story. Boxing, I was the only one with the endurance to keep fighting. So people would just give up after like one or two rounds. I never really played much of the Wii in terms of like overall games. Sonic and the Winter Games, Mario and Sonic, I remember that. That one was a good one. That was a good one. Yeah, it was just a great way to have fun with the family, especially if you didn't want to go out and, you know, spend the money. Yeah. We got all the games and just played with each other. Have you ever played the Mario Kart game where it's like you have the Wii controller and it acts like a stand wheel? Yeah. That was amazing. I was terrible at it. Yeah, honestly, same. And my edition of my Wii, it was like the Mario Kart bundle. Yeah. So I actually had like a physical Wii stand wheel. So it kind of made it more fun for me. But I was like eight years old, messing around, crashing into walls. Yeah, I couldn't figure out how to do it because it wasn't connected to anything. You were just holding it. Yeah, it was just like floating in the air for you, pretty much. That's what it felt like. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah. But what's your favorite console? Honestly, I'm gonna have to give it to the Xbox 360. Have you messed around with the Kinect before? Yes. Yes, that had so many features. It was like the Wii, but it was pretty much like the, to me, it was like the Wii 2. It was like an upgraded version. Yeah, because you didn't even have to have a remote. Yeah. You just had to do your movements, which we thought, I thought was very cool. Yeah. But yeah, I was gonna say the same thing. My favorite console growing up was the Xbox 360. Have you messed around with Just Dance and stuff? Yes, Just Dance. That's a throwback. Because I remember my sister, actually, she would play Just Dance as a form of exercise. Yeah, yeah. I never used it for that. I did it for fun. Yeah, I know the Wii had an exercising game. They had this pad that would sit on the floor. Yeah, Wii Fit. Yep, that's what it's called. Yeah, yeah. I remember they did have an exercise game that you would play for the Wii Fit. I remember I played this game where it was a jump rope, and you would jump on the pad in order to not get hit by the jump rope. And I'm like, so cool. It's like going to the gym, but not having to actually go to the gym. Yeah, I find it a bit unfortunate how game developers nowadays, they shift it away from that physical activity of gaming. Now it's all just sitting in a chair, and you aren't really getting much exercise at all. Just covered in Cheetos, done with a giant Mountain Dew bottle next to you. With Doritos. Yeah. When you're finished with the Mountain Dew bottle, you don't even have to go to the bathroom. You can just use the bottle. Yep. What do you feel, in terms of ethical concerns, about all these games and stuff? Even with AR, VR, and all that. For back then, and all that? Both, actually. Honestly, when it came to the concerns, I was really concerned about the sensors, on how exactly they tracked us. Because there wasn't any indication when they were on and when they were off. Because the console was always plugged in to the wall. Unless you were weird enough, and I guess unplugged it all the time. But my concern was, this technology was from 2008, let's say 2012. Right? There wasn't much security back then, compared to what we have now. So it's like, what if there were people that were possibly on your network, monitoring you? Yeah. You know, that's... Yeah, that was one of my biggest concerns, was like, they could really just be watching us through that camera at any second, couldn't they? They'd just hop on the server and just be like, let's watch these people. And it's like, you would feel kind of violated privacy. I don't know if you were on TikTok a couple years ago, but there was a joke trend with like, oh, my FBI agent watching me through my phone screen camera or whatever. And yeah, it just really made me think of that. I also was very concerned about, how would they read the room? Like, would they collect the data of like, what kind of room am I in? How big is it? And like, could they use that against me somehow? Yeah. It's just like, most of us, if it was like a family console, we kept it in the living room. Yeah, exactly. Everybody walks through the living room. Yeah, exactly. So it's like, you have kids and stuff. I mean, we were kids at the time. Did that violate our rights in a way? If they can monitor us, how did they keep track of all the rooms and stuff? If the game was compatible for where we were at and stuff. That just raised a huge red flag for me, but we were young at the time, so it was like, we weren't really worried about that. Yeah, honestly. So we'll be right back after this short break, after we're done reminiscing about all the good times with gaming, and then we're gonna be going over VR, AR, XR, and pretty much just industrial application. And welcome back, gamers. After we just got done reminiscing, we are now going to start diving into virtual reality, augmented reality, and extended reality. Yes, sir. This is very exciting for me. Yeah. So tell me how it works, one of them at least. So I wanted to cover AR. So pretty much what augmented reality is, it's pretty much just the technology combined with the real world. So utilizing computer graphics, the graphics card and stuff, it pretty much puts out stuff into the real world. So we had games like Pokemon Go. That was a huge one. That took the world by surprise. You were able to walk outside, find Pokemons on your phone. It wasn't physically there, but it was on your phone. That's the whole point of AR and stuff. So what do you think about VR? What does it mean to you? VR? VR to me is your own computer-generated reality, where you're immersed into your own world, where you can interact and explore the very same world, and it works through eye-tracking and sensors. So you literally can have a whole 360-degree view of a world that's different from your own. And XR, XR is, you're interacting with stuff in your world, but you can just see it all around you. So it's like mixed, pretty much. Yeah, it's a mix of both, I would say. Like, for example, in Avengers or Iron Man, when Tony Stark is playing around with stuff with his bare hands and all around. Yeah, he's not really, he's not wearing anything in the movie, but if it was real life, he would probably be wearing something on his eyes, like glasses or goggles. Yeah, maybe even contacts, you never know. Yeah, so what convergence themes? So, I was thinking about the latest technology right now. I was thinking about the Apple Vision Pro, how it pairs amazing with AI. So, the AI version, when it comes to Apple and stuff, is Siri, that it's integrated to all iPhones and stuff. And it's just so cool how pretty much you wear these goggles over your face, over your eyes, and you say, hey Siri, what is such and such? What's the temperature like tomorrow? That's amazing for problem solving and all that. And also, I know AR can be used for training employees, or even just training in general. Like, nowadays, people, they go into law enforcement, you have to know how to use a gun. Instead of risking the danger of just, here, handing somebody a gun, you could put them through this VR training, AR training, where they're not really dealing with a physical loaded gun, but to them, through the goggles, they see a gun in their hand, and they're going over the basic safety, all that things. And it just eliminates issues and stuff that we might face today. Yeah. I also think that there's a lot of IoT when it comes to these technologies. A lot of connecting all these servers and networks. Gaming consoles. Yeah, gaming consoles. All these things have to be connected in order for it to work perfectly. So there's a lot of internet involved whenever you're using these technologies. And we can talk about some industry applications. So obviously, we have gaming, as we've been talking about the entire podcast so far. VR is, right now, I would say it's a lot more normalized than it used to be. It's a very common form of gaming. You set up your little box where you're allowed to move within your VR, and you're just playing in your own world. You can play games like Among Us, Superhot, Beat Saber. Beat Saber is honestly one of my favorites. Yeah, it's a fun one I've played. Yeah. With AR, Pokemon Go, it's a very easy one. Linking back to the PSP, it's basically the same essence. Playing and capturing Pokemon in real time in the world around you. And that was in 2009 when that was announced, the world with the PSP. Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah. Like 10 years ago. I mean, and XR, we're not really quite there yet with XR and gaming, I would say. But I feel like definitely that's something that's... That's definitely up and coming. Yeah. And something that's gonna probably be explored a lot in the future. Yeah, that is true. So what do you think about when it comes to the hospitality and all that? How do you see VR being used? Do you see it being used for surgery and stuff? Do you think that could be used for training and stuff? What's your opinion on that? There's millions of applications and it's just amazing to me what you can use it for. I read an article the other day about how people can use VR to go to these attractions around the world without ever leaving their home or even their hotel room. Yeah. Like they can get a preview of something before they even go in and actually look at it. Which, you know, it's a very interesting concept because it's something that's never been done before. Nobody ever has done something like that. Yeah. And another one was like sports. Yeah, entertainment. Sports and entertainment. You can go on museum tours, concerts, clubs. Yeah. The sports arenas. Yeah. Like you can literally attend a game, possibly even right on the field with the players just playing around you, which is very cool. Arcades. Arcades have those. They always have those VR games where you're like shooting stuff or you're going on like a ride. Surgery. Yeah. Tell me what you think about surgery. So honestly, I feel like that's going to be like, I feel like that's the future when it comes to like surgery and stuff like that because we have doctors all around the world. They all share different experiences. They all share different backgrounds. And let's say somebody is diagnosed with like a rare condition and stuff, right? You know, maybe here in the United States, that may not be common, but let's say somewhere across the world, a doctor has already ran into two patients with that already. You know, they could set up possibly like a virtual surgery room where they're guiding somebody here to that surgery of possibly, you know, getting rid of all, you know, like the issues and stuff. You know, that's very crazy to think about now. I know now you have pretty much all like XR and stuff. Doctor visits now. A doctor doesn't have to be in the room now to be present, check up on you now. Like, honestly, I can see like a hologram coming in soon. Yeah, because like right now they're able to Zoom with a doctor, which is very cool. But I also can see it being used like, you remember you were talking about the police training? Yeah. They can use it for medical student training. Yeah. Have them go through actual surgeries and procedures without having a test subject. Yeah. Such as like an animal or a corpse. Or a human. Yeah, it just feels like, it's also huge in education because of like giving students in like a third world country the ability to learn from someone from somewhere else. Yep, from anywhere across the world. Yeah, it would include a lot of investment, but you know, it is possible. You know, capabilities are really endless. A privatization of space. Yeah, that's. A doctor can give you surgery from Earth while you're in space. Yeah. That's honestly crazy to think about, but it's like we're so close to that now. Yeah. Like a few years ago, I would have never imagined anything like that. Like, what do you mean a virtual doctor is gonna check up on me? Like, no, I don't want that. Now it's normalized. Yeah, imagine your grandfather's just like, he's gonna be performing surgery on me, how? He's halfway across the world. How's he gonna perform surgery on me? I don't trust this. I don't trust this. I don't trust this gosh darn technology. I could just see that being an issue, but like not for us in the future. In the future, we might be on that level and be like, what? A robot's gonna do surgery on me? Yeah. That's a whole other podcast topic for another day. Yeah. There's so many industry applications. It's hard to cover them all. But what do you think about the future of VR, AR, and XR in gaming? Because right now it is normalized. It is evolving every day. Just tell me what you think in general. Honestly, what I see, so now when it comes to gaming with VR, you know, you need a headset. Augmented reality, you know, that could be your phone and stuff. But when it comes to the XR, to me, that's the future. I see ourselves in the future not having to wear a headset, but more of like a projector in a room where it's more like holograms and stuff. So like, imagine yourself in a room pretty much fighting zombies with your bare hands, pretty much. I honestly think that's the future of gaming, you know, physically being in the game. I know you mentioned a movie, Gamers. Yeah, Gamer with Gerard Butler is, I could see that possibly being a future of XR or VR. And in the film, you can actually go watch it. It's free on a streaming platform. I think it's Tubi. In the game, in the universe, whenever you're a player, you have a 360 room and you're not wearing anything. You're in a third person view of your person and whatever movements you do, they do. And whenever you're customizing, picking out clothes, weapons, stuff like that, you're just moving it with your finger. Just moving it all with your hands and it's all very cool and interactive. But yeah, I would also say another good movie I would base it off of is Ready Player One. That's like with VR headsets. Yeah, they still wear the headsets and their bodies are hooked up to a lot of stuff, but they are able to actually see it through their own POV rather than doing it as a third person. So it is like a first person shooter, but you're actually in the first person rather than being on a TV screen or being on a phone or something like that. It's very inspiring and it makes me think about what's the future of gaming? Is this possible? And it's like, I honestly think it is possible. All these things, it's just, we're far from it. It requires a lot of capital investment, a lot of research, a lot of development. And will we see it in our lifetime? I hope so. Yeah, I hope so. I honestly think so. Yeah, because I'm probably going to be gaming until I'm like an old man. And we've both still got a long time to go before us at that age. Yeah. But what do you think about the future of VR, AR, and XR in gaming? So another thing that I wanted to add, honestly, like I was saying earlier about the holograms and stuff, imagine if pretty much we had gloves and stuff, I could see more getting our bodies more involved with the gaming. So while it is a hologram, I could see a glove being able, you could purchase as an add-on and you could physically feel, let's say like the zombie. Yeah, that's what they're called. Yeah, that's going to be crazy. I know now pretty much what runs pretty much like the gaming side of like a VR and AR is Quest. Quest 2, you know, by Meta. Yeah. I heard they released something, they released a new goggle recently and it's now like on the XR side and stuff and it's so crazy. Have you messed around with like the Quest 2 or anything like that? I have not really. I don't really own an Oculus. I tried out a friend's one time and that's when I was playing Beat Saber and I thought it was so cool but I was worried about getting motion sickness and all that. That's one of my biggest concerns whenever doing that extended reality stuff is being sick and not being able to like stand up and stuff, getting dizzy because it is like very different from our reality in that sense. Yeah, especially for a first time user. I know when I messed around with the Quest 2, I experienced motion sickness and it's because like while I'm standing, while I'm standing still in person, I'm running inside my head pretty much and that like completely threw me off. I took off the headset and I like, it felt like I almost passed out. Like my head was just spinning in circles. I was just stuck there. I could see like a track pad being implemented kind of like with the Wii, how we mentioned earlier with like the jump roping game. I can imagine like a pretty much like a, kind of like a treadmill pretty much where it can move around in 360 and while you're running in game, you're running in place. So that can reduce like motion sickness and then it also makes you feel more involved in the game as well. Yeah, but like with all these advancements and stuff, there are a lot of risks. Like one of the biggest ones I can think of is security and privacy risks because like when they read the room for your VR and gaming and stuff like that, they are taking, collecting the data of the space and like that's more data on you and as that evolves and gets bigger, that's gonna just be more data and stuff than it collects. So with, you know, the more advanced we get, the more security and privacy risks there are. Yeah, and it's like, it just leaves me wondering like, is it really worth like advancing in gaming because the more we advance, the more issues we're gonna come across. Yeah. Like what if somebody, you know, ends up finding a folder where it shows like all that room data? Yeah. You know, that's pretty much your house, especially like if you were your Apple Vision Pros normally, you're walking around your entire house, so pretty much your whole house is being scanned. You know, what if that ends up on the internet somehow? Yeah. That's a huge risk. Yeah, that's a huge risk. Like, and also people could be like hidden, like do hidden surveillance and like track your eye movements and stuff and like track so much about you. This is just cyber criminals in general. Yeah. Like they could learn so much about where you live, what you're looking at, what you're doing. And it's just, it's crazy. And we didn't really talk too much about this, but there is also like the sex tech industry. Yeah. Like, and that could be paired with gaming as well. Yeah, it could. Because like you are interacting with these things in real time. And like, I remember reading one, another huge risk was sextortion. Yeah. Yeah, that's a huge one. Yeah. And so for those of you who don't know, sextortion is basically where cyber criminals may hone in and use the data that you did during the sex tech sessions and use it against you in exchange for money. Or they'll do blackmail. Yeah, that's what I was working for. Thank you. Yeah. And then there's also like deep fakes. Yeah. Yeah, that's a huge one now. Yeah, because like putting people's faces on like these models or these characters and stuff in games as well as the sex tech industry. Especially like paired with like, with AI now, like you could just write up, give me a deep fake on Ariana Grande. That's a huge concern. Yeah, it's huge. So like, would you say that like, what are some recommendations that you would have for individuals using this technology, especially as they get more used to it and they start using it more and more? So honestly, something that, you know, we all do as humans, we don't read the fine print at all. Like, honestly, like, I feel like companies, they make it long on purpose so we don't like point out like the bad things. And they gotta cover their bases. Yeah, yeah. Like I understand, but. We just acknowledge the terms of service. I just wanna do it. Yeah. What I would recommend, I will make sure you stay on top of all your like, device updates, network updates. Make sure your network is secure. You know, it's like the little things we forget. You know, you don't wanna have a simple password on your network because your VR headset is connected to your network. Let's say your password on your network is password 123. Next thing you know, a hacker gets in and he has access to your headset pretty much. And that's a huge concern that, you know, it's the simple things that we have to look out for. We have to, you know, implement into our day-to-day lives. Yeah, and also like if you are prone to motion sickness and stuff like that, like try not to frequent this technology too much. Or like, you gotta practice with it until you eventually get used to it and lose it. Yeah. Because like, ugh, it's a mess. Yeah. If you just start throwing up all over the carpet because you ran too fast in VR. You know what's crazy to think about? I never knew this, but did you know that AR, it's always been like in our face? So like, what I mean by that is, everybody has Snapchat, you have Snapchat. Yeah, yeah. Did you know filters are considered AR? No, I did not. Yeah, I was surprised when I found that out. I was like, wow, this is something that I've been messing around since I was 12, maybe 10. And it's like, AR was always a thing right there. And it's like, we never really knew about it. And now that I think about it, it makes sense now. Yeah, yeah. Like, you know the Apple Vision goggles? Yeah. Yeah, I remember watching a TikTok the other day and a guy smashed a plate in real life because he did it in his Apple Vision goggles. And it was hilarious because like, the restaurant people came up to him, they're like, yo, what are you doing? Why'd you smash that? And he's like, oh, sorry, I didn't realize I did it in real life. Yeah, and that's a huge concern, honestly, because if you ever experience a VR headset, it's like you're honestly part of it. Yeah. You could easily forget you're in the real world. Oh yeah, that's a huge concern. Yeah, you could have that loss of reality. And you could even potentially have isolation. Yeah. Like, just staying away from people and literally being in your own little world. Yeah. Maybe we can implement a daily break, maybe? Yeah, like a required break or something like that. Yeah. You have to take off the headset for the next hour, you have to remind yourself that you're in reality. Yep. Like, this is all a game. Like, have you ever scrolled on TikTok long enough where you get the TikToks? Yes, I have. Because I'll look and it'll be like, yeah, you've been scrolling for a long time. And I'm like, have I? And it's like. And have you noticed how normally when I'm swiping down on TikToks, if I don't see a video I don't want to watch, I swipe down right away. I've noticed with those videos, it takes two swipes to actually swipe down. Yeah. It's kind of like, it pulls your attention. And I feel like we could implement that when it comes to the usage of VR, AR, and XR to keep us in the real world. Yeah. That's something that could be implemented. Yeah. I'm just thinking of another way you could say it, like, go touch grass. Yeah. Go outside and touch some grass. Go get some sun. Yep. And it's for your own good, you know? Yeah. You don't want to get stuck. Yeah. Well, thank you for tuning in, everybody, and listening to our podcast on the evolution of gaming and VR, AR, and XR. We'll be saying GG for now, but we'll run it back next time. I'm Chase Shelton. I'm Sebastian Sorrell. And this is the end of our podcast. Have a great day.