Marnnie06-24-24

This episode discusses the importance of letting data guide your decisions. The host, Andrew Stout, interviews Marnie Hale, who shares her experience and insights on making good decisions quickly. Marnie also talks about her journey from corporate to entrepreneurship and how she found more fulfillment and balance in her life. She emphasizes the need for clarity and passion in our work and the importance of prioritizing what truly matters. Making decisions based on goals and vision can lead to success and ease. Opinions expressed in this episode are personal. They do not necessarily reflect the views of this streaming platform. Good day everyone and welcome to another edition of Let's Be Diverse. I am your host, Andrew Stout. This episode is dedicated to all my loved ones who have supported me through this journey. Data is something that I've heard quite a lot about in different realms, whether it's in marketing, whether it's in HR, whether it's in leadership, all forms of leadership. So I thought I would have a discussion on this today. So our topic today is letting data guide your decisions. And I'm so lucky to have as my guest today, Marnie Hale. With experience spanning a diverse array of industries, from customer service to tech to real estate, mortgage and auto, she has the privilege of collaborating with startups, midsize companies, Fortune 500 giants like Mercedes-Benz USA and Bosch North America, as well as Tom Ferry, Todd Duncan and Lion Desk. But beyond the titles and accolades, what truly drives Marnie is her need to help others. That's why she wrote the bestselling book, Simplify it to Amplify, a blueprint for navigating the complexities of business with clarity and confidence. Her simple process has led to remarkable outcomes, including propelling a company's revenue from $8 million to an impressive $30 million in just four years. I met Marnie on LinkedIn and we had a super conversation. We hit it off right from the get-go. And after she wanted to come on and she did not hesitate for a second, she said, absolutely, we just had to find a date. And today is the day. Welcome to the show, Marnie. Thank you so much for coming on. We're so lucky to have you on today. Thank you, Andrew. I'm super excited to be here. We're so excited to have you. Tell us what's going on in your world, Marnie. What's new? What's happening? Give us the deets. What's going on in Marnie's world? Oh, my gosh. I think the thing I'm most excited about, Andrew, right now is I'm kind of reinventing myself. As I tell you a little bit about my story in a bit, you'll see that I've gone on this journey from corporate to entrepreneur. And after a few years of running my own business, I'm taking a step back and realizing that I've evolved and it's time for my brand to evolve. So in May, depending on when this comes out of this year, I should have a brand new website out for everybody and I'm really excited about it. Oh, we're super excited to see it. I can't wait. Now I'm anxious to see it. Now you've got us on pins and needles here waiting for that. So it's going to be super fun to see and exciting for you. I'm glad to hear that things are going well. I do believe that we do have to reinvent ourselves as well. We have to have a little bit of clarity in our lives. And I feel like because we need clarity, I feel like we have to kind of go through things at certain times of our lives and figure out what's needed and what's not. So I think you're on the right frame of mind and the right track for that, for sure. Yeah. Right track. Super excited for you. Well, I'm glad to hear that that's going well. Now, before we begin, Marnie, I mentioned this to you and I mentioned this to all my guests. I always have a fun question to ask my guests to get things going on each episode. Are you ready for yours? I am ready. So your question is, if someone asked to be your apprentice and learn all that you know, what would you teach them? I think the most important thing that I could teach somebody is how to make good decisions fast. It's something that I see in so many people that they're so close to growing their company or moving forward in their life or having that fulfillment that they want. But they're stuck in this paralysis of making decisions. And for me, it's just a natural ability that works backwards from really focusing on what's truly important. And, you know, sometimes you just got to make that decision and move forward. I totally agree with you. Sometimes you have to know when to pull the pin, when to put the pin in. So I totally agree with you. It's something that I try to figure out myself and I talk to a lot of people and that's pretty much what they try to figure out as well. So I'm fully in agreement with you that if you can master the decision making and be able to make it fast and not just being able to make it fast, but also have the confidence that you've made that decision and you're comfortable with it, then that is key as well. Because some people can make a quick decision and then, you know, they can kind of think about it for two, three days and like, oh my God, did I make the right decision? So if you made that decision, you made it, it's done, it's over with, move on. I think that's, I agree with you, that's totally key for sure. Yeah, absolutely. And the trick I can share with you is to really be focused on what's truly important. What I have found when people are making decisions and then to your point, they regret it a few days later, is because they're typically making the decisions from their emotions. And I'm not saying to not listen to your body, but if you are very clear on where you're going and that vision and goal that you want to achieve, when the decision making process comes up, as long as you are making it from a place of this is going to get me closer to my goal, then you know that that decision is correct. Right, right. Totally agree with you. Well, thank you very much for sharing your answer. It's, you know, you came up with a great answer. It almost seems like you knew the answer ahead of time. So that's pretty good that you're able to think on the spot and your answer just goes with what your thoughts are and it just tells me that's something that you do on a regular basis. So it came naturally to you, which is absolutely perfect. So thanks for having fun with me. Why don't we start off with you telling us a little bit about you, your story and your why, Marnie? Oh, absolutely. So my journey starts over 20 years ago, and I grew up with the thought that you work hard, you climb the corporate ladder. And when you do that, then the riches and the rewards will come. So that's what I did. So for 20 years, I climbed the corporate ladder. I had great success. I started young. I had great success. I worked with big corporations like Mercedes Benz and Bosch Home Appliances, big corporate. Then I moved on to some midsize companies and I found personal and professional development that I just fell in love with. But at the end of the day, what I realized when I got to that so-called top of the ladder is I wasn't fulfilled. I had prioritized my work over my family, thinking that that was how I was providing for them and took a step back at that point and realized there's got to be a better way to do this. So I stepped back from corporate and I started figuring out, taking what I had learned and figuring out how to still create those big wins, the same success that I was creating with the corporations, but doing it with more ease and fulfillment. And I realized that it was 100% possible. And I just decided that that was going to be my journey to help people who were maybe on the same journey as me and help guide them that there's an easier way to do this. And it's been a really beautiful journey for the last few years. It's been about four years that I've really stepped back and been doing this. And it's incredible to see that you can have the same success. You can achieve those big wins and goals, but you can do it with a lot more ease and fulfillment and balance in your life. I love all that, what you just said. That story is amazing. There's so much that I want to pack into here. First off, since I started this podcast, you're not the first person and I'm sure you're not going to be the last to tell a similar story. I knew that there was a lot of people out there who just either went to school or got into a career, thought it was something that they were going to do for the rest of their life, moved up the food chain, got everything, the house, the car, the picket fence, the cell phone, the laptop, gas card, whatever they need to succeed at their job. And then they just realized that they were unfulfilled. So it just goes to show you that money and high jobs is not the be all and end all. We still need to have passion and clarity for what we're doing, because we spend so much time doing it at our jobs. We need to love it. We need to have passion for it. It's got to get us out of bed. It's got to give us something to push out of bed that you're like, okay, not that I have to do this. But I get to do this today. I get to go see that client. I get to do this. I get to go to that meeting today. I get to propose my new thoughts in the meeting and this new procedure. You get to do that. So when you get to do something, it's exciting. I get to go on a vacation. You don't say, I guess we're gonna go or we have to go on vacation. You get to go on vacation. You're excited about it. So the excitement is going to be key for anything. So I loved your story. I loved how you climbed the ladder and I love how you figured it out. And I love the fact that you were not fulfilled, but you decided that you needed to make a change. Because there's a lot of people out there, Marnie, and I'm sure you hear it, that are unfulfilled, but they have not figured it out and they don't know how to figure it out. So when I hear somebody figuring it out, it's super cool and awesome and amazing that they were able to do it. That it just shows that they can do it. Anybody can do it. And we get to create beautiful wins for people because at the end of the day, that's what we're doing and we get to do it. I love that you took us down that path. Yeah. There's some words there that just kind of make you, if you change them up, it makes your mind feel a little bit better. I know a lot of people used to say, and I used to be one of them, I used to hate Mondays. Now I love them because I get to look at my schedule for Mondays. And I do a lot of, I am a firm believer in collaborating and having a rapport building, coffee chats with people. I'm a firm believer in that. So I get to look at my email and you look at, oh, it's Monday. Okay, who do I have on this week? And it's super cool to see who you have on. You sometimes forget who you booked depending on how far in advance it's booked, but you look at it like, oh, I got so-and-so today. I got so-and-so today and so-and-so today and Thursday, Friday, I got so-and-so. Perfect. So it is exciting and it makes you feel like you're looking forward to something during the week for sure. Absolutely. I'm with you. I love Mondays. I look at it and I say I have a whole week to create beautiful wins for people. Yeah, super, super important. So our topic today is, we're talking about data. So my question to you is, how can data be used as a guide to influence our decisions? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, data is everything because it tells us what's working, what's not, and most importantly, where to focus our time, energy, and money. And it goes back to the decision-making, right? Because when we're sitting there saying, we're executing this project, we have this big goal, and we're saying, now what? Or you only have so much budget to use, where are you going to put it? Let the data guide those decisions. It takes it out of the emotions and it allows you to make the decisions based on what's going to move the needle based on the data, either in the moment or historical data, so you know where to put the effort. I love that. I love when you said tells us what's working and what's not. So I always been told since I started to work when I was 16 years old that data doesn't lie. So a lot of people, yes, I know, maybe this is what data is saying, but it could be fudged or maybe the system is not working properly. Data doesn't lie. So it tells you a lot of information, gives you a lot of what's going on, tells you almost anything that you want to find out it gives you. So I love that it tells us what's wrong and what's working, what's not working. I love that. You know, it's a great way, because there's some people who can't figure that out. So having data in your organization or in your business or wherever you're working to figure these things out is going to make your life a lot easier. Yeah. And, you know, you made a point about people, the data couldn't be lying or they're afraid of it. What I have found a lot of times is, is people are afraid to show data that shows that something's not working. And that to me is the most exciting part because it gives us the opportunity to fix it. Right. And so, and even as like a department head or a CEO walking into an executive meeting or sharing data with the team, they're afraid to show this because they believe it's coming across as negative. And I just think that's a shift we need to make in companies that data is guiding our decisions. It's not something to be afraid of. Right. I love that you said that, because there's a lot of companies that say, for example, you say, oh, you come up with an idea and you say, oh, you know, what do you think about this idea? And the boss will say, we tried that 10 years ago, and it didn't work then. But I love that you said the data because the data could show, this is a proof, say, hey, it may not have worked. I don't know what you used to make your decision 10 years ago. But I have data here to show me to say that this, my idea could very well work. You know, there's a chance that it might not work. But the data is showing that it could work and it's worth a shot. So why don't we give it a shot instead of saying it was done 10 years ago, and it didn't work. So I don't want to do it. Yeah, absolutely. And I hear that all the time. And typically, that comes with a, it didn't work. And I'll say, well, can you show me the data? And they'll say, well, we did it. And nobody, let's just say, nobody, you know, converted. Okay, great. Can you show me how many people came into the funnel and how many, you know, book the appointment and how many, right, all the steps that the data should be tracking that we can optimize, right, to make it work. And they like to live in the land of no, it didn't. And let's move on to a new idea. Yeah. Yeah. So I know that we kind of delved into it, but I kind of want to go into, I love this next question, because I want to go a little bit deeper. Why? So what I want to know is why is information so important when it comes to decision making? Yeah, I mean, it goes back to letting us know what's working and what's not. But the bigger part of it is no, I guess it goes with it, knowing what steps to take along the way. So, you know, a lot of times we're focused on point A to point D of, we know where we're at, we know where we want to go, but we're not super clear on B and C. And that's where the magic happens. And that's where the data really comes in and, and guides us on what steps to take to get there. To get to that destination. And that for me, when I discovered growth hacking, which is really optimizing the journey and letting the data guide our decisions, that's when really the magic started happening. So when you say guiding, Marnie, are you like, are you saying like, looking at the data and saying, okay, well, through this data, it's telling us that we should go in this direction? Is that what you're meaning? Yeah, absolutely. Like, for example, let's say that we have a lot of people coming in, I'm going to go to marketing funnel. We have a lot of people coming into our funnel through one specific lead magnet topic. Right? Then we'll say, oh, our audience who is converting at the highest level into a customer is really resonating with this message. Let's go deeper into that. Let's build courses off that messaging. Let's, you know, build more landing pages from it. It's not a gut decision that we're making, or someone has a new idea. The data is telling us that this is what our ideal customer wants. And we simply get to act on that. Okay. That totally makes, that totally makes sense. So what are the pros and cons of letting data guide our decisions? The biggest mistake that I see people make is tracking too much data that they're never going to take action on. So we've talked or you've heard a lot about vanity metrics, right? Somebody really tracking social media followers or things that you really aren't going to take action on, or they don't directly impact the bigger goals that you're trying to achieve. So I really recommend that you stick to three key metrics that, as a team, you are looking at every single week at an executive level, every single day at a department level. And then each person within the department has their own KPI. Right? Key Performance Indicator. So they know how they are progressing, what's working, what's not. And we can grow around it. But the biggest, I'll just reiterate, the biggest mistake I see is just tracking too much data because then you're just paralyzed and you don't actually take action on it. Why do you think that they track like so much data? Like, is it that they just, like, are they thinking that, is it maybe that they're thinking that they want to go in this direction and then after the data comes in, they change their mind and say, okay, well, it's not, you know, it's not a concern for us, so we're going to leave it for now? Yeah, I think it's actually somebody trying to validate their work. I think that they feel like they need all of this data to show that what they're doing is, I don't know, producing or valuable. But when you sit in a meeting, you can't make a decision from specific data points because it's not actually action-oriented data. Then now you're just wasting time. Okay. I could see a company saying, oh, you know what, you know, we took all this data, but because a lot of companies, I feel like they're, you know, people change their mind when they decide things. They get together, they have a meeting, this is what we're going to do. And then the next time they meet, five days later, everything changes. So there's continuous changes. And that usually happens when you have a lot of executives making the decisions, right? So it's almost like you're, you know, when you have a room of a bunch of executives, and you're going to have decisions that are going to change all the time. When you have only a few, they make the decisions, and then they push it, they forward it down to everybody else, and then it starts to roll. But I could see that it happening that, you know, okay, let's do this. And then they get it, and they're like, okay, I love what you said, validate it. But I could see too that, oh, you know what, I don't feel, maybe it's not as important. And maybe it's like you said, maybe it's because of the data, maybe they see the data, and they don't like it, they don't like the numbers. And for them, it becomes not important. So why push something that, you know, the data numbers are not good, why push it? Yeah, the other thing, you just brought up a really great point, is they may be looking at it in a silo. They may be looking at a data point, and saying, this isn't working. But it's really important to layer them on top of each other, and say, okay, well, maybe the quantity, the number of people converting into this isn't great. But the lifetime value, the revenue number coming from these people is much larger than the number of people converting into this. Because then the bigger quantity campaign that we're running, right? And so that's really important for the person who's presenting the numbers to be able to explain that. Because you're absolutely correct, the visionary, the executives, the CEOs, sometimes data is not sexy, and new ideas and shiny pennies are sexy, and they want to run down that channel. But I always say data allows us to win, and winning is really sexy. Right. It certainly is. There's nothing better than winning. And you can say it in different, you can say it in business, you can say it in sports, you can say it in, you know, in school, you know, when you're winning, it's always positive. For sure. I totally agree with you on that. 100%. So does data help guide leaders when it comes to making critical decisions? I mean, for example, should you keep a new hire or not? Right? Should you keep a new employee or not? Data isn't going to tell you that. There's not a there's not a KPI. There could be if it's a performance related, of course, but if it's a culture, right, if it you gut check at that point becomes really important. So I have to say as much as I love data, and as much as I use it to guide my decisions, there has to be balance. I was talking to somebody that I know who, who develops e-courses. And one of the things that just makes me think what you're what we're talking about here. She said there's a lot of companies who come to her and say, Oh, we need to develop this, you know, this e-course for employees because we're having trouble with this. And she says, Okay, well, you know, it might, you know, there's certain things that is going to help with that, you know, with certain with certain areas, and it's certain things that the e-course will help. So I'm thinking data there, like, if you're going to do an e-course for, let's just say, you know, the company is has a lot of employees that are unhappy with the way that things are going, they're not happy with decisions, they're not happy with management, they feel like it's an environment that they feel is unsafe to come to on a daily basis. So they want to do an e-course to help with the engagement. But in her mind, she's like, well, you could give everybody that e-course, but it's not necessarily going to fix the engagement. You know, you as a leader need to help to fix that engagement, that e-course might help a little bit. But it's not so the data is going to, I think, might show that a little bit, as far as if they were to do as far as what's the employee engagement? And what, you know, why are people unhappy? Is it, you know, management? Is it the lack of communication? Like, there's several things that people could be unhappy with, and decide to either stick it out or leave for that matter. So, just when you said it kind of made me think of that. And it's a prime example of, you know, the data does answer it, but it may not be it, or they're not using the data to figure out what the problem is. They're just thinking, okay, well, we're going to do an e-course. We need to put a Band-Aid on this situation when it's not really the answer. Yeah, I mean, that's a great point. And I think in those situations, doing a small test is always the best way to say is, you know, is the e-course the right thing? Let's do it quickly. Let's put it out. You know, it won't be perfect, but it's out. And let's see how people respond. And then to your point, you know, it may come back that engagement is low, and we still have the same problem. We put the e-course out. Well, good thing we didn't spend months on this. We spent days. And now we know, and now we can come back and go deeper into what is really the root cause of the issue going on. Great, great. What do you think the future looks like for using data to guide our decisions? What do you think the future looks like for it? Well, oh, my gosh. I mean, with AI and everything that's out there and all the tech that's coming out, I mean, it can just be incredibly overwhelming. So, I think the most important thing is for people who are not tracking, companies who are not tracking how their business is performing, not just the revenue, but the data that's indicating where that's all coming from, you have to start. Because what will happen is you'll only grow so much, and then you'll plateau, and you'll become frustrated about why you're not scaling at that point, why you're not growing. And anybody who's working on that team or consulting will need that historical data to make those decisions. Or now you're starting at step one of tracking data. I've worked with many clients where they've brought me in, and they didn't have tracking set up. And I set up tracking, and it takes, let's say, three months before that data starts coming in, and we can really start making decisions from it. So, I think hopefully people listen to this and say, I at least need to be tracking how my business is growing, how the activities I'm doing are working, and to allow yourself to not get caught up in all the ideas and the shiny pennies that visionaries just love to follow. No kidding, no kidding. So, Marty, if you could choose one word to describe yourself, what word would that be? Can I do two? I don't know if this is two or three. So, I always say one word, but if you have more than one word, that's totally okay. Okay, cool. Through this rebranding process I've been doing, they asked people who are around me who I've worked with to describe me. And one of the people said, Marty is a combination of kick-ass and namaste. And I just have been running with that because, you know, they seem like opposites. But that's 100% who I am. I'm this incredibly driven, you know, data-guided growth strategist. And at the same time, I am very spiritual. I am very much about self-awareness and understanding, you know, who we are and how we connect and how we communicate with each other and our areas of genius. So, that combination of the kick-ass and the namaste, that's exactly who I am. I love that. I love those two words for you. I think they fit you to a T. I would probably add compassionate as well because I feel like through this conversation, and not just through this conversation, but conversations that we've had, you have a lot of compassion for people and you have a lot of compassion for people that are kind of doing stuff and they are not happy with what they're doing. So, I feel like that would be another word for you as well. But I do like the kick-ass and the namaste one. I do think those fit you pretty well. I appreciate you saying compassionate. That hit me in my heart. Thank you. You're very, very welcome. You can just tell when someone is compassionate or when they're authentic or they're genuine that, you know, they genuinely care about people. You can just tell. And I could tell that right the first moment that I met you. I could tell that right away. Thank you. You're welcome. Any final thoughts today? I don't think so. I think, again, I just want to go back to the data of, you know, this conversation, you know, not many people talk about it because maybe it's boring, but it's really exciting if you start to track and see what's working and what's not and where you get to double down. So, don't be afraid of the data. I don't think it's boring at all. And I think there's a lot of people that are going to not think that it's boring at all. I think it's something that, I just think it's something that people, like you said, they don't think about it, I think. They just kind of come up with a decision, but they, you know, they don't use the data. And, you know, taking the data to figure out, make a decision is, you know, I feel is super important. And I feel like there's a lot of people out there who feel the same way as well. So, I don't think it's boring for one second. Awesome. Yay! I think it's a great topic. I wanted to take the time to thank you today, Marnie, for coming on. You are just such a hardworking, I said compassionate, so hardworking, compassionate, and I'd say you are very innovative in the ways that you're thinking, just by you telling us that you wanted to, you know, do a review of, I'm going to say it in English, I'm going to say it in layman's terms, you wanted to do a review of yourself and where you were going and what direction you were going in. And, you know, if there was any changes that needed to be made in that, you know, in the directions, and I feel that's a form of innovation. And there's not many people that figure that out. There's lots of people that will continuously go on and on and on because they're doing, everything is working for them. So, I don't, you know, I don't think that you did that because nothing was working. I felt, I feel like you did that because, yeah, this is working. But maybe if I change my way of thinking, that there's maybe some other ideas and some other things that might hit me and come into my brain. But when you're only, like, if you're going on a highway and you're going straight, and you're not turning left or right, you're going to keep going straight and you're going to keep doing the same things that you're doing. And sometimes it's good to kind of do a little bit of a reframe. I used to be one, for example, that used to, you know, like everybody, I used to come up with, you know, I'm going to, you know, especially New Year's, we all come up with our people do your New Year's resolutions. I used to be one of those people. I'm going to do this, I'm going to do that. And I stopped doing it a couple years ago. And what I do is I just, I pick a word and I say, this is my word for the year. And I just think of that word throughout the year. And it's, you know, kind of helps me and motivates me through the year. So my word this year is possibilities. So what are the possibilities? What are the things that can happen for me? And not because I'm just sitting back and waiting to see, but what could happen if I continue to do what I'm doing, and work at what I'm trying to do? What is possible is where I'm going. So, you know, I did a little bit of change like you. And I love it. And I've told people that and the people that I've told seem to think it was great as well. Yeah, I love that possibility. And what if, what if it works? What if it works? Because the things that I thought were, you know, the things that I thought I was doing, or the direction that I was going, has totally changed my thought process. And that goes back to probably thinking, because I feel like we're always harder on ourselves than anybody else. And I feel like, you know, I just thought, oh, this is gonna, I'm gonna do this, and this, that, and this is what's going to be and, you know, it's just going to be a casual thing. And then all of a sudden, things happen for you. And then you're like, oh, crap, like, it's, this is happening here. And it's happening at a rapid pace and faster than I anticipated that it was going to happen. So your thoughts change, and your ideas change, and you, you know, you're a little bit more motivated, and people are telling you stuff, and you're, every time you hear somebody telling you something, something nice, well, then it keeps you motivated to continue to do what you're doing, right? So I love that you did that for yourself. I think it's super, super important and super valuable. And I think more people should do that as well. Absolutely. We're in a constant state of growth and learning about ourselves and other people. And it's really a beautiful thing. It certainly, certainly is. So on behalf of myself and my guest, Marnie, I would like to thank you all for listening today. And until next time, be safe and remember everyone that if we all work together, we can accomplish anything.