Episode 8: A Tale of Resiliency from Three Continents

The main ideas from this information are: - The Pots, Pans and Gritos Podcast is a voice for English learners. - Sahar, an Afghan student, shares her culture and story of escaping the Taliban. - Many Afghan musicians are living in precarious situations due to fear of persecution. - The Taliban has reclaimed Afghanistan, leading to restrictions on women and religious minorities. - Sahar speaks multiple languages, including English, Danish, Spanish, Persian, and Arabic. - Sahar finds Danish and Spanish to be the most similar languages. - Sahar rates her fluency in Persian, English, Arabic, Danish, and Spanish. - Sahar enjoys learning languages through travel and reading books. - Sahar's favorite food is Mantu, a popular dish in Afghanistan. - Sahar introduces herself in Persian, Arabic, English, Danish, and Spanish. - Sahar's brother, Itris, will be in the same class next year. - Sahar has lived and attended school in We have no weapons. We only have pots and pans. We have no power. We only have pots and pans. Beat the pots. Bang the pans. This is our revolution. Welcome to the Pots, Pans and Gritos Podcast. A voice for the English learner. I'm your host, Nolan Shigley. In this week's episode, we hear the story of Sahar, an Afghan student at Salem High School, who shares her culture and unbelievable account of escaping the Taliban. Sahar arrived to my classroom mid-year, but quickly adjusted and excelled academically. In fact, Sahar just passed four end-of-the-year standardized tests in her fourth language. She finished the school year with straight A's and now has created a pathway to an on-time graduation with an advanced diploma. Along with the immense number of Afghans like Sahar's family seeking refuge are the musicians of Afghanistan. Today's soundtrack includes artists from Afghanistan who currently live in precarious situations within the borders of Iran, Pakistan and other neighboring countries in which they fear possible deportation. Those who wish to continue playing musical instruments have had to flee their home country or face severe persecution such as torture and or public execution. The album is called Afghan Music in Exile and was recorded in Iran and produced by Michael Gasco of Spain. The collection was released by Worlds Within Worlds, a record label that shares Eastern classical music and aims to keep the true Afghan culture and music alive. After 20 years of U.S. military involvement that protected the nation from its control, the Taliban has reclaimed Afghanistan and has led a brutal campaign against religious minorities and imposed extreme restrictions upon women once again. Girls are no longer found in schools and women no longer in the workplace. The economy is in shambles and malnutrition has created an unprecedented crisis. As the Taliban continued their attack on the airport in the capital city of Kabul, Sahar and her family miraculously boarded a plane and made their way west. And now here is her story. You are a multilinguist. So what are the various languages that you speak? Well, I can speak about five languages and I do understand. There are English, Danish, Spanish that I'm taking this year and Persian, of course, it's my language, native language and Arabic, yeah. Five languages? Yes. And you're learning Spanish this year? Yes. And it's so funny because in class are Latinos and, of course, the majority of our class are Latinos and their eyes get so big when they hear you speak Spanish. Yes, they're like, you are getting it. You already know a lot of things. I know. Here is this young girl in her hijab speaking Spanish Yes. So which language was the most difficult to learn? I think for me it was Danish. Danish was the hardest. They had a lot of like silent letters when they're writing was so hard and speaking. Silent letters are the worst. Yes. I think this is the most difficult language. Silent letters are the worst. And what's good for you in Spanish, every letter is pronounced, right? Yes. Exactly like my own language. Oh, but then English. So many silent, more silent letters. So which two languages do you think are the most similar? I think Danish and Spanish are the most similar ones. Really, why? Yes, because they have the same vocabulary. They have the same vocabulary? Yes, just like in Spanish we have like A-R-E-R-I-R verbs and the same way we have in Danish. And this is the most similarities between them. So let's rate your fluency. Obviously, Persian is your native tongue. Yes. What's number two? Number two, I would say English. English over Arabic? Yes, because, you know, I can say like I can order food or very basic things in Arabic. But I think English after Persian and then Arabic, I would say. Because we can read and write, of course, because we read Quran. And for speaking, I would say English. Wow, that's surprising to me. Okay, so what's four? What's four? Danish and then Spanish. Do you think Spanish is going to rise above one of those soon? Yes, I think it will rise above Arabic and Danish. Are you learning Spanish quickly? Yes, because the writing is so easy and I can speak it. And I have a lot of, you know, Latina friends. Yes, of course that helps. So what are some of your favorite strategies when learning a language? Some of my students use Duolingo or they listen to American music. What is something that helps you learn a new language? I speak a lot of language because of travel that we did. Like we travel in Europe and we had to learn Danish. And then, of course, in the United States, we have to, you know, know the English. And Arabic, the way I learned it was in, you know, different situations. But I would like to read books. And, of course, we read in Arabic a lot of times, you know that. So that's, I think, the best way you can learn a language. And I've caught you listening to K-pop before. Yes, I listen to K-pop, but not a lot of times. So is maybe Korean one of your future languages? Yes, I love to speak Korean, but they have a lot of English more than Korean. So, yes. What do you mean? Like their songs, they have a lot, yes. Oh, a lot more sounds than in English. Yes. Okay, so you think it's going to be a much, maybe a bigger challenge to learn Korean? Yes, I love Russian and Korean. But if I learn a new language, which I think I don't need to, but it will be Korean first. What are you going to do with all these languages someday? When I travel, I will speak in those countries. Especially Spanish, because, you know, Western Hemisphere. The entire Western Hemisphere. They're all. Yes, that's amazing. And you can speak two languages, too. Well, I can speak, but not always listen and understand. I wonder what percentage of the world you can communicate with now, based off of your five languages. I think you need to study Mandarin Chinese, and then you might be able to talk with the entire world. Chinese. I hear about Chinese as the hardest language. Like their native speakers didn't write so well. This is their own language. So, I would like to, but I think Korean and Russian is more, like, cute, and that's why I want to learn them. All right. Well, let's hear some of these languages. So, here's your challenge for the day. Sahar, I'd like you to introduce yourself in all five languages. Just a simple, hello, my name is Sahar. I'm from Afghanistan. I'm a student at Salem High School. And then, oh, I don't know. My favorite food is whatever. Are you ready? Yeah, I'm ready. I will start with my own language. All right. Persian. Yeah. Hello, my name is Sahar. I'm from Afghanistan. I'm a student at Salem High School. My favorite food is Mantu. All right. And, of course, I don't know these languages other than English and Spanish. So, we have her brother in the studio. So, was that correct? Okay, good. He's confirmed. Thank you. You are one of the most trustworthy students I have. I know you're not joking with me. Okay, what's our next language? Our next language, I think I'm going to go with Arabic because I know very basic things. Okay. Then we will move on. Hello, my name is Sahar. I'm from Afghanistan. I'm a student at Salem High School. My favorite food is Mantu. Beautiful. And now English. Now English. Hi, my name is Sahar. I'm a student at Salem High School. I'm from Afghanistan. My favorite food is Mantu. Mantu. We'll have to explain that in a moment. Okay, Danish. Danish. You want to hear some Danish? I do. Hey, I'm Sahar. I'm from Afghanistan. I'm a student at Salem High School. I'm a male. I'm from Mantu. I heard hey in Salem High School. It's actually, yeah. Oh, it's he. Okay. All right, final one. Your newest language. Yes. Español. Español. Vamos. Okay. Hola, mi nombre es Sahar. Yo soy de Afghanistan. Soy una estudiante en Salem High School. Mi comida favorita es Mantu. Very good. I'm terrible with Spanish right now. Whatever. You can order food. You can introduce yourself. That's basically, well, you can survive. So what is your favorite food again? Mantu. What is Mantu? Mantu is very popular food in my country. I think a lot of people love it. But yeah, this is my favorite. What is it? It's like we use a lot of vegetables and stuff. So it's like dumpling. Dumpling. Oh, yes. You explained to me that a lot of Chinese culture you can find within the food of Afghanistan. So this would be another case of it. Especially Korean. They have Koreans. They have dumplings, but they have like meat inside. Like not meat, but pork. So we can eat that. But we put vegetables and meat sometimes. It's so delicious. Because you are right on the Silk Road. Okay. You've already introduced yourself, and that's usually what we do now. I'm going to give you an opportunity in English to introduce your brother. Who is this guy? This guy, my brother, his name is Itris. And he likes to call him Itris PGR. I'll try to remember that one. Yeah. He's like the same as me. He didn't take a Spanish class, so he can't speak for now. Uh-oh. Oh, your sister is beating you. But he will take a Spanish class next year. Okay, good. So he can get that advanced diploma. Now, is your brother going to be in my class? Yes, he's going to be in your class next year. She's warned me about you. He's intelligent than me. Oh, I can't believe that. I'll have to judge for myself next year. Yes. All right. Well, I look forward to having you next year, little brother. Let's talk about education. You have not just lived in three different countries, but you've lived and gone to school on three different continents. Yes. Not many people can say that. So, Asia, Europe, and... And, of course, America. Yeah, North America. So what are the three countries you've lived in? My home country, Afghanistan, and then Denmark, and then we moved here in the United States. Describe and kind of compare the classroom setting, like the actual physical classroom. Classroom? Well, Afghanistan is the most different one. Like, we will sit in one class for all, like... We had the school for four hours, just like I told you. We have to go to school, like, afternoon from 1 o'clock to 5. And for four hours, we sit in class, and teachers will go to another class and then another class. Students have to sit in class, and teachers have to change. Oh, that's very interesting. Maybe I would like that. I don't know. Maybe I wouldn't like that. And when we moved to Europe and Denmark, the schedule was the same. We have a schedule for a week, and every week it was different. So we have, like, science class two times a week, and then math class maybe three times a week. It's not every day like United States. A days or B days, some of the schools that I went to. So it's different. The schedule was the same, but the schools were more similar to United States, so the students have to go to another classes. Okay. Yeah. And how is your experience here in the United States? In United States, I think I feel more comfortable in here because I can speak English. And, you know, I have friends in here. In Denmark, they actually don't like immigrants a lot. So I didn't make any Danish friends, but I had, like, friends from Romania, Bulgaria. They all come to Denmark to education. Education was, like, the most important in Denmark, and we had colleges for free. That was the reason I loved Denmark a lot. So Denmark, the classrooms were actually quite diverse. Yes. Yes. My class was, because I had a class, so I had to learn Danish. And math class, just like United States, we go to another classes, but the language class was diverse because we weren't with Danish people. Yes. So it was almost like, well, we would call it an EL class here, but obviously it would be maybe DL there. No, it's not DL. What about the technology? The technology? Well, we used to read books and write a lot, and we actually take the exams in papers. In which country? In Afghanistan. In Afghanistan. Yes, in my country. But in Denmark, you know, everything was in computer. Same, of course, here in the United States. Although in our class, we use a lot of computers. We don't have any books. We only have handouts, papers that teachers gave us, and that's all. But we had a lot of books, like six books with us. Did you wear uniforms? Yes. We had uniforms in Afghanistan, uniforms. But in Denmark, no. Because of the climate and weather, we don't have any uniforms. For our listeners that don't know what a hijab is, I know all of our listeners could recognize a hijab, but maybe they don't know this word. Can you explain what it is and why many Muslim females wear it? You have to cover your hair, and this is our religion. This is our faith. We have to wear a hijab. Okay, and then you choose to wear it here as well. Yes, I choose, of course. As a Muslim, everyone has to wear a hijab. If you're a Muslim, you have to. A lot of Christians don't realize, and a lot of Jews don't realize that early Jews and Christians actually wore the hijab as well. Any depiction of Jesus and his mother? Well, you see Mother Mary wearing a hijab. Yes, in the past, everyone, I think even Hinduism, they didn't wear to cover their hair, but they still have a kind of hijab in their hair. So kind of a symbol of your faith and maybe modesty for women. Describe your first experience of encountering, seeing girls your age and maybe women, not wearing a hijab in public. Yes, my first experience was in Denmark. Yes, the first time I saw a girl without hijab. I was shocked, but that was like my first experience. Then when I go to school and I see everyone, I think you feel something. You feel like... You felt very different? Yes, you feel like you were different, but they didn't care, so they didn't like immigrants a lot. I'm sorry. Was there a specific example you can describe? I mean, what makes you feel like they did not like immigrants when you were in Denmark? There was a girl. She was Muslim, but she didn't wear hijab. She was saying that she didn't have any friends in school, and she was born and raised in Denmark. Did you feel any racism toward you or any prejudice toward you? No, I didn't feel anything, but it seems like they don't like us. They didn't talk with us. Okay, and you made no friends while you were there, unfortunately? I did, like from another country. You spoke from other countries, but no Danish friends? No Danish friends. How did it feel being... You were the only Muslim, you said, in your Danish school? Yes, I was the only Muslim. I had a friend, but she came late. She was also Muslim, but she came late. At first, I was the only one. Were you there during Ramadan? Yes, I was there. They would keep asking me, Why didn't you eat anything? In the United States, everyone knows the religions, why they don't eat. They have a lot of information. But in Denmark, they would keep asking me, Why didn't you eat? It's time to eat. We had lunch together in my diverse class, I would say. We ate always together. But then they asked me, Why didn't you eat? It's time to eat. I had to explain to them. Do you feel like most people accepted you or understood what you explained? Yes, when I explained, they were like, Oh, okay. It seems like they didn't know anything about Islam. For a while, you thought you were the only Muslim here, but we actually have one Muslim from Sudan, and we have two Muslims from Pakistan here at Salem High School. But has your experience been a little different, being one of the few Muslims here in this community? It's way more better. It is better, good. It's better, and she's also fast. We talk, but we are not best friends yet. Yes, we talk. Do you feel like your time here in the Roanoke Valley and here in Virginia has been more accepting toward you than when you were in Europe? Yes, yes. In Virginia, our families are the most important ones because in Denmark, we were alone. You find Muslims very, very... They were very rare, and you didn't find any. But when we arrived here, of course, my aunts, my uncles, my cousins, every week, we have a big party. Do you have a local mosque here in the Roanoke Valley? Yes, we have a mosque. I don't know how far away it is from the school, but it's almost from 10 minutes. Okay, very nice. And you didn't find mosques nearby in Denmark. Oh, no mosques. No mosques. So I guess all your prayers would have been at home? Yes, it was at home. My dad would be an imam. Oh, your father? That's what I was about to ask. So your father kind of served as the imam. Yes, served as the imam, and then we were behind him. And of course, you have an imam here? Yes, we do have an imam here. So each Friday, we put on our headphones and we listen to the Pots, Pans, and Gritos podcast, and we have great discussions. But I feel like you are the biggest fan of our podcast. I look around the room. It's amazing, and it's very gratifying that the students are so into it. We have our resource class after our English class, so you and I continue our discussion, and you listen so intently, and you take it so seriously, and you have connected to so many of the stories. Because so many times you go, oh, I remember that happened to me, and that happened to me. But these are stories from Latin America. So far, all the stories have been from Latin America. This is our first story from any part of the world other than Latin America. But there was one story that impacted you and you felt the most connected to. It was with Dr. Jose Banuelos. He is our professor at Roanoke College, and he grew up in Mexico. And he described one day, I think they were sitting at the breakfast table, and his father comes home and says, we have to leave. Put everything you need in your mochila, in your backpack, because we're leaving soon. And that really impacted you because the same thing happened to you. Yes. When I hear that podcast, like I remember the day, it was like, I don't know, maybe 4 or 3 a.m., and my dad was like, we should leave and you guys should get ready. And it was 3.30. I'm like, I want to sleep. I don't want to go anywhere. But we had to. We packed anything we need, just like him, just like what he said. And then it was our breakfast. We just eat and leave. And of course, my aunt's house was in front of our house, and they were like saying goodbye to us and crying. I'm like, why are you guys crying? You're not going anywhere. I mean, I wasn't that old to understand. How old were you? I was like 13. You were 13. I was like, no, don't cry. We will be back. I never thought we would go to Europe. My dad didn't tell me we would go to Europe. He just said we have to pack anything you need and we will leave soon. So when I hear that podcast, it reminds me of that day. This has happened to me. When did you learn why you had to leave? Actually, in Denmark, Taliban was looking for people who work with Americans or people from outside the country. So we had to leave because of that. I didn't know it. My dad told us why we leave. My mom was so sad. She missed her family so much. What was the Taliban going to do? If they find out, maybe we were in big trouble if they find out that we leave. When they get inside in 2021, it was just horrible. I didn't know that it was happening. I didn't know anything. When we arrived in Denmark, my dad was looking for us and we had to leave. That's what happened. That's what this podcast reminds me of. It reminds me of that day. How were you able to escape? Actually, we went to the easiest way to escape. It was horrible. The Taliban didn't let people go to the airport. A month ago, my aunts just left Afghanistan. I was at the airport. Everything was unbelievable, like the trees, the way the airport was designed. When I got inside the airport, that day that we left, everything was just ruined. The Taliban ruined everything. They were destroying the airport so people could not flee. People could not escape. They didn't let people go out. They were looking for people who worked outside the country. That's why they didn't let them go. You said they were still attacking the airport when you left? Yes. They stayed for a month and then the people got quiet for a while. Have you heard from your family in Afghanistan since you've left? No, they didn't go outside. My uncles, they work with people, Americans. They're already in America. So, yes. What has been the impact upon girls and women since the Taliban retook power? They didn't let not only girls, but also boys, they didn't let them to education, educate themselves. So, they were like just the only thing, the important. When they said Islam, which is I hate, they always said like we are Islamic, but they are not. In Islam, they said like when someone is Muslim, even though he is from another nationality, you guys are brothers. How can a brother kill the brother? But they kill people when they say we are Muslims. This is so ridiculous. So, Sahar, what have been your favorite things about your new home here in Virginia in the United States? When I came here, the biggest thing that I love about the United States is freedom that people have. They can be like anything they want. They can do anything they want. And that is, I think, the most important thing in the country. And I love that from the United States so much. Is there anything cultural about the United States? Maybe cultural entertainment, music, food, clothing, television, sports? Yeah, I do like sports. I have been in soccer game in Denmark. I didn't have the opportunity to play soccer. I didn't have been learning here, and I think I will love it. And also, we went to a park with my uncles, and we played soccer every week. What do you want Americans to know or understand about your Muslim faith and your Afghan culture? I think the important one is Islam. And a lot of them, of course, don't have information about Islam because they were raised in a different country. But I want them to know we also worship one God. There's nothing else. When I introduce myself, they will look at me like I'm so different. They didn't know. But when they know, I think they didn't look like this. So I want them to know that. And for Afghans, I will say dry foods because it's amazing. And also, we have the ancient, the old language. And one of my classmates, when I said we have borders with China, he was shocked. Like, what are you saying? I was like, yes, we are so diverse. We have a lot of borders with other countries. That's why we have a mix like culture. That's what's special. That was Sahar, one of my newest EL students from Afghanistan. Like several stories we've heard and those that remain to be heard in our program, this is one of upheaval, but also one of resilience. Sahar's family narrowly escaped an oppressive regime to find themselves isolated in a community that lacked a Muslim connection. But thankfully, they were able to relocate and somehow root themselves in the Roanoke Valley of Virginia where a mosque, family members, and a school system with a growing diversity has embraced them. I'm so humbled when a student's life journey leads them to my classroom. I do not take for granted that I spend my day impacting youth from around the world. Of course, I'd be remiss if I did not tell you that they impact me as much or more as I influence them. Thank you, Sahar, for telling your story today. When a person like you is willing to share your experiences and culture, we all continue to strengthen our empathy and expand our views of the world. Thank you, Worlds Within Worlds, for providing this week's soundtrack and creating an archive of culture through your music. And thank you, listeners, for joining us today on another episode of Pots, Pans, and Gripos podcast. And as always, thank you for being an ally to English learners everywhere. 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