Poetry Podcast: Another One - Molly Timmerman and Ella Grace Saunders

The transcription is a conversation between two people discussing poems about tigers by Jorge Luis Borges. They discuss the symbolism of tigers and the power of interpretation in poetry. They also mention the personal connection the author has to the poems and how he portrays blindness as something powerful. They analyze two poems, "The Gold of the Tigers" and "Dream Tigers," and discuss the themes of imagination, dreams, and reality. The conversation ends with gratitude to the guest speaker and a closing statement. Hey y'all, back with another one. Today we have a little surprise. We have a guest with us. Give it up for the star herself, Molly Turman. Anyway, Molly and I have been pretty busy reading some poems lately. So Molly, would you like to start us off? Of course I would. So lately I've really enjoyed reading poems of the night by Jorge Luis Borges, especially the ones about tigers. That's so crazy, because I feel like I've only read about tigers lately, which is why I really want to talk to you about tigers. Oh, okay, okay, yes. So I've heard that two of your favorite poems are The Gold of the Tigers and Dream Tigers, and I was thinking maybe we could discuss those and maybe what tigers mean. We definitely should, and I'll start. So I'm going to read The Gold of the Tigers first by Jorge Luis Borges. The Gold of the Tigers. Up to the moment of the yellow sunset, how many times will I have cast my eyes on a stowaway-bodied tiger of Bengal? Toing and froing on its paced-out path behind the labyrinth's iron bars, never suspecting them to be a prison. Afterwards, other tigers will appear, the blazing-tired tiger of Blake burning bright, and after that will come the other golds. The amorous gold showers disguising Zeus, the gold ring which, on every ninth night, gives light to nine rings more, and these, nine more, and there is never an end. All the overwhelming colors, in company with the years, kept leading me, and now alone remain. The amorphous light and the inextricable shadow in the gold of the beginning. O sunsets, O tigers, O wonders, O myth and epic, O gold more dear to me, gold of your hair, which these hands long to touch. Wow, that's so powerful. I know, I just, I love reading this. One of my favorite things about poems, especially the ones in this book, are that they're so open for interpretation, like the translations can be said in so many different ways and have so different meanings depending on how it's translated. Yeah, I definitely agree, like there's so many things that can be meant when you're talking or reading about a poem, and it's really up to you to decide, but also making sure you hear the author's message. So, Molly, how do you feel about this poem? Well, this poem seems to be something that's really personal to him. He talks about his blindness and the colors and beauty still in his life as a blind man. Jorge Luis Borges relates to things he can still see, and as we know, the color yellow is a color he can still see. I think he is giving the color gold and the color yellow lifelike qualities by portraying it as a tiger, which is a powerful creature. It also shows the creativity in his work. I agree, I think it's just so cool that he takes tigers and puts them as the color yellow and gold just to show, even though he's blind, just for how powerful his life can still be and how creative he can still be with his writing. Anyway, thank you, Molly. Jorge said about blindness being something that is almost good and very insightful, so thank you very much. How about now I read Dream Tigers? Dream Tigers. When I was a child, I came to worship tigers with a passion. Not the yellow tigers of the Prada River and the tangle of the Amazon, but the striped tiger, the royal tiger of Asia, which can only be hunted by armed men from a fort on the back of an elephant. I would hang about aimlessly in front of one of the cages of the zoo, and I would print news encyclopedias and books of natural history for the magnificence of the tigers. I can still recall these illustrations vividly. I have trouble recalling the face or the smile of a woman. My childhood passed, and my passion for tigers faded, but they still appear in my dreams. In the unconscious or chaotic dimension, their presence persists. At these moments, I tend to think to myself, this is a dream, simply an exercise of my will. And since my powers are limitless, I am going to dream of the tiger. Under incompetence, my dreaming is never able to conjure up the desired creatures. The tiger appears, sure enough, but to a feeble tiger, a stuffed tiger, imperfect to form, or the wrong size, or only fleetingly present, or looking something like a dog or a bird. I think that this piece comes across as very personal to him as well. I believe that Dream Tigers is a poetic exploration of the power of imagination and the complex relationship between dreams, literature, and reality. The poem dives into the unobtainable aspect of existence, which is kind of symbolized by the use of Dream Tigers. He kind of contemplates the challenges of experiencing these ideas through his language and his poetry, or mixes real with imaginary stuff in his writing, which kind of makes it more creative and kind of dives into more of a creative approach, and how truth can be a bit tricky in his writing, which is kind of similar to life. Yeah, I totally agree. I think that he contrasts the common expectation that blindness is a curse by portraying blindness as a tiger, which I think is usually associated as a beautiful and majestic creature. Well, I think that is all for tonight, so thank you very much, Molly, for your time and for coming here to speak tonight. I think that we all enjoyed hearing what you have to say, so I'm looking forward to hearing from you in future episodes, so thank you so much for coming. Anyway, thanks, guys, for watching this video. We really appreciate all of your support. Come back for more episodes. Thank you. A special thanks to our poetry specialist and host of tonight's episode, Ella Grace Saunders, and to our editor and guest star, Molly Turman. This episode will be made possible without CapCut and Audacity, and tune in next time on another one for more amazing podcasts. Thank you. Thank you.