Q3-20080627-Larry_Rosenberg-IMSRC-taking_a_fresh_look_at_life_on_retreat_part_4-3767 Leandra Tejedor

Talk: 20080627-Larry_Rosenberg-IMSRC-taking_a_fresh_look_at_life_on_retreat_part_4-3767 Leandra Tejedor.json Start_time: 00:50:58 Display_question: It feels like the 21st century is much more complex, and I wonder if we need a different form of practice? Keyword_search: individual, interpersonal, practice, awareness, 21st century, ancient texts, suffering, Krishnamurti, social, self-centered, narcissistic, letting go, egomaniacs, sectarianism, India, Ajahn Cha, Thailand, present moment, complex medicine, inner simplicity Question_content: Questioner: First, I just want to say thank you because it's been a very good week. But this has come up for me before, particularly at the going home point. And that’s about…and I think it relates to the question in the back. In fact, the balance between the individual, and the interpersonal. And what I mean by that is, obviously this practice is very individual, in the sense that we don't communicate with people. Larry: This particular form of practice? Questioner: Yes Larry: The practice is all of life. But this formal practice. Questioner: Right. Yes. And I understand, I think, to some extent the notion of awareness, and that developing the awareness, is a very individual practice. You know, then you take that awareness, into your interpersonal experience. Larry: Exactly. Questioner: But still, there's something that feels. There’s some question I have about…. Larry: What is it? Take your time. Questioner: I’m struggling because there's a point that I want to make, and question I have. Can I make the point briefly? Larry: Sure. Questioner: You said something about a dharma of the 20th century. And I was thinking about the Archer, and he puts the arrow up, and I was thinking now, maybe I'm wrong about this, but like you say, this isn't about history, okay, this isn't academic. It's just an idea. In those times, people kind of were born into what they were, pretty much. Life was much simpler. In the 20th century, it just feels like there should be… Larry: 21st Questioner: 21st. I’m old too. An element of the practice, that's practicing for this much more complicated, interpersonal, free choice everything, world that we live in. Larry: Exactly. But look, one thing that helped me a lot, is reading ancient texts. And you see that the ancient mind suffered just as much as we do. But what you're saying, the content is different, the challenges were different, but people were tormented in different ways, that it's not problematic for us, but what we have what they didn't know anything about. Now, for the moment, whatever you say, how could anyone disagree with you? But what we've been trying to say is, whatever your life is, not as an abstract, sociological, socio historical conclusion, but from moment to moment, in your actual life. Break_line: And this was the second thing that Krishnamurti said to me, which I neglected to mention. Before going home he said, (this was when I first met him). He said, “pay attention to how you actually live." And he said, actually, it was like a loudspeaker, exclamation point. Capital letters, neon. How do you actually live, not how do you think you live, how you should live, how your mommy told you to live, how do you, from moment, to moment. It's not a global concept, it's not something, it's a fact. In this moment, this is the way I am. In that moment, that's the way I am. So in this sense, there's always been awareness, there's always been suffering, there's always been… in other words, what people were greedy, and hateful, and ignorant about were different, but they still suffered, because you can suffer over anything. Wealthy people suffer over, have the suffering of wealthy people; poor people suffer the suffering of being poor people. Do you see what I'm getting at? Questioner: Yes. Larry: Okay, so are the conditions more complex? Absolutely. But awareness…maybe this will help. First of all, the distinction between, let's say, individual, and social, maybe that's been overplayed. For example, another question that beginners often ask, I don't know if it's on any of your minds is, they'll say, well, isn't this a rather self-centered practice? Narcissistic. You're sitting there, is this all about me? It can be. And it can be easily misused where, as an escape from facing the challenges of being in the world, which is not so easy to be alive, usually for everyone, often. But when you work on yourself, the only thing you have to offer the people in your life is, you're always putting your signature on everything. So, it isn't a self-centered, self-preoccupied, it needn't be, because as you start clarifying who you are to yourself, and letting go, letting go, letting go, that's who you bring to the people in your life. You can't give them anything you don't have. You can pretend you are, or work to strive to appear, as if you are. Break_line: So, in that sense, when you take care of yourself, it's the acrobats that Matthew was talking about. Like if you take care of yourself, you are taking care of the people in your life. If they take care of themselves, they have a better chance of taking care of you. And the world is us. If we don't like the way the world is, it's made up of people. Who created this world? Just other people like us. Now, at this point, there are 6 billion egomaniacs, roaming the planet Earth. They're going to be more, apparently, what we've been told, like we don't have enough. Break_line: Okay now, unless we learn as, and we also shrink communication, we're all in each other's faces, and sectarianism getting stronger, and stronger. I'm a this, you're that. So, there's something going on here, that is very dangerous. The world gets smaller, and smaller, trade boundaries of countries are starting to be less relevant, and international. And we can communicate, in a split second, to the other side of the globe. And sectarianism is growing. I'm a this, you're that, get out of here. We have to learn something new. The old ways of living, they never work that well anyway, we've been killing each other off for thousands of years. You think it was great. At ancient India, if you read what was going on, they were just killing each other with arrows, bow, and arrows, and knives, and hating each other, and suffering, the same as us. It wasn't so different. But it is definitely our challenges. A lot of it is, complexity. Break_line: So, here's what I'm… Ajahn Chah, who is just a very simple… from a farmer background from Thailand, who came here, just for a few weeks, when the center first opened up. And he would say a few times, and it stuck with me, and it's been so helpful. He would just say, “keep it simple and stick to the present moment.” We were all very intellectual people, and I'm living with someone, and he doesn't, but she doesn't. He wants a rhesus monkey to be with liberty… keep it simple, and stick to the present moment. And it's been just extraordinary. Now, I say it a lot, and of course, because we want complex medicine, to heal complex disease, maybe what we need is, some inner simplicity. The complex world doesn't show any signs of going away. So maybe if we get simpler, maybe we can navigate a little bit more, skillfully. But the challenge is, you put it very well. Yeah. End_time: 00:58:53