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Jamie Allman interviews MO Senator, Bob Onder, MD, procurator for the canon law contestation of the St. Louis Archdiocese's plan to eliminate about half of the parishes in the diocese on the Jamie Allman Radio Show.
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Details
Jamie Allman interviews MO Senator, Bob Onder, MD, procurator for the canon law contestation of the St. Louis Archdiocese's plan to eliminate about half of the parishes in the diocese on the Jamie Allman Radio Show.
Comment
Jamie Allman interviews MO Senator, Bob Onder, MD, procurator for the canon law contestation of the St. Louis Archdiocese's plan to eliminate about half of the parishes in the diocese on the Jamie Allman Radio Show.
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The speaker discusses the reorganization plan of the Archdiocese of St. Louis, called "All Things New," which aims to close or merge approximately 100 out of 178 parishes. This restructuring is being carried out by consultants from Philadelphia without fully considering the unique characteristics of each parish. The speaker emphasizes that these churches, both Catholic and non-Catholic, are essential pillars of the community, and their closure will have a significant impact. The lack of transparency, disregard for church law, and failure to involve those affected by the decisions are major concerns. The speaker encourages listeners to visit the website SaveOurStLouisParishes.org for more information and to sign the Procurator Mandate, which opposes the reorganization plan. The speaker also shares their personal experience of reaching out to the Archbishop and receiving no response. Ladies and gentlemen, I have to tell you, there are so many people out there pulling the heroics as it relates to saving some of these parishes that are possibly on the chopping block from the archdiocese as it does its reorganization plan. Dr. Bob Onder, Senator Bob Onder, how you doing, my friend? I'm doing well, Jamie. Good morning. Good morning to you. I forgot. What's the name of this plan again? The sweet little name they gave it? It's called All Things New, which is presumptuous, Jamie, because our Lord Jesus Christ makes all things new, not some woke consulting firm from Philadelphia. Yeah. Just to backtrack before we get on to this effort to save St. Gianna Parish, this whole reorganization was rooted, really, it's happening all over the country, and these guys are these cookie cutter consultants that come in, they have their big plans, and then they have their big listening session stuff. It's all cooked up in one high tower someplace in Philly, as you point out, and then they disperse it all throughout the land. All these dioceses around the country basically line the pockets of these guys, and they come in, and they have no idea what that particular archdiocese is all about, what the churches are all about. I mean, it's just so sterile, and St. Gianna is a good example of that, correct? It is, Jamie, but of course it's not just St. Gianna. We have 178 parishes right now in the Archdiocese of St. Louis, and they plan to close or merge at least 100 of those parishes. So anyone in your listening area who is Catholic should know their parish, even if not on the chopping block, will be dramatically affected, whether it be an influx of new parishioners to their parish or to their school. But in most cases, in 100 out of 178 cases, you are, your parish is itself on the chopping block. And, Jamie, this has relevance to our non-Catholic listeners, too. In fact, I spoke at an event on Saturday, and the host of the event, who kindly supplied his banquet space for the event, was Lutheran, and he remembers growing up and participating in CYC sports, going to dances, going to bowling events at the local Catholic church. So really, our churches, Catholic, non-Catholic, our synagogues are the pillars of our community. They are a big part of what makes the St. Louis area a very special place. And to just indiscriminately destroy 100 of 178 parishes, because maybe, I don't, and the archdiocese won't say why they're doing this. I suppose it looks better on an organizational chart, or you sell all those assets and the cash on hand balance looks better. I don't know what the reason is, but it is going to be devastating to the people of our region. Man, I gotta tell you, anecdotally, I was a public school kid. I would never have played soccer or basketball, poorly, if it weren't for Christ the King in New City, right down the street. And so, yes, to your point, and if anything, we could all talk about, you know, listen, I don't care whether it's a synagogue, whether it's another church of any other kind, it improves the community, it helps your property values, you know? I mean, it's a community, and it's part of a community, so the more people worshiping whatever it happens to be, the better. And so it definitely has value, and plus, there's nothing worse than just watching, seeing an empty church. I realize some people throw them into bars or whatever, but you know. Well, it's sad. You know, and the thing I'll tell you, Jamie, from my time in politics, and that's how most of your listeners know me, as a state senator in St. Charles County, at the end of my eight years leaving because of term limits, but if there's one thing I've learned from public life, it's that, number one, always be transparent, because if people don't know, don't trust that you're giving them the whole truth, they wonder what you're hiding from them. Number two, always follow the rules. If you don't follow the law and follow the rules, you're no longer a servant, you're acting like a tyrant. And number three, always involve those who are affected by your decisions. And with all things new, this Slash and Burn restructuring program out of Philadelphia, the Archdiocese of St. Louis is not doing any of those three things. They're having pretense-to-listen sessions, but they've already had those listening sessions, they already laid out their plans, they've already made their plans. They're not following church law, canon law, and the rules in dozens of different ways, and they're certainly not – they're giving lip service to listening, but they're not truly involving the priests and parishioners who are affected by these decisions, much less the broader community of non-Catholics. Well, I worked for the Archbishop back in the day when there was the first parish reorganization. I've already told the stories about how political it all was. At that time, Archbishop Burke was new, he left it up to the deaneries and all that kind of stuff, and that's just the way the hierarchy goes in terms of dedicating people to other work. But I remember hearing from people at the time, and these were people who were higher ups in the church, and they said explicitly, we would rather have a smaller Catholic community that's more dedicated than a larger one that isn't. And I remember hearing that, and it was kind of a nightmare for me because it was a means where you knew they had – it definitely was an effort to just kind of consolidate and basically just turn away people instead of actually building a better, bigger community. Well, that's right. That's right, Jamie. You know, this is all about evangelization. Our Lord told us to go and preach the gospel to all nations and to baptize them in the name of the Father and the Son of the Holy Spirit. But what happens is – and again, since you were involved in the 2005 closings and reorganizations, that involved a tiny fraction of the number of churches that All Things New anticipates closing. A hundred today. It was, I think, fewer than a dozen back in 2005. You know how devastating that is. Statistics nationwide show that when you close someone's Catholic church, somewhere between 25 and 65 percent of those parishioners never attend Mass again. That's not evangelization. That's really a gutting, a destruction of the Archdiocese of St. Louis. And again, it does not follow church law, and the process has been anything but transparent. Yeah, no doubt about it. Dr. Bob Hunter, is there any way – like, where can we get a really clear amount of information about what's going on, what your efforts are like? Is there some place, some website or some place we can go? Absolutely. Okay. Absolutely, Jamie. So the name of the group is SaveOurStLouisParishes.org. So it's S-O-S-T-L-P dot org, or Google Save Our St. Louis Parishes. And that will bring you to a website where you can find out more about this effort and what you could do. And the main thing you could do is go and sign something called the Procurator Mandate, which names a class representative, which happens to be me. I've volunteered for that duty to oppose this really massive Carl Icahn-type dismantling of the Archdiocese of St. Louis. So there's a document there called the Procurator Mandate, which basically just names me as the person that would represent the anti-all things new Catholic community in St. Louis as we strive to hold the Archdiocese to the rules and to the church law regarding these matters. Now, I know that you are probably a very visible member of the Catholic Church. Do you get anybody kind of pushing down on you on this, because you're very visible? Yeah, yeah. Well, Jamie, as soon as we had our listening session at St. Gianna back in November, a few days later I wrote to the Archbishop and carbon-copied vicar, Chris Martin, who's been assigned to this horrific program, and I have not heard from either the Archbishop or Chris Martin. Of course, I left all my contact information in that letter, and as you know, it's not hard to find Dr. Bob Onder. So no, and other Catholics have had the same experience. I know people who have written a dozen or more times to vicar Chris Martin and to Archbishop Brzezanski and received no response. So this is the opposite of listening. This is really a cookie-cutter plan out of Philadelphia imposed from on high on the people of this Archdiocese to devastating effect. Yeah, and I am absolutely sure of that, but I'm glad you guys are doing this, and save our St. Louis parishes, and you can just Google it and do whatever, and you can find out exactly what's up and about what's going on with your parish and everything else. So Dr. Bob Onder, thanks a ton for being with us, appreciate your courage, and love having you on. Thank you. Thank you, Jamie. Again, S-O-S-T-L-P dot org. Thank you, Jamie, and Merry Christmas. Hey, Merry Christmas to you. Senator Bob Onder. Now, yeah, I was with – so I worked at the Archdiocese back then. It was in between my TV radio days and got back, left TV to work for the Archdiocese and then worked for Archbishop Burke at the time as a spokesman for him and communications director down there. And so I eventually went back to only radio.
