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The Dragon's Lair podcast discusses the recent game between Dragons RFC and Poe. Despite losing, the Dragons put up a good fight and showed promise. There are concerns about players potentially leaving due to financial issues in Welsh rugby. The podcast also mentions the sad passing of Newport legend Brian Price. Overall, the game was encouraging and there were positive performances from some younger players. Welcome to the Dragon's Lair. Hello and welcome to the Dragon's Lair podcast, your home, all things Dragons RFC and rugby in the region. I'm Jamie and joining me as always is my co-host Gavin Thomas. How are you doing, Gav? Yeah, I'm very well, Jamie. We'll talk about the game a little bit, but we didn't disgrace ourselves in France. I don't want to say there's green shoots, but you can almost see some bits of hope as well. We're going into the new year almost positive. Yes, I mean it was rather Dragonsy how we lost the game, but there is positives to take out of it as we'll talk about later. Okay, so you can find us on platforms such as Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Castbox and the Sports Social Network. And if you like what we do, please rate us and leave us a kind review. It really does help the pod. There's a review that we had on Apple Podcasts. We've only had one review, but it's a very nice review and I like to read it too because it's pretty cool when you get feedback like this. So this is from Bo Boy and he says this. Amazingly in-depth weekly podcast about all things Dragons. If you're like me and listen to all things Welsh rugby, then you know the Dragons are very much underrepresented in the Welsh media. So it's really refreshing to get all the up-to-date news about the Dragons. Keep up the good work guys. Which is a really nice thing to take out, isn't it? That's a nice review. Yeah, it's nice to know we're not talking into the voice. People are listening to us and they're liking what we're doing. So it's all good. It's all good. The only review we ever got for the horror podcast was, can you please stop this immediately? Oh no, really? That was the exact words. Oh, it's a great podcast. I love your horror podcast. You haven't done one for ages though, have you? You haven't really put one out? No, no. Well, we've got five to come out, don't we? It's because Grav's very busy with his rugby at the moment, with his rugby podcast. Yes, yes. He's a very busy guy. Okay then, so let's start off. Before we talk about the game, let's start with some news. And we talked about Leon Brown being linked with a move to the English premiership with Bristol Beith. That's what the rugby paper reported a couple of weeks ago. There's another Dragons player that's been linked with a move to the English premiership and that's Aaron Wainwright. So the rugby paper reporting that Bristol are one of the clubs understood to have spoken to him. Leicester are also believed to have spoken to him. Aaron has won 46 caps, and has made 99 appearances for the Dragons, but he could quit because of a cash crisis among the Welsh regions. So that's two of our players now that have been linked with moves to the English premiership. We've spoken about Leon, but if we lost Aaron Wainwright, that would be a huge blow wouldn't it, Gav? The thing is, with that, it's all just press stuff, isn't it? I don't know if Fissler was in this report because I wouldn't trust anything he says as far as I could throw a sofa. It doesn't take a world-class journalist, which he isn't, but it doesn't take a world-class journalist to work out the clubs might be interested in one of the best players in Wales. And the fact there is a financial crisis in Welsh rugby, and putting those two things together. Yeah, I mean it is worrying though, isn't it? Because Aaron is out of contract, as we know, at the end of the season. And the question is, are we going to have the money to keep him? Because there's something else he mentions in this report. I mean, I don't know if this is true or not, but what they're saying in the rugby paper is, they're saying that a lot of international players are only being offered deals between £60,000 and £80,000 in Wales. And while they're looking for starting props at £100,000 and £130,000. I mean, if you're only offering deals between £60,000 and £80,000, they could then double that in England. And it's really worrying. We have the money and resources to keep hold of our best players. So I think there must be some truth in it. But like you say, it could be press talk, it could be agent talk. But make no mistake, there are clubs who's going to be sniffing around the likes of Aaron Wainwright, because he is a world-class player. Yeah, Wainwright is a clear one, isn't he? He's a top-class back-row player. He's got a bit of versatility. He can play anywhere in the back row. Of course he'd want him at your team. Yeah, I think we'd have a real fight to keep hold of him. But I would be gutted to lose Wainwright, I have to be honest. He has become one of my favourite Dragons players over the years. And whilst I understand if he was to move, I get it, that's fair enough. New opportunity, more money, I completely appreciate that. But I would still be gutted if it happened. And fingers crossed he doesn't. But I perfectly understand though if he did go, Gav, given the current climate and what it should be at the moment, isn't it? Yeah, and if you look at the money you can earn in the French Second Division, Thomas Francis is earning more than he was at Ospreys. North is earning more than he was at Ospreys. Sam Davies is earning more than he was at Dragons, all playing in the French Second Division. Yeah, you've got to go where the money is, haven't you? Yeah. Yeah, we'll see what happens. Like I said, it could be agent talk, it could be paper talk, but no doubt Aaron is going to be a man in demand because he is a quality player. He is one of the players we really should be putting out all the stops for, I think. Do you not think though, if the crisis is that bad, the WRU are going to have to look at how it's organised, isn't it? And in reality, can Welsh rugby maintain four professional clubs operating at that level? In reality, that's the question. Well, that's a question that's been asked for many years. It's a question that's going to continue to be asked, isn't it? I definitely think we need to look at the salary cap, because that's going down to £4.5 million next year. And to me, that's just completely ridiculous. I don't know how we expected to compete on such a measly salary cap like that. It's just ridiculous. We're way behind the English clubs and the French and the Irish and Scottish clubs as it is. I just think if you reduce the salary cap further, it makes it very difficult to not only keep your best players, but also sign really good players. And there's tough times ahead, isn't there? But it's also very likely that we are going to be losing players that we really don't want to lose. So I think that needs to be looked at. I really do think it needs to be looked at. Because we won't replace him. How are you going to replace him? No, no. He's been a brilliant player for us. He is a Newport boy as well. You want to keep hold of your local talent, especially when you're as good as Alan. But we'll just see how it goes. But yeah, fingers crossed we can keep him. OK, got some sad news now, unfortunately. So Newport legend Brian Price, who captained the Black & Ambers to victory over the All Blacks, has died at the age of 86. The forward from Derry, near Fargo, is one of the all-time Raleigh Parade greats after making 252 appearances for Newport. He played for Crosskeys first, and then he made his Black & Ambers debut at Leicester in April 1960. Price also won 32 caps for Wales, winning the Triple Crown in 1965 and 1968, and he toured Australia and New Zealand with the British Lions in 1966, playing 17 games, including four tests. So that was the news that broke last night. That's very sad news, Gav. Fine player, wasn't he, back in the day? Oh, absolutely, yeah. My dad spoke very highly of him, played against him a number of times, and just said, yeah, real hard-ass nails, but real gent as well. Yeah. You know, he's not a young man, but it's still a shame, you know, and it's still a shame for the club and the rugby community. Yeah, absolutely. Our condolences go out to the family and Newport RFC. And like Llanelli, we don't feel the need to mention that we beat the Old Blacks, you know. They didn't beat the Old Blacks today, Llanelli. Well, you know, they're very quiet about it, but if you dig deep enough, you'll find out they do it. Well, they should have said something, shouldn't they? You know, in between naming a beer after it and the musicals and the plays and the TV shows and the podcasts. Oh, dear. Yeah, OK. So, yeah, that's the news wrapped up. Let's get into the game then. Now, I have to confess, I've only seen two-minute highlights of this on YouTube. I didn't see the game because this was behind a payroll. You had to go on the EPCR website and pay seven quid to watch it. So I didn't see it because I was out anyway on Saturday night. But it was Pole 24, Dragons 21. It was the last-minute heartbreak for the Dragons as they were edged out right at the last minute. They scored deep at the end there to snatch the win. So Dragons made nine changes for this game, which later became 10 because of the late withdrawal of Bradley Roberts and friend of the pod, James Benjamin, started. And to be fair, he took his try really well. So it's a kick-off for Kai Haefens. Everyone just sort of stopped for some reason. Poe was sleeping. He grabs it and he just shoots his way straight to the try. That was really good gas from Jumbo, in fairness. So I was pleased to see that. But, you know, the encouraging thing is we sent a much-changed Dragons team to push Poe all the way like that at their home ground. And this is a team, guys, that hasn't lost in the top 14 at home. That's very encouraging for me. And this was a team that also had youngsters such as Ewan Rosser, Brodie Coghlan, David Yendell, Brian Woodman and George Young. So, you know, there are positives to take out of this game. And it was also good to see the likes of Kai Haefens returning, Gonzalo Bertranu, Tame Basham returned and Rodrigo Martinez as well came off the bench. I have to say, though, I was really disappointed with the tries that we conceded. They were soft tries, again. There was one just on the stroke of halftime. There was an over-throw line-out. Teddy Garrison, and all he had to do was just to hold on to it for a few seconds so he could have some support at the back and to clear the lines. And then for some reason just throws this wild sort of pass. They gather it and then they go over the line. And it's just things like that, you know, those errors we talk about, those bad decision-making decisions, you know, that really cost and hurt us. But, you know, Kai Haefens played well. I think he kicked 11 points from the boot. We scored a lovely driving ball try through George Young. It's always good to see dragons scoring from a driving ball, isn't it? He was a 10 as well, wasn't he, Kai Haefens? He was playing a 10, yeah, that's right. So, yeah, we come away with a losing bonus point for our efforts. But after the game, Dave Langdon said, our errors are through the roof. Aren't they just, you know? For the three tries that we conceded, we were in control of all three of them and we need to be better. And Gonzalo Birgeneau also said on the Dragons website, we put in loads of good effort in with a very young team against one of the top teams in France. But we must be smarter in crucial moments of the game. Games last 80 minutes, so we need to make better decisions and be a tough team to beat. See, Gonzalo knows, doesn't he? He knows. And we've been saying that. We've been saying that all season. You know, it's just that lack of decision-making. Yeah, and look, I said this on the RAP pod last night. I'm getting really tired now of saying the same thing every week with regards to the errors. They're happening every week. And, you know, Dave Langdon is obviously aware of it. He said, our errors are through the roof. Gonzalo knows about it. He says we need to be smarter. Why do we keep making errors week in, week out? What's it going to take for the players to learn to stop doing these errors? These are professional players. It does lack leadership. You've been saying that a lot as well, haven't you? Yeah, because ultimately you need somebody who's just going to grab hold of the situation. I think playing Kaya Penn is a good idea. We can play Jordan at full-back and bring Will on, because I don't think Will's in a position to be managing games for 80 minutes. No. Yeah, I'd like Steph as a player, if he's a captain. I'm not sure. It's just frustrating though. When I do two podcasts, I do the rap part, and then I come on here and there with you and we talk about the Dragonscape. And I don't want to be saying every single week about the errors, because it's boring for me to talk about, and it's boring for everyone else to listen to. But we just keep making the same errors week in, week out, and it's really annoying the hell out of me now. It's just so frustrating. I don't know how they're going to tidy it up and sort it out. I don't know how you solve it. Where do you get that leadership from? Because we don't have it in our player group, it would appear. And I know we've got a leadership group, but they don't seem to be providing much leadership. That was a game we should have won. But again, we aren't killing games off. Bonus point, I'll take that. But imagine if we'd had two wins. Oh, that would have put us in a very, very good position. I mean, to be fair, we are still in a good position. So here's the thing. So we're third in the pool. We know that, I think it's four out of six teams, isn't it, qualify. So we're third in the pool. We're on six points. Now, the Sharks are in second. They're on seven points. And the Cheetahs, to their credit, they're top of the pool. They've won both of their games. They're on nine points. So we're still in a very good position, with our next game being Zebra away from home. And that's a winnable game, and that's a game we really should win. I know Zebra are improving, and they had a good win against Doha. But that's a game we've got to win. And if we do win that game, we should be more or less in the knockout stages. But we want to guarantee that we get home a home tie in the last six games. We don't want to be on the road. We won a game at Bronnie Gray for financial reasons, as well as having a better chance to win a total as well. So that's what we want. I think for me, Gareth, it's mixed emotions. Yes, it was a great effort by a young team. They did push a very good team all the way. But it is a missed opportunity, and yet again a service. And that's disappointing for me, that we just keep making these errors week in, week out. So it really is mixed emotions for me. But I'm glad we came back with something, because if we came away with this game with nothing, that would have been pretty tough, and it would give us a bit of a mountain to climb. Yes, mixed emotions for me. Proud, but also disappointed, because there's still a loss. There's still an error-prone performance. Ryan Woodman is coming through, and Ryan Woodman seems to be cementing a place for himself in the team, which is good. Absolutely. On the Dragons' website, Luke Yendle gets a very good write-up. So he came on to replace Chris Colman, who really should be above him in the pecking order. I've said this before. I like Luke Yendle. I know he's young, I know he's raw, but he's a decent scrummager, and I like to see him being given more opportunities. He came on for Colman, did very well, but the scrum penalty was solid in defence, apparently. So that's very pleasing, isn't it? And George Young coming off the bench and scoring that try, with a driving wall. Ewan Rosser as well is kicking on nicely, isn't he? He's not in the real deal. The young players are, you know, really starting to... But I think you blood the likes of Luke Yendle and Rosser, whereas Woodman, I would start him. Right now, we're not fitness. Have we got a better six than him? No, we don't. Well, we have got Liddy yet, but he's just not available at the moment, and he doesn't have much luck with injuries. No. And then you play Kane at seven, proper seven, play Aaron at eight, and you play Ryan Woodman. Apparently, he can cover all three positions. I think next season, we'll be seeing a lot more of Ryan Woodman at six. I think he will be the starting six, because I'm not sure if Liddy is still going to be with us. No. Next season, he's 36, so we need to cut the budget. I'd select him. So far, we haven't really... You would select him anyway, would you? Yeah, I'd select him over Liddy, no. Yeah, from what I've seen of him, he does everything I want a six to do. He tackles well. He's not disruptive at the rack, but he hits enough racks for me at six. But he's got nice hands as well. His link play is good, and he's got good awareness. He can take himself up into those wide channels, and he's quite difficult to defend up there. Yeah. Yeah, he's definitely going to the future. I'm a big fan of his. And I've said, he always looks to screw a gap, doesn't he? When you've seen him this season, he's fitted in so well. He hasn't really locked out a place, or out of his depth, like maybe some youngsters can do. Some youngsters you see at other regions, and even at our own club, you think, oh, you're not quite ready yet. You need a bit more time to settle in. But he's physical as well. His defence is really good. So, yeah, one for the future there. And his development is particularly pleasing to see. Right. Shall we have a look then at the mailbox? We haven't got many comments, but we have been getting some comments. So the Rodney Road Twitter account asks, well, we've literally just answered this, I think. Which of our youngsters have impressed you the most? So we've talked about Brian Woodland just now. Are there any other youngsters, Gav, that's impressed you this season? I think he's all right in a difficult situation. He's just been shacked in the knee. And I think he's thrown himself at it. I think Luke Yendle has looked good whenever he's come on. Proper old-fashioned tight edge. You know, gives himself a bit of... Gets himself around a bit. Yeah, I think it's more about the level of promise. I don't think anyone's really fulfilled it yet. I think Ryan Woodman is the most likely to fulfil that promise. And when you look at the level of promises, there's Ewan Ross, there's Harry Ackerman, George Young. They're all coming through and looking decent players. Do we just blood them? Do we just blood them for this season? And then they'll be ready for next season when we'll have no internationals left anyway. Yes, a fair point. I agree with all the players who mentioned it. We have got very talented youngsters. And it's good to see them being given the opportunity. Like I said, for me, Ryan Woodman has been a huge blessing. I'm also impressed with, as I mentioned earlier, Luke Yendle and Ewan Ross as well. Harry Ackerman is highly rated by a lot of coaches, especially at the club game. And he's one for the future. We have got the likes of Will Reid and we forget, and Ivan Owen as well. They've been around a little while now, haven't they? But they're still very young. Who are coming through. And I think because of the situation we're in, we're having to blood them. But we've seen with Ryan Woodman, it's having an impact. But it did with Harry Keady as well. They blooded Harry when he was relatively young. And we played Tractics when he was 16. Do you remember that? Yes. 16 years old. That's when you think about it, isn't it? Can't do that in England. Having been 17 to play an adult rugby in England. Yeah, I know. Right, here's another question. This is an interesting one. Now, this is purely a hypothetical one. But West Country Dragon asks, if there was no salary cap and unlimited funding, I mean, chance would be a fine thing, wouldn't it? So, no salary cap and unlimited funding, who would be the first person you would bring in? So, if you could sign any player in the world, basically, who would you bring in to the Dragons? I wouldn't bring in a player. I would bring in a coach. I would bring in Sean Edwards. Oh, right, okay. Yeah. I mean, he would certainly improve our defence, wouldn't he? If you would like to think. Yeah. Player? I'd bring Will Rowlands back. Will Rowlands, yeah. That'd be nice, wouldn't it? I would go for a lock as well. I would go for Iban Etzebeth. Oh, yeah. If money was no object, I would go for Iban Etzebeth, personally. But, yeah, that's a void that we're always going to have, isn't it, with Will Rowlands going, because big bastard locks like that, they just don't grow on trees. They're very, very hard to get, and they're very expensive. You just need a big, horrible bastard at lock, and we don't. You know, Matthew Screech just set record amount, or second highest amount of fixtures. Great, you know, lovely bloke. He's really not horrible enough, and that's what he was, yeah. I will admit Etzebeth is probably a step up from Will Rowlands as well. That would just be my choice, yeah. Or Sleiman, or any of those big, horrible, South African second rows. They'd all do a job. Sleiman's never fit, though. He's always bloody injured, isn't he? He's got the Leinster now. Yeah. That is an absolute heel move in WWE style, isn't it? They should have done a full WWE solo, not announce it. And then, just before kick-off Munster-Leinster, music starts up, screams RG Sleiman, and he runs out to the Munster shirt and rips her off to reveal a Leinster kit. Properly go for the full heel move. I mean, if he was a Munster fan, you'd be pretty pissed off about that, because they basically paid to rehab him for the past, like, three years. But, yeah, it is quite funny, that. But, yeah, that would be my choice, anyway, even Etzebeth. Just get a big Master Gnarly knock in there. And we used to have one of those, of course, Will Rowlands, but sadly, he had to depart us. We've had a few of them over the years. Not in the same class as Will, you know, big, horrible lump of a second rope. Do you remember a lock that we signed called Brandon Nansen? I remember him being signed. I don't remember a lot of him playing. No, because he was always injured, that's why. But he was that big, sort of, bastard lock. Bernard Chapman signed him, and he played some super rugby. And he looked like just the player we could have done with at that time. And you're thinking, you know, he played a couple of games where he looked really, really good. But then what happened was two things. First of all, he became a liability because he gave away too many penalties. And then he was always injured. So then we had to let him go. But if he'd stayed fit, he could have been a really good player for us. But, you know, we have tried to sign these enforcer locks, and props as well. We've signed really good props. But when they come to us, they're injury prone, or they just don't perform. I like Doge. Johnny McGinty would tell me how good a player he was. I like Doge for the Dragons, though. You didn't make Doge today. I didn't mind him. He scored thrice for us. Yeah, he didn't do a lot else, though, did he? And, you know, I don't know. I was expecting more. I was expecting more of a work rate, more work in the tight. But then, you know, can I always expect forwards to do all their work in the tight? Yeah, I wish he was still with us, Doge. Because I play him above someone like Chris Coleman. Oh, yeah. You know, to be perfectly honest. Yeah, OK, so that's that one answered. Richard Idris Jones says, not just the Dragons, but unless there's an increase in the budget, we'll just have to accept that the top players will leave Welsh Rugby. And if that's the case, we should scrap the cap rule altogether. It's a difficult one, because I don't think we should be scrapping the cap. You need some sort of incentive to keep players in Wales. But the other side of the coin is, if you can't afford them, then what can you do, isn't it? You know, it's a very tricky situation. We kind of covered it earlier. It's all about our win rates. But we are just going to have to accept that some of our top players are going to have to leave Wales. It's not just the Dragons thing. You know, there's a lot of good, you know, big name players who have to contract. There was a Wales Online report yesterday. Thomas Williams is out of contract. You know, you've got players across all the other regions. Nicky Smith is out of contract. The Ospreys. Kieran Hardy. Johnny McNichol. So, you know, we are going to have to accept that some big names are going to move on. And Johnny McNichol. And Johnny McNichol. Did I say, what did I say? Johnny McGinty. No, you said Johnny McNichol. You said Johnny McNichol, and you said some big names. And I said and Johnny McNichol. I thought I said Johnny McGinty then. No, you didn't. Both. Yeah, I know you're not a fan of his. You're not a fan of his. McNichol, no. No, I don't see the point of him. If he's the answer, I really don't know what the question is. Oh, my gosh. No, but Scarlett fans, you know, you defend a lot of terrible players. You can't defend him. What's he do? He was never as good as Jonah Holmes, and he was getting the team over Jonah. And they drove Jonah away, and I'm still upset about that. I know you are, but I liked it. He was very good in Super Rugby. When he played for the Crusaders, McNichol was really, really good. And I still think he's a decent player. He just can't defend. That's his problem. So he's really good with ball in hand, but he can't tackle the skin off the vice president. That's the problem you got with him. I look alright on the Crusaders, though, to be honest. I wouldn't. I'm not sure they need a 50-year-old second row, but, you know. Okay, so Dino asks us, is there going to be an Anglo-Welsh League? I presume this is because of the Cardiff and Bath game, which attracted a really big crowd. There was a narrative after that we should have more of these games. So what do you think there, Gav? Anglo-Welsh League? Or would you like to see an Anglo-Welsh League, I suppose? What do you make of this? So, I'm going to say something that I have to remind myself an awful lot. It's not 1994 anymore. And, yeah, in 1994, that is what should have happened. The Welsh team should have gone into an Anglo-Welsh League. That time is long gone. What have we got that England want? Nothing. Apart from our players. Well, they can get those anyway. They don't have to play in the same league as us. The only way it happens, and this will happen, will be there'll be a European League. Yeah. And we'll go in as part of a package deal with Leinster and Munster. Because the other option, which has been touted as, oh, well, we could go into the English Championship. Well, tell you what, I don't think anybody's going to be that bothered about watching Nottingham or Halfbury College play against Cardiff. No. I think what these games show us, though, is if you've got meaningful games in a meaningful competition, people will turn up for it. And let's not forget, Barford just down the road, they had a big away contingent. It does help when you have away fans. It massively helps. In an ideal world, I would love to see an Anglo-Welsh League, but we're not going to get that. What I do think we'll get, and I think we've talked about it on here and on the WRAP podcast, there are talks going on right now about a British and Irish League. And I think that's what we're going to get to. I do think that URC isn't going to exist in five years' time. I think we're going to get a brand new competition made up of conferences where it'll be British and Irish. And I do expect the South Africans to be in there. I don't know if the Italians will. I'm not sure if they will or not. I mean, there are plans. They said they're talking to South Africa and Italy as well, but it wouldn't surprise me if we sort of cut the Italians and just add British and Irish and South Africa. You could see the Italian teams ended up in Pro D2 almost, couldn't you? Yeah. There was talk about that before, wasn't there? Remember there was a big debate, you know, about kicking the Italians out and putting them over to France? But, I mean, you're not going to kick Benetton out now, though. They are a bloody good team, aren't they, Benetton? You know, they are really, really good in Finnish. They've turned it right around. But, yeah, Anglo-Welsh fixtures are good. And, you know, it was a great occasion at the Alms Party. They had a big crowd. You know, fair play. Away support does help. But it is pretty boring now. Every time we play an English club and we get a decent attendance, there's always that conversation about Anglo-Welsh. And, again, it's thinking it's 1994. It's the same reason I can't drink lots anymore because it's not 1994 anymore. You know, and that's the problem. Because we offer nothing. The professional game isn't about away fans. It's about, well, what do you bring as a TV deal? What do you bring as this and that and the other? They want the Irish teams because they bring money and they bring a TV audience. They want the South African teams for exactly the same reason. Yeah. But wouldn't it be nice, though, on the other hand, wouldn't it be nice to think, I'm going to catch a train and go and see Dragons against Gloucester or... Of course. ...go down the wreck and see Bath instead of thinking, oh, I might have to get a plane to go to Dublin and watch Leicester or go to bloody Durban. I mean, it is silly when you think about it, mind, isn't it? It is a little bit silly. As much as I like the URC, it is a bit muddled and... I'd love it if I... ...it's not good for climate change. I'd love it if I could jump on the train and go up to London and watch Dragons play Queen's. Yeah. Or go up to Saracen or wherever and watch Dragons play. I would love that. There's no reason for it. And I think any British and Irish league won't have four Welsh teams in it. Well, we'll have to see. I mean, like I said, I do think that the URC won't exist in five years' time, but my guess, my prediction is we'll get a British and Irish league with South African teams in it. And the Italians, I don't know about. But I do think there'll be change on the cards. Because as much as I like the URC, I'm not 100% sure if it's really working. And it certainly doesn't satisfy fans in Wales. They don't want it. They want to see these games against Bath and Gloucester on a regular basis. They want to go to away trips with it and just go on a train, go on a coach and see their teams. That's what the Welsh public crave. Yeah, so... We'll... We'll see what happens in the future. There's no doubt there will be change. Right then. Let's move on to your GWENT rugby round-up. So, what have you got first, then, Gareth? What happened on the weekend? So, a fairly full round of league fixtures. Starting in the Premiership, where both Ebbervale and Newport had big wins. Ebbervale beat Carmarthen Queens 54-24 at home. And Newport beat Bridgend 57-27 at Brewery Field. So, Llandyfri are top. And then Ebbervale and Newport are the closest teams to it now. Pondypool have been cut away. Llandyfri and Ebbervale to win it for GWENT, really. But, you know, it's competitive. And Ebbervale are in the semi-finals of the Premier Cup as well against Llandyfri. So, the GWENT team's doing well there. In the Championship, Bedware beat Cardiff Met 21-15. Newbridge lost 18-12 at home against Bersay. Penaltha beat Rumney 23-21. Triochi, 22 crosskeys, 29. So, a good away win for crosskeys here. We've had a bit of up-and-down season. In Division 1, local derby between Bryn Mawr and Blaenavon. And Bryn Mawr won it 22-15. I bet that was a fruity old game. I've watched a few of those games in the past. They can be quite lively. Abergavenny lost 29-14 away to Doulis. And Pal-y-Wain beat Monmouth 24-12. And then in Division 2, Blackwoods beat Croes O'Ciliog 34-15 in the red derby of posh Welsh towns. Cillian lost 13-0 at home to Caldecott. And Newport High School Old Boys won 30-18 against Ableary, Blaenau Gwent. And ASC beat Oakdale 36-20. All right, there we go. Some interesting match-ups. Oh, by the way, you know the Newport game? Yeah. When they were to pretend. Did you see our backs coach, Matt O'Brien, did you see his reverse pass? Yes. How good was that? Yeah, it was outrageous. Because I've been thinking about this a lot, right? And I put it on X as well. You know we joked about Matt O'Brien starting a tent for the Dragons out in South Africa? Yeah. And there was, you know, the rumours going around that they may have to start the backs coaches because we didn't have an emergency tent at the time. I do wonder, could he actually do a job for Dragons in an emergency situation like that? If it was a Rodney Parade and we literally had no one to cover the tent, do you think he could actually do a job? I don't want to... I think he could. I think he could do a job. You know, he's playing regularly for Newport. And, you know, Will Reid was playing regularly for Newport up until this season. So, you know... Yeah. It's not a huge reach, is it? No. No, absolutely. I do, I think about you all the time. And Newport fans will tell you, yes, he definitely can play for the Dragons. But then they also think Dan Soukter is a capable tight end. So I'm not entirely sure if I'm going to trust all the views of Newport RSC supporters. But I do wonder about you. I thought about you a lot. Could he actually do a job? I think he probably could for a game, couldn't he? To step in, you know? Yeah, he's a decent enough player, isn't he? And like I said, that reverse pass was filthy. I loved that. But... Yeah. Very impressive. Absolutely. Slightly different though, isn't it? Doing it in the Welsh Premiership when doing it in regional rugby. Yes, doing it in the URC. I don't think you can get away with doing stuff like that. No, getting a delay like that. Yes. No, absolutely not. Okay, thank you for that then, Gav. So let's move on to the players' playlist. So in case you're wondering about this feature, the Dragons have been asking players to submit six songs to the matchday playlist that Ronnie played. This week, I feel totally unqualified to talk about these songs, because I don't know them. I don't know them at all. I've only listened to a couple of them. I've never heard them in my life. This is Rio Dias' playlist. These are the songs he chose for the playlist when we played Oyana. And he chose Sitting on Top of the World by Burnaby, which I have listened to. And it's a sample of another song, I'm sure it is, but I can't figure out what song it is. But it reminds me of a song that's been out before, so it probably is a sample of some sort, isn't it? What do you think of that one, Gav? I think it's the worst of the choices that he made, personally. Okay, and then he's got... I really was like my dad there. My God, I feel like such an old man. He's got When I See You by Fantasia, and then he's got Carry Out by Timbaland, Justin Timberlake. Confessions by Usher. Do you like a bit of Usher, Gav, don't you? I've listened to that Usher album. It's all right. Yeah, yeah. Confessions is probably the best track on there. The Weekend Funkway Remix by... What's it? Zaa? Or F-Z-A? I don't know how you pronounce it. How it's supposed to be said. Miss Independent by Ne-Yo. So, yeah. I'm totally on my death with these songs. I can't even rate them, because this is not my scene at all. I can't relate to these songs whatsoever. It's just not my thing. So, I mean, you've told me you've listened to the songs. You tell me what you make of them then. Well, the Ne-Yo one's fine. It's like in the pop R&B, which really isn't my bag, but, you know, it's well put together, I thought. The Booner Boy one is, you know, that's music for 15-year-olds. It is not music for 50-year-olds. The Zaa one, yeah, again, it's like an Afrobeat stuff, which isn't really my area of expertise, but, you know, it's all right. It's well put together. The Timbaland one I did before, you know, that's good. It's just like pop, hip-hop stuff. And, you know, and Asher, if you like kind of that smooth, vocal kind of R&B thing, which was very much in vogue about 10 years ago, isn't so much now. He's the best at doing that, you know. So, you know, if you like that, Asher is the very best at doing that thing. It's not for me. No. I have listened to her album, you know. But we said this before, you know, he's a young mixed-race guy, you know. He's unlikely to be picking Creedence Clearwater Revival songs or whatever, you know. Yeah, he's not going to be listening to Status Quo or Phil Collins, is he, Gareth? No, he's not. But why would he? I always think it's a bit weird when kids say, oh, I listen to this. And you think, why are you listening to that? You've got all this new music you could be listening to. Okay, so what's your rating then of this playlist? Well, I would give her a 6 out of 10, I think. Okay, I'm abstaining. I'm not going to give a score because I can't give an opinion on it because it's just not my thing, so. I think they're all good in what they do. It's just I don't really listen to what they do. So, you know, it's the... So, James, I'm going to spring this on you. It's a Christmas surprise. You get to pick one song for Dragons to come out to. What do they come out to? Oh, that's put me on the spot. I'm struggling now. I'm really struggling. You've put me on the spot now. You should have told me about this question. It's already recorded. It would have to be a heavy metal one. Oh, I don't know. I'll try to think. I'll try to think. I want to say a Metallica song, but I don't want an obvious one like Enter Sandman. Jeremy, I want... I don't know. For Whom the Bell Tolls. Something like that. The old school 80s. Oh, that would be a classic to come out to. Because you think about it, if they play in the night, because the Dragons do a light show sometimes for the night games. You can get the lights going. The lights are going like that. Oh, yeah, that would be excellent. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so let's go with Metallica For Whom the Bell Tolls. That would be... What about yours then? I'll Reign in Blood by Slayer. Always. Oh, yes. Didn't think of that, of course. Yeah, brilliant. Because you've got the doo-doo, doo-doo again with the drums and then you've got that insane riff. Well, last season, the Dragons came out to Motorhead, the game, which was the theme entrance song for Triple H, the rest of it. Yeah. By Motorhead. Yeah, a lot of people liked that one. And I'm trying to think... Oh, now we've got Kasabian, Clubfoot. Yeah. Which is very, sort of, Newport County, that's the kind of thing that I expect the counties to come out to. But it's, you know, I don't like Kasabian, but I don't mind that song. No, there's a Verve song called Come On, it's the last track, or last but one track, on Urban Hymns. And I've always thought that would be a great song to come out to. Because it's just Martin Ritz and Richard Ashcroft bellowing Come On a lot. Yeah. Oh, another one I thought of that would be good, and it's quite sporty, ACDC, Play Ball. Have you heard that one? Yeah, I know that one. Let's play ball. That's got a sporty, sort of, thing to it. Yeah. Okay, cool. Let's move on then to the festive derby fixtures that we've got coming up. So, on Boxing Day, we're playing them locked down the road, Cardiff. Look, we all know about the mental block that Dragons have against Cardiff, like, what's it now, 16, 17 games in a row? Might even be 18, I don't know, I've lost count now. 17. 17 losses against Cardiff in a row, yeah, it's highly embarrassing. It's clear there's a mental block there, as much as, you know, Dragons deny it, and as much as Cardiff play it down, there is a clear mental block there. How do we feel about this game then, Gav, going into it? Well, it's a game we should be targeting to win. We can win it. They're not very good. But we never do. They aren't very good. That's the problem. We never do. We have to just target it, and Dario has to be saying, all the time, it doesn't matter, we're just going to win this game, we're going to do this, we're going to do the basics, and it just has to be over and over again, we're going to do warm-ups, there's barely going to talk about the game, the warm-up will be, this is what we do in this situation, this is what we do in this situation. Play real percentage rugby, not pretty at all. If there's any doubt, put the ball off the pitch. If the ball's in our half, put the ball off the pitch. Yep. And then make sure our execution's good in the end of the pitch. Yeah. Cardiff really are the media darlings at the moment, aren't they, in the Welsh rugby press. You know, they talk about them when they're youngsters and how well they play, even when they're losing heavily, it's positive all the time, there's a real buzz about it. I mean, if you read Wales online, all their youngsters are going to be in the Wales squad, they've all bought us, you know. It's just a little bit silly though, I think. Yeah, they've done well considering, because when you think of all the chaos they had before the season, Cardiff are doing better than expected, but, what I would say is, they've won two games all season, they've lost to the Scarlets twice, they've lost to a poor Scarlets team twice, they've lost to the Black Lions, they've lost to a pub. So, you know, as much as there's a big buzz around Cardiff, I still feel this is a winnable game, but, for me, it's that mental block. Can we get over that mental block? How many errors are we going to make? Can we get over that, you know, and it's, it's just very hard to see me, well, to predict a Dragons win over Cardiff, because they are just our bogey team. We can't seem to beat them for love nor money, it doesn't matter where we play, it doesn't matter what team they put out. You know, we talked on the wrap pod about Scarlets being Cardiff's bogey team. That's just the way it is, isn't it? You know, in sport, you get your bogey teams, but, I just can't see us winning at the Almspark at all, but, you're a lot more confident than I am. I think we can, I'm not saying we will, but we can, and, I think the training just has to be, almost, we're not going to mention Cardiff, what we're going to do is just basic stuff over and over again. What do we do in this situation? What's the thing? What's the out? Every time, and just absolutely, and play really, really basic rugby, but do it well, and do it over and over again. I think that's a good point. We don't do the basics well enough, do we? That's our, part of our problem. We've got to get the basics right, you know, and we may have a chance. Hopefully, we'll see the likes of Elliot Dey, Bradley Roberts return. Are we going to see Leon Brown for this game? No. Because that would be a big boost. You don't think we are? No, it would help. Maybe we'll see him for the Scarlets. We knew that Olly Griffiths has been held back for this one, so, we've rested Aaron Wainwright, we've rested Rio, we've rested Joe Shaw, we've rested a few players, and we've got players back now. So, that's the good news. We've got the likes of Kai Evans back, we've got Bertranew back, we've got Martinez back, and that's going to help us. I think we'll actually put out a strong squad. I think when the teams get named, I think on paper, our squad is going to look really good. But, is it going to translate on the field? Is that mental barrier I've already talked about? So, what is your prediction then for this game? Oh, God. I'm going to say Cardiff by three. 15-12. But it could easily be us by three. So, my prediction was Cardiff by 10 on the rat pod. Which, I didn't want to go that high, but I just think it's going to be another disappointing defeat to Cardiff. So, yeah, unfortunately, I just can't see us going over that mental. We had a good opportunity at Ronnie Parade, and I know we had injuries at the back row. We didn't have a functioning back row. But, that was still a winnable game. Even though it's an absolute turgid shit show, and the worst atmosphere I've ever been to at the Dragons game. There were moments in that game we talked about Jarrah Ross, I remember. You know, he couldn't ground that ball. It's just those moments, you know. So, that was still a winnable game, and we blew it, but we always seem to blow it against Cardiff for some reason. So, yeah, I'm predicting another disappointing defeat to Cardiff there. And then, on New Year's Day, we got the Scarlets at Ronnie Parade. This is a much more interesting game. I'm really looking forward to this one. Because, we always have good games against the Scarlets. So, I don't know about you, whenever we play the Scarlets, I always feel like this is a winnable game. You know, it's like when the Ospreys come to town. When the Ospreys come down here to play us, I always feel like we can beat them, and most of the time we do. And that's what I feel about the Scarlets game. I do think this is a winnable game. It'd be interesting to see if we're coming into this on the back of a defeat, which is what I expect. Are the Scarlets going to play against the Ospreys? Because they've got the Ospreys first on Boxing Day, then they come down to us. I just feel like we're scrapping it out with the Scarlets to avoid being our worst team in Wales at the moment. And look, the table doesn't lie. We're in chaos. Yeah, but the table doesn't lie. We're rock bottom in the URC, right? And that's fine. And yet, I still feel we're a much better team than the Scarlets. I would agree. If that makes sense. Even though we are bottom, I just feel that we are a much better team. Because David, I mean, that Black Lion game, Dav, oh my God, that's a real front five. There's a lack of confidence there. There's stuff going on behind the scenes. You know, the supporters group are writing letters now to the hierarchy. There's stuff going on. I've seen that, yeah. They're in a mess. They're in a hell of a mess. And you would think this is a good opportunity for the Dragons to get a win over them. Well, what have you made of what's going on at the Scarlets, then? Well, I don't know. The thing is, this seems really chaotic. But that chaos seems to have gone onto the field as well. Because, against Black Lion, you know, the rugby hipsters will say, well, see, I told you they were good. No, they're not. They beat a very poor side. They had no function in the line-out whatsoever, Black Lion. I don't know if you saw that game. They did not have a line-out at all. I saw highlights. Yeah, and they still beat the Scarlets. But, my God, they absolutely pummeled the Scarlets in the scrum. They absolutely pummeled them. And that's an area, and it feels weird to say this, as a Dragons fan, but target them in the scrum. Especially if we've got Martinez, we've got to target the Scarlets up front because they've got a very weak front five. And without Sam Lousey, they're very, very vulnerable. I think if they've got Lousey and Fifita back, although Fifita's going off the boil, I think, for me personally, but if they get Lousey back, that'll help transform them a little bit. But they are there to be beaten, the Scarlets. They look very vulnerable. We've got to get Barrel and Martinez out against them and just really go for them. Just put this scrum under pressure like we did against Ospreys as well. And put this set-piece under pressure like we did against Ospreys. Yeah, Ospreys helped them get a player sent off, but I still think we'd have beaten them anywhere with 15. And I would like to see Leon back as well. If he can make one of these games for the rest of Derby, that would be really good. Who would help? Yeah, because I have absolutely no doubt that he'll get called up for Wales in the Six Nations. That's generally how it works, isn't it? We get one game out of him, he gets called up, then the Six Nations is over, he comes back to us and he's injured. So, yeah, let's try and get some rugby out of him while we can. That would be my hope. So, okay, what's your prediction for this one then, Gav? Dragons versus Scarlets. Asked by nine, we're going to win 24-13. That's 11. Yeah, 11. Okay, we're going to win 11. Okay, I've gone for dragons by six. So, yeah, that was my prediction on the VAT pod, and that's what I'm going to say now is dragons by six. Yeah, so I've got dragons to lose against Cardiff by 10 and dragons to win by six in the festive derbies. So, yeah, that's where I am with that one. Now, one of the questions we was asked on the VAT pod, and I thought it'd be good to get your answer to this. What is your three-word review to sum up our team season so far? So, you asked me, you know, what's my three-word review to sum up the dragons so far this season? So, my one was too many errors, which I think sums up the dragons perfectly. To be honest with you, it's just too many errors. I'm getting bored of talking about it. I'm sick of seeing it. Let's please upskill the plays and stop making bad decisions and silly errors. So, Gav, what is your three-word review to sum up the dragons season so far? I'm beating the same drum I always do. Lack of leadership. Leadership again. But that's not just on field. That's off field as well. Because that's what coaching is. It's not just on field. We're not being led effectively off field either. Because the guys doing all they can, but defensively we are shambolic at times. And our core skills aren't right. I would love to see us now, next season, I want to see the owners get the checkbooks out and start properly investing in a coaching team. We need a defence coach. I'm not naming names, but I think one or two coaches now need to be moved on. We need fresh blood, and I think that's what we need to do. I think we need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. We need to move on. 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