The POP

Two UD students discuss the play "Passover" by Antoinette and Wanda, focusing on the themes of systemic racism. They mention the main characters, Moses and Kitch, and how their different personalities highlight the presence of racism in society. The play also addresses racial violence, with the police officer character representing this issue. The students watched the play live and found it thought-provoking. They discuss the simple set design and its references to biblical stories. Moses' death is significant as it reflects the inspiration for the play, highlighting the difficulties faced by African Americans in society. They mention a talkback session after the performance, which they feel could have been structured better to encourage meaningful discussion. The play's intended message about racism was not fully understood by the audience. The students believe that colleges should produce this play to raise awareness about the normalization of racism, particularly targeting students. Hi everyone, and welcome to The POP. *Pop Noise* I'm Allie. I'm Karthik. Today we are talking with two UD students who are very knowledgeable on the topics and themes discussed in Antoinette Nwandu's play, Passover. They also got to see the play in person. Everyone please give a warm welcome to our special guest. Hi I'm Katie. And I'm Ava. Today we are going to be talking about Passover by Antoinette Nwandu, specifically wanting to discuss the systemic racism that prompted the writing of Nwandu's play. Can you guys give us a brief summary of the play just to refresh our memories? Yes, of course. The play is centered around two black men that have fallen victim to the cyclical nature of the racism and discrimination that plagues the society that they live in. Moses and Kitch dream of passing over from their lives on the street corner into somewhere that they deem paradise. With only four characters let's dive into their characterization and how it emphasizes the presence of racism in society. The two main characters are Kitch and Moses, who are two young black men, both in their late teens, early twenties. Both men are from the ghetto and they are best friends. The two men have surprisingly different demeanors, as Moses is angry and sad, while Kitch is jovial and naive. There are also two white characters in the play, Mr. and Osfer, who are played by the same actor but represent different people. Yeah, the juxtaposition is really interesting, since Mr. enters the ghetto by accident and is terrified, but Osfer finds pleasure coming to the ghetto and enacting fear in the two men. I think it's also important to add that Moses and Kitch are often on stage just the two of them, which represents the loneliness and isolation often felt by young black men in society. They talk about passing over into another life or into a better situation. Obviously, the cast does not need to be large for a production like this to have the effect it needs. In fact, the simplicity of the cast symbolizes the normality of racism in society, that even between four people there can be such a huge racial divide that leads to the death of a black man. That's fascinating. Unfortunately, we have to move on given the limited time that we have. Awww. But we're really interested in discussing more about the playwright by Antoinette Nwandu. Yeah, can you give us a little background information about her and when and why she wrote this play? Of course. So, Antoinette Nwandu was born March 5th, 1980 in Los Angeles. She was raised by a single mother and grew up in the Baptist church. However, she now views that church as a cult. I'd like to add that Nwandu's inspiration for writing this play was initially inspired by the death of Trayvon Martin, who was shot and killed by George Zimmerman. After many months of investigations and trials, Zimmerman was not charged with the murder. She wanted Passover to portray often uncontrolled racism in America, which allows for violence against African Americans with little to no repercussions. Nwandu wrote this play between November 2016 and July 2017, and then the play was first performed on July 11th, 2017. That's really interesting. Thank you for giving us that background. That actually segments very well into our next question. Yeah, we now really want to focus our attention on the theme of racial violence in Passover. How do you see this topic being traced throughout the play? First, the idea of racism is introduced into the play as well as the notion of African Americans struggling to survive and grow in American society. Black men from the ghetto are stereotypically unable to remedy their situations as society tends to push them to where they are. Also, while this is occurring, Moses and kids jump to the ground at any sounds of shooting as if they are scared of someone shooting at them. Then, through the officer character, racial violence by police officers is highlighted when he forces Moses and kids to their knees. He beats the men and threatens them. Mr. Shooting and Killing Moses relates to the lack of safety for those men, where anyone, even seemingly nice people, can be racially violent. It's really clear that the two of you know a lot about Passover. I think you guys briefly mentioned that you watched the performance live. Can you give us a brief description of where you watched the play? Definitely. So, Katie and I watched Passover at the UD Rec Theater here on UD's campus. It was really interesting to watch live, and we found the entire performance to be incredibly compelling. I would love to see Passover live. From the way you describe it, it sounds like a really thought-provoking play. I agree completely. Not to entirely change the subject, but our next question touches on the production itself and the set. From what we've read, we noticed the performance has a simple and limited set with few props. Why do you think this is, and does it say something about the intentions behind the play? Well, the play is set in the present on a ghetto street with a lamppost, but it is also referred to as 1855 and 13th century BCE. It is also said to be set on a plantation and in Egypt. These are references to the biblical story that Nuandu implements into her writing. She includes Moses' biblical story into her characterization of Moses in the play. He acts as a savior for him and Kitch against racism. Right. The inclusion of 1855 on a plantation is a reference to the systemic racism that occurred during these times in which African Americans were owned and enslaved by white Americans. That's a very interesting connection. We should talk more about the performance of the play you saw at UD Rep. Obviously, Moses' death is really surprising. Why is his death so significant to the play? His death literally embodies Nuandu's inspiration for the play. Moses is shot and killed just like Trayvon Martin and so many other black men and women for no reason. Moses and Kitch discuss trying to get away from the street corner where the entirety of the play took place. Why couldn't the men leave the street corner? Society is built to make it so much more difficult for African Americans to improve their lives and make a successful name for themselves. It's especially difficult when those people come from poor living conditions and impoverished families. Society pushes the blame onto the African Americans saying it is their fault for their financial and living struggles and make little to no effort to help these people. The men couldn't leave the street corner because if they even tried they would run the risk of being shot and killed or brutally beaten for attempting to better their lives. That's very intense. Yeah, I can imagine the atmosphere of the production was pretty heavy. It definitely was, but it conveys such an important message that has to be talked about regardless of any discomfort that audience members may feel. To speak more about the importance of having difficult conversations and holding space to have said conversations, we recognize that there was a talkback after the production. How was this structured, and do you think it was successful in creating an informational atmosphere? Of course, for this production's talkback, the actors were present for the discussion, which is a format that is not always seen in every talkback. Right, and the talkback was a Q&A style with the audience rather than a structured discussion where the host asks the actors and directors questions. We've talked a lot about the effectiveness of this talkback and concluded that it probably would have been more advantageous if it was structured with specific questions rather than unwarranted input from the audience. Yes, we decided with the demographic of an older, white audience there was too much commenting from the audience rather than questions. They often wanted to talk more about their own feelings and how they can relate to the ideas in the play. So in this way, it seemed like the premise for the talkback was lost. That's a great point. It seems there was a disconnect between the audience and the basis of the play. Can we talk more about specifically what the author intended to express when writing this play and how the message was received by the audience Absolutely. So the meaning of the play was to emphasize the racism in society and the detrimental effects that result from prejudice and discrimination. Right, and the audience at Rep seemed to miss the ideas presented in the play and more so focus on our own feelings after watching the performance. Rather than feeling for African Americans who have to deal with systemic racism they just told their own personal experiences. One man even asked for a call to action during the talkback which was supposed to be the entire intent behind the play. I just have one more question for you both. Do you think more colleges should produce this play? This play is extremely important in calling to attention the normalization of racism in society. It would be a great play to produce at colleges for students to watch but I would say it is less effective if the audience is an elderly community. If colleges do want to do this play it would be really beneficial to advertise more towards the students. Yeah, I would pretty much just echo everything Katie just said. Alright, well we have to wrap the podcast now. Thank you guys so much for joining and we hope to see you back sometime. Thank you so much for having us. That's all we have for today. Special thanks to all our POP listeners. See you next time.