ARL_event_FullEnhanceSpatial_Purple

Rydw i'n gwneud podcast ac rydw i'n cyfrannu fy hun ar y cyfnod. Rydyn ni'n ymwneud â hyn, felly rydw i'n mynd i roi'r cyfan i'r panell i gyfrannu eu hunain, oherwydd dyma beth rydych chi'n dod ymlaen amdanyn nhw. Rydw i'n mynd i gofyn un cwestiwn, felly mae'n intro cyflym, Tom. Intro cyflym, Tom. Ac yna, yn un sylw, sut wnaethoch chi ddod i'r BCR? Ac mae hynny'n ymwneud â phob un, felly un intro cyflym. Byddwn ni'n dechrau gyda chi, Tom. Felly, rydw i'n Tom Lord, Arweinwyr Genedlaethol. Mae'n dda iawn, felly rydyn ni'n cael pethau o'r broffesiau cyffredinol i gyd yma ym Mhroffesi Cofnig, felly rydyn ni'n gobeithio y byddwn ni'n gallu mynd ymlaen. Diolch yn fawr. Pan ddechreuais i fynd i'r BCR, roedd rhywun yn teimlo i mi a dweud y bydd gwaith yn ddigon dda, efallai y byddwch chi'n hoffi'r gwaith. Rydw i wedi mynd i'r gwaith. Iawn, rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n cael fy nghyffredin, ac roedd rhaid i mi ddod i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n mynd i'r gwaith. Rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl yma, ac rydw i'n ymwne o'r caos o ddod â phobl yn ymwneud â'u ffotnig, nid ymwneud â'u bynyddoedd, ac mae'n ymwneud â'ch gosod. Ac eto, yn yr un ffordd, rydw i ddim yn gwybod beth yw'r rôl yma. Rydw i'n gwybod bod adeiladau yn cael eu hyrwyddo ac rydw i'n meddwl y gallwn wneud hynny. Ac rydw i'n ymwneud â'r rôl ymwneud â myfyrwyr, oherwydd roeddwn i eisiau rhoi fy nghyfnod i'r ddŵr, ond yn ddiogel, pan roeddwn i'n mynd ymlaen i ymwneud â'r rôl ymwneud â myfyrwyr, felly roedden nhw'n dweud, cyhoeddiwch â hyn. Rydyn ni'n cael y profiad, gallwn ei wneud, ac mae'r rhaid i ni wneud hynny. Mae'n anhygoel. Felly, rydyn ni'n mynd i fynd yn ymwneud â hyn. Felly, bydd y rhan gyntaf yn ymwneud â cael sylweddau, ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, byddwn ni'n mynd i ddod o'r ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, byddwn i'n mynd i ddod o'r ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, byddwn i'n mynd i ddod o'r ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, byddwn i'n mynd i ddod o'r ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, byddwn i'n mynd i ddod o'r ysbrydu eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Felly, cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd. Felly, rwy'n meddwl am hyn, ac mewn gwirionedd, cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Cymryd eich hun yn y blynyddoedd gyntaf. Un o'r pethau yw ddangos eich credydol a'ch gysylltiad. Rwy'n meddwl bod pobl yn deall pa mor bwysig yw hyn i fod yn y sefydliad cyffredin. Rwyf hefyd wedi cael cyflwyno pobl sy'n rhoi eu rhaglen i'w helpu allan eu lân. Felly, i mi, dyna sut rydych chi'n dechrau cael ystyried. Mae pobl yn teimlo eich bod yn gysylltiedig, rydych chi'n fwy ymdrechol, mwy agil, yn ceisio cael ymwneud â pethau gwahanol ac yn rhoi'r cyffredin o'ch rôl arall. Felly, dyna sut, eto, rydych chi'n deall eich enw, mae pobl yn deall eich bod yn deall, ac yn dechrau adeiladu'r profiad hwnnw. Rwy'n meddwl bod pobl yn cael sylweddoli ar y pethau sy'n cael eu hystyried. Felly, os ydych chi'n gwneud yr hyn rydych chi'n ei ddweud, os ydych chi'n edrych ar broblemau sydd gyda chyflwynoedd, rydych chi'n dechrau eu cynllunio i'ch rheolwr, i'r rheolwr cymunedol, i'r GM, ac yna dilynu ar hynny, ac rydych chi'n rhywun sy'n cymryd arbennig ac yn cael pethau'n ei wneud. Nawr, gallai hynny fod yn CSA, sydd wedi dod yn ôl. Gallai fod yn rheolwr cymunedol a rheolwr cysylltiedig, ond mae pobl sy'n cael eu cymryd yn y pobl rydyn nhw'n mynd ato pan maen nhw eisiau rhywbeth i'w gwneud, mae pobl sy'n dod allan ac yn dod allan yn y siaradau rydyn ni'n eu cael am, iawn, pa ffordd yw'r talent? Fodd bynnag, rydyn ni'n teimlo bod pobl sy'n cymryd â'r CSA yn dod allan fel rheolwr cymunedol ac ymlaen, iawn? Felly, mae pobl sy'n mynd allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d ddod allan i 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i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod 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i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i d ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod all allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod allan i ddod My point is I've had to kind of teach myself to take notice of it, but equally like to know my strengths and I like to try and be creative and grow to fit in and drive growth in the country and surround myself by people who support me, like the Gatsbys or somebody here now but my point is don't always get locked in numbers. If you know what the solution is, work bloody hard at integrating that and like Tom said, grow revenue and reduce costs. Numbers do have tendencies to cost themselves if you're indulging on that. I wouldn't get too overwhelmed by something that maybe doesn't interest you, or even like your company is still there. This is what I'm actually doing right now, spending days and days and stretches and doing my best to focus on what I can and what I can't do. So it's important to take that into account as well. Sorry, I was just going to add, it's really important that you don't lie when going to jobs and say that you can do something that you can't do because it becomes very apparent when you join the team that they've not got experience. Just a bit of advice, just be totally honest and if they're going to want to make the hire, they will do. Or you could just fake it till you make it. Working for them. I think the other side of it is, the numbers are just the opening to a sword. So marketing being over spent against budget, whenever anybody asks you something like that, just the opening for you to be able to say, well with marketing what we've had to do is X, Y, Z because we're driving revenue. It's not about explaining the £137 difference between those two numbers. It's just the opening to tell a story about what you know more about than anybody else, which is what's actually going on at the office. The more you see it, the more you do it, the more you can sit there and go, right, three minutes past I can sound through this and I can tell the story to stop anybody asking me questions. The office is a lot about storytelling and the numbers just let you into that. That's a really good one to end that. A lot of the fine regional, really strong regional managers I've been to say exactly that. It's more important that the firm, the international managers, really understand what's behind the numbers and not just the numbers themselves. You don't have to think about why things are going great and why you might be underperforming in certain areas. There will be more concerns that you don't have the depth behind it and the numbers themselves. I think that's a really good point to end that section on. I'll move on to a really interesting subject around career needs and the timing of it. I suppose it's really looking at the whole internal opportunity versus the time. To give a bit of context, I've done the National Library. The National Library people spend I think about four and a half years now in each role. If you look at some of the clientele in here, not my good self, the mid-30s and below, it's less, it's actually just under three years per role. Again, asking the panel here, what are good reasons to leave and what are bad ones? It's controversial, but when is there a good time to go external? When's the bad one? Is there any experience you can share with that? I think I'm going to go first. Bad reasons to leave are emotionally driven decisions. How many of us have had the worst day at work where you're being shouted at by 20 people because they've got no hot water and you're just like, I'm not doing this. I'm going to go home, I'm not going in tomorrow. You wake up and you feel completely different. I also think if you can get through those bad days, then you've really improved and you then figure out how to overcome certain situations. I personally believe that if you can get through a challenging time, it's only going to benefit you in the long run. I also always say your bad days and good days, bad months, good months, bad years, good years, I think it comes with control. I think a good reason to leave is when you have asked for progression and you feel that maybe it's not going to come at any point soon, but also when you feel like you've really reached the potential within that position that you're currently in and you're not necessarily learning anything now. But I also think maybe another bad one is if you are wanting to progress, but then just going from building to building thinking you're going to be able to get that progression, I don't necessarily think that's always the best reason to leave. So often people think the grass is greener. Not just where I work, but in other companies I've worked at. And quite quickly will call and say, can I come back? Because they see figures, so money talks, but what you're also getting is that you might be getting really long hours, not a great culture. So I think emotionally is a very good reason, but I also think just because it's a great salary, like what comes with the salary. I appreciate people in personal circumstances where actually that money makes a really big difference. But just think about when you go to work. For me, I always think if I'm getting the fair on a Saturday, it's time to move jobs. Not even Sunday, a Saturday. Which I have had before. Because you're at work for most of your day, most of your week, most of your life. So you want it to be a place where you can get through the day, not feel miserable, enjoy it. So scramble from that. If it isn't, it's a poor culture, it's toxic, and there isn't an out, then I totally get that. Nobody's mental health is worth a job. But I often see people walk for money, which I don't think is the right reason all the time. I agree, if you're not getting stretched, and you're not being challenged, and you've become quite stagnant, and you're not seeing that career growth. For me, again, those are my two things. Getting the fair on the Saturday, and I'm not getting any stretch or career growth. And then it's time for me to go. But if you're not getting the stretch, I know we'll talk about that later, but to me that's around have you tried and asked for the stretch. I think quite often people go to their managers and say, I need more responsibility, or give them more responsibility, as opposed to saying, I want responsibility, and giving them suggestions of how they can have more responsibility. So being proactive and taking hold of your career, because at the end of the day, you're the only one in charge of your destiny. Sorry to be very cringe there. But I think for me, those would be good, because they're the two main ones. So the culture bit, good reason to leave somewhere. Having a rubbish boss as well, that's another good reason to leave. There's no point in saying it, you're just going to get that fear. For sure, I think what you should ask yourself is, firstly, do you love what I'm doing? Secondly, am I still learning? If you're still learning, then you're still at the right level, right? Is my scope expanding, am I being given more responsibility? If the answer to those things is yes, you're probably in the right place I think. If the answer is no, I'm not learning, I'm getting a bit bored, and I'm getting itchy feet, then maybe this is the right time. So some good reasons to leave. No new scope, no new problems, no growth, you're getting bored every day. Literally every day. Do you feel like your strengths aren't being used? Or you're just totally in the wrong seat? And there are times when you're in the wrong seat. Now, from a leadership perspective, we talk about things like making sure you've got the right people in the right seat, and sometimes you've got the wrong person in the wrong seat, and maybe they've got a job over there, so move them over there. Don't just leave them where they are, because it's not getting the best out of them. If you recognise this isn't the right seat for me, then have conversations about moving to a different one, because it's not making the best of your skills. Or it might mean you need to move somewhere else. That whole environment that was talked about, or you've outgrown the role, you know you're not learning anymore, but there's nowhere to go right now. Which happens. You can get really lucky in big companies, where you get that next opportunity, because someone's recognised it was great, and another opportunity comes up over here, and you do get to do your part of the career there. Sometimes you find, especially as you go further up, you get to the point where you've got to wait for that one seat to become vacant, to progress. And that happens. Where the CEO of a company says, there's nowhere else up. It's not like Matt's got somebody above him waiting for them to leave, and he's actually got a new job. And maybe at that point you do need to go somewhere else. Bad reasons to leave. Chasing a title too early, or chasing that money too early. I'm going to be a general manager. You'll find at some point, you go, I'm sure I'm not ready. I haven't got the skills, I haven't got the knowledge, I haven't got the reputation, I haven't got the network to support me, through this stuff. Moving when you're bored, but you haven't actually tried to do anything about it. You haven't had a good conversation with your manager, to say, I feel like I could do some more. Because every good manager has more that they've got on their plate, that they could give to you. I have told people that work for me over the years, your job is to make me redundant, because once you make me redundant, that means you're ready to do my job. You can't sit being an assistant manager, never doing your bosses work for them, and expect to be ready when the GM position comes available. You want to do all of their work for them, and make sure the person below you is doing all yours for you. That means when the person at the top leaves, everybody's ready to step up. I've seen so many times when people are going, yeah, I'm ready, and they get over-promoted, and they fail. And in six months, they've gone from the company. Not because they weren't great when they started the job, they weren't ready to do it, and then they failed, and fell on their faces. And the other one is don't underestimate the power of building a reputation and a network in a company, right? Every time you go to a new company, you've got to build it again. You'll still stay up here, but your reputation and your network drop from up here to down here. So you can still do the job, but it'll take you two years to build that reputation and all of those networks up again for everybody to trust you and go, that's the best person. And that's a pain, because reputation and network and relationships will take you a hell of a long way, especially if you've got your skills and knowledge buckets full as well, right? So don't just leave it after 18 months, because somebody's got to do a bit more over there. Every six months, Matt tells me, Tom, do you want to come work somewhere else? I'm like, where are you going to go? I'm like, we're doing so well. But even from the previous perspective, I've become a thousand pounder over the last 20 years. For me, the self-help line is the monetary and the cost, and that's literally one of the last classes I get paid for. So I've spent a lot of time thinking about it, and thinking about the culture, the expression, where the business is going, how the business is going, and then what, what, what. All of these other things, before we even get to the point where they can't see whether the financial things in the country are going to work or not. If you're open-handed every single time, then I think quite frankly, like all of you said, you've really got to kind of look at the kind of key drivers there. This whole graph, I think we all agree, has become very apparent, very explicit. You know, a recruiter's role, I've got half-time and part-counselor, and half-recruiter. I do pay thousands, if not thousands, I don't, and you just sort of guide people through it, give a bit of advice. The biggest one will always be, and I hope you will find one of the conversations with the people you're interviewing, where you're actually in a place where you enjoy the culture, you're maybe just frustrated. There's a big difference between being kind of mentally unhappy in your environment, particularly if you're a business person, particularly if you're coming from an out-of-town, if it's frustration that drives that, how those conversations play into when you're being put in a situation where it might be a process, that would be my biggest advice. You've got to explore that further, if you fundamentally believe in the business you're doing, and they say, well, it's up to you, and you can gain the experience, and so on and so forth. Good. We'll go on to, we've done a little bit, actually, we've talked over a couple of things already, so I'll try and wrap it up before we do some questions here, around ECR in itself, obviously, because we know it's evolving, it's growing, more entrants, more investment coming in. What would you guys say that young professionals should focus on to kind of stay relevant over the next five, six, seven years on the whole topics and trends that they need to get themselves and things like that? I think we all know the one beginning with A. Because I still can't tell if that, you know, that meme is Boris Johnson, and he's like to, you know, touchy-peachy, or AI, has anyone seen that? It's really funny, it's like AI is actually Boris Johnson's secret. I'll have to share it. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, it's very funny. Yeah. Okay, that's what I was going to say. Yeah. AI, it's just everywhere. We're now being asked to do the whole piece that top leadership now is looking at our AI and how we're going to use it to affect the business better. It just seems to be touching everything, and if you don't get on board with it, it'll become fluent in it, then you're going to get stuck. Can I just build on that for a second, right? Yeah. Typically the people trying to build a strategy around AI are old and have no fricking clue the difference between generative and agentic AI, right? They don't even know what those two terms mean, yet they're sat around a boardroom table going, we need an AI strategy. That means massive opportunities for people that are literate and minded to go and learn it, right? And learning it just can be so many different things. It's finding a great podcast, it's trying it, it's playing on it, it's building yourself a little agent to do a work task, because the person that can do that and show it off suddenly builds reputation. It comes back to my reputation, really. And to see leaders that don't understand what nerf it means, that's a massive opportunity, and that'll just keep going over the next few years. So being somebody that will champion, be responsive to AI, and is willing to learn it, and go out and play, and research, and come back and go, well, I found this generative AI thing that'll let you take photos and build them into post-its, and you should try it. Here's an example. People will be like, that's a marketing genius right there, right? And it'll save you a thousand pounds for every ad that we put out there onto Instagram. And they'll be like, and you're a commercial genius. Nailed it. So that kind of approach doesn't happen enough. Let's get started on that. Every week it's a new... I am that person. No, but tell them, what's that? Let's create a podcast. Then I choose these guys. And then just the other two things for me is data-driven decisions, so being really familiar with your data and helping that to decide the way you're taking the business. Never underestimate that. Do you want to coordinate, should I say? Okay. I'm asking you sarcastically. And then just being able to kind of adapt and be agile and continuously reinvent, so being able to pivot to the different technologies that are coming up, the different hot topics, and that innovation is very important as well, I'd say, in my top three. I think for me, coming from site, it's really the resident experience. I think you need, as a company or as an operator, to be able to build up a reputation. And as great as AI is, it's not going to fix a blocked toilet. You know, having... Yes. Yes. I mean... We still need the human contact result. Exactly. So I think, for me, I'm just going to take on resident experience as well as some stuff in the background. But what's really important is to be able to make sure that people just don't want to leave. The longer people stay, the less you have to do. And I would always say the residents that I don't see for six months were my favorite because I knew that there was nothing wrong in their apartment and they were happy where they are. So, yeah, as great as AI is, I think still that point is really important to focus on. It's like when you're trying to... You've got an issue with your internet provider and you're on it speaking to a robot. It's like, I just want to speak to a person, please. Exactly. Because it's still not mature enough either when you do want that human connection. Yeah. I think people also like to see familiar faces when they're walking in that building because it's their own home. You want people to walk in and not just think, oh, this is the building that I'm going to live in for one or two years. You want people to walk in and feel that homely feeling, which I think is important. What won't go away is the fact that great experience isn't just a nice thing, right? It drives retention. It drives revenue. It drives profit. It drives education and all of those things ultimately drive profit. And that will never go away. It's like saying, well, hotels are better when there's nobody there. That's not true, is it? Having a robot bring over some food is nice to have once, but it's not the best experience. But using AI to create up time to deliver a great resident experience and put these things together is a really powerful thing as we go forward. I think the other one is systems. Being an expert in the systems that we use to manage properties and being able to pick up different systems quickly and being open to learning them and working out how to maximize them will always be a big thing in this industry because whether it's your CMS, your financial systems, whatever it is, however far you go, being able to pick them up, know more about them, make sure they're being used to their full ability is a win, right? Who thinks we use Excel to its full capability? Who thinks we use Copilot to its full capability? There are so many systems that we all use every day that we probably use 20% of what they can actually do, right? Any of it. And we go, yeah, I understand that, sir. I mean, how many CVs have you seen that say, I am Excel literate? Yeah? So you build me macros and da-da-da-da-da. I have no idea what you're talking about. We're not Excel literate. We kind of can put some numbers in there. Equals three plus two. Five in Excel. You don't need to be either. But do we get the most out of the systems that are available to us? That's the question I should be asking of your team because it will make their lives easier. And if you can use the systems properly and do the work that's needed in a half the time, you free up that other half to go and do the cool stuff, which is engaging folks. I think how many of us have sat there for an hour responding to a complaint whereas now it's just so much easier. This is what I wanted to say and it says it. It's brilliant. Right. I'm going to try and end this discussion now. Hopefully, you guys have got one or two. Otherwise, you're going to have to listen to Tom's, I don't know, top ten cocktails and then ask him things. We'll move to the pub and that'll be it. Yeah, exactly. Any questions from what you've heard so far? Any questions about careers in general terms? I've got one. Is there any professional courses you'd encourage people to take around CTO? I'd love that question because everybody… I kind of grown up over the years where you can do courses. I can do a course. I did two in my career and I got bored of both of them. There was one that was really good. One was like five habits or seven habits of highly effective people. Those kind of courses are way better than statistics stuff, right? We have to do the detailed technical stuff every day. And we need to know the answer to detailed technical stuff as an expert in that area. So if you can do these kind of specific industry things, I don't think they grow you as a leader, as a person. They're nice. Then to pivot from that, is there any good leadership courses that you would… Seven habits of highly effective people is a great course. I think that's a great one. I think there's… Again, morning leadership. I think that's internal, but still read the books. Yes. There are courses out there. I've seen some of our training, but if you're looking for secondary ideas… There are… It depends what you want to do. It depends what you want to learn about and just stick it in AI and find out. It will give you the answer. But I think that there are great leadership courses out there. They're always worth doing, building on your leadership piece. But I don't think it's just about courses. I think it's about how you learn. And for some people, such good courses are great. For other people, Instagram is fantastic. You can talk such stuff about how to improve your SEO or how to use mental parallel or that kind of stuff. Or find a good book. I hate reading, so I listen to a podcast. But there's a great one on leadership, Diary of a CEO, which I always recommend to people. That kind of book, easy to digest and easy to kind of go, oh, I should see how that would work. Lots of things in that book. So are there courses? Yes, of course, there are courses. Great leadership stuff is always a benefit no matter where you go. The specific industry stuff I don't think is as valuable if you're going to take hours and hours out of your life to go and do it, unless it's something that really interests you. I would love to see. I mean, sort of internet. I get asked all the time by candidates, you know, should I do this or not, or should I do this or not, if that's going to get me a job here. The truth is, I hope, clients will look at it in certain areas. Maybe at the fund level, it becomes a little bit more prevalent, but then everyone's got, you know, the kind of degrees and training, and it's almost part of the corporate. So I think I left you with a question about wanting to be a professional developer. And I always don't have the experience. If you want to do it, you can do it. I don't think it may or may not get you a job or a payload, because if that's the motivation, then you might experience it, but you don't necessarily feel it's appropriate. I think it depends where you are in your career, because I think, say, for example, you know, you probably know a lot more than most people do, but then, like, obviously now, we're at ECR, we're going to see more and more candidates, but you can look at hotels and that kind of thing. I know I came into that. I had to do harder in order to be comfortable to know what I was talking about when it comes to A&T. You kind of have to do some of this in order to get the right role. So I think it depends, because if I were to say this to you now, you'd know more than probably what I would be telling you now, because it's a practical experience. So it just depends. Sorry, Arla, I have a difficult one. No, of course I don't know. That's my point. It's a really good point. I've never done Arla. I don't learn well in that environment. I sit there and look back at the person that's come to teach and argue with them that they're wrong. That's what I did at school. And I would continue to do it today. So I'd prefer to learn it another way, which other people may do. But I mean, you've got to be passionate about it. You've got to want to do it. And you've got to be doing it for the right reasons. That's a really good point. It makes you feel more comfortable in your job, in delivering. Then you should do it. I know someone who came from a similar background, but I think they're more self-confident. They're more in the leisure industry, retail. I mean, quite a few of them are. And their view is that I did not feel comfortable in this thing if I didn't do my Arla. If I didn't do my Arla. I think it's actually a relatively difficult thing to do. So they're quite rewarding. But it just saves them a little bit more confidence. I think they're more self-confident in what they're doing. Yeah, I kind of come back to myself now. Because it makes you feel better in doing it. And confident. Yeah. I was about to say something about that, actually. That I only did like a procurement course, not because I wanted the vocabulary. And I wanted that kind of badge to say, OK, well, I've been through the course. There's probably 80 things that I already do in my job. But I had such imposter syndrome. And it helped me a little bit to overcome that imposter syndrome in that particular area. And I would say to anyone working on-site as well, from a health and safety perspective, pressures in terms of complying with all the new legislation that's coming in and having to be really literate around that legislation. I did an IOSH managing safety course, which was three days, super intense. A bit like you're arguing with a little fellow doing the course. But again, most of it, you're so surprised that, OK, well, that's a risk assessment. We do risk assessments all the time. Reinforcing your knowledge, right? Exactly, but it's kind of giving you that confidence that, OK, this is how the IOSH global framework would define it. That's probably how I would approach it anyway, just from being an elf. Most of our job is just common sense. Like, it really is. But sometimes it is that I haven't maybe doing something. And yes, sometimes it's invalidated, but I haven't continued it professionally, as you said. It is just gone some days and rubbish is lost. You know, that's really interesting to me. OK. If you're at the crux of all those small businesses, if you've got very expensive, you're always ready to keep the retail of all of those backgrounds, then you've got one who's got that qualification, it does allow you to stand out. If you've had a look at that and go, oh, well, they have a competitive advantage and they've got a place in this industry, that ends. We haven't had that since that. Yes. Any other questions? I've just got something that's different. You mentioned earlier about getting noticed. And obviously you mentioned about your CM, AM, et cetera, getting noticed for them. And that's obviously great, but when you work in such a big business like Graystar, how do you get noticed across the whole company or towards the leadership? When you're someone in an early stage of a career like myself, you want to maybe try to get a bit more noticed in that way. What would you recommend are the best ways in doing that unless they might get mentioned in your leadership meetings, et cetera, and so on and so forth? What would key things, maybe targets, et cetera, what would you be looking for to go, oh, yeah, he's done really well, when there's so many assets and so many people you're looking over? I think you're probably not even realising that your name's already getting mentioned multiple times. From just turning up to work, it's such a big thing for a CM as a builder, having people that are those more junior roles, just turning up every day. It's like, thank God they've come in, and I've now got to sit at that front desk every day. So even just doing that, it will give you a good reputation. Just trying to be there for the residents. I think a loan coming in is something that I could always say, well, so-and-so is coming in today, they're not calling in sick. It's that reliability piece. I think the managers, that's just massive. I think getting your name mentioned on reviews, because people are looking. I think when people are coming in and speaking it, oh, so-and-so's done that, so-and-so's done that, so-and-so's done that, because they've just run out of their way. So you're probably not realising that your manager, whoever that might be, is probably already mentioning to people how great you are. So probably just keep doing what you're doing. I think a piece of advice I once had was, offer to help outside of your lane. So I know I've talked about it before, but if you can see somebody needs help and they're not necessarily on your site, but on a different site, say, hey, I would be happy to help you. And it's like, oh, maybe your name's not been named before, but that's how you get to start to be talked about. We've started doing it. Hopefully it's not just unique to Greystar, but we've started doing talent mapping. We're really starting to get our leaders to think about who is our talent within the business. Do they have high potential? If they do, how can we help them fulfil that potential? So, again, just to the point, your name's already been talked about by your leaders, as it is. You might just not know about it. People aren't always the best at communicating it. But- If names go up, the fact they've gone up doesn't get mentioned when they go back down, right? Because you don't know often what's being talked about. I think there's stuff you can do now that's externally as well, which is being politically talked about, which is our role to think hard about- Trying to create people now, it's a holiday. But it's about, like, I would say, if you said everything you share, obviously it's the stuff about your industry and your role. Having stuff like this is also, like, great. But, you know, there's people that I know in my world that genuinely kind of showcase and kind of, like, challenge you on-site with the whole of the community, obviously, certainly, and have a bit of a presence on the internet or other channels. I'm not taking that feeling on personal grounds, but I think there is an element of actually kind of, like, sharing and talking about stuff to your market, to a wider audience. I actually think that's a good thing to do. But I do think there's an element of that. It's not just about, how do I get noticed internally? It's how do I talk about something to a wider audience, and a regular basis, and keep things that way. So enough of stuff like this. Graves has obviously done a great job of really pushing the pathway of collaborations with ECR, Proulard, with kind of the more and more events that have come up recently, like myself, to come in early stages, where it's a place for conferences, where it's a place for investors, and how much is your face to make on the building, whatever that even means. You know what I mean? So it's kind of like putting yourself out there a little bit as well. It is. So I've mentioned so many reasons. The front line, team members. When a resident writes a letter to the CEO of a business and says, I just want to call out this person for doing such an amazing job, that gets hated. Right? We have what's called our lead tables, so that we are looking at who's kind of achieved high conversion rates, and all that kind of thing. It's a bit of fun. And it's a bit of competition. And it's a bit of commerciality all mixed in with that. But it's also an opportunity for me to see, hang on, who is this person at the top? Right? We have our annual awards. Who is the person here? We have our monthly heroes. Who is the person? That gets brought to that. We have our talent. That thing and all that comes up, and it doesn't justify why people are in certain places. But early in a career, do your job well. Look for problem systems. Look for opportunities to put your hand up to high revenue or save costs. Keep doing it. Keep building those, your reputation and the network, and you will get noticed. Right? Turn up at stuff like this. Because how many people work in built-to-rent across London? What do we reckon? Hundreds? Right? And who are the only people interested? You guys. Right? So do that. And the other one I'd say, it's not about getting mentioned within your own senior leadership team. But when you go to something like AR&L's NextGen Cafe conference, be the person with the best damn question in the room. Right? When you listen to someone on that stage, and they say, has anybody got any questions? Be the one that asks the best, most difficult question of that panel, and everyone in the room will go, shit, who was that? Right? People pay attention. Because no one likes asking questions. And for 10 seconds, you put yourself out of your comfort zone with a question that AI's just written for you. Um... I did that at the home of these conferences. To a panel talking about AI. So I thought I'd co-pilot the question. Um, but actually think about it. Go in with a good question, and people will start saying, if you're in my team, I'm sat there going, I'm proud of that thing. Because they've represented the company really well. So, there's all sorts of ways. But do your job, perform brilliantly, look for opportunities, put your hand up, build network, build reputation. 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