Personal Pan Podcast 4 You 02

You can step on my face, shit on my balls, fart on my cat, and hike my grass, but you don't take my blue suede shoes. They're the source of my power, don't steal my blue suede shoes. How you doing? Hi, how's it going? It's me, again. I told you this was going to be a weekly thing, and it's a new week, here I am. I meant to record this yesterday, but I took a really long walk, and I didn't fucking feel like it. Hello, and welcome to another episode of Parcel Pan Podcast To You. This is Ryan, a.k.a. Crocodile, a.k.a. Naked McSexav, a.k.a. the blue suede shoes. That's my superhero name now. I'm like Samson, except if you cut off my shoes, I will die. So, I don't know, it's the second one, I don't have a rhythm yet. I guess I'll just, if you, since it's the second one, I'll just go over this nonsense again. This is just a little off the top of my head, off the dome recording thing, where I talk about production of writing books, making things, whatever I'm working on, just a little something, something for you patrons, who I appreciate so much. There were two of you, a $10 and a $5 one. I should shout you out, like, for real, real, I should shout you out. Let me look up what your names were, because it means a lot, and I want you to know how much it means that people would actually become patrons of mine. The Black Hammer became a $3 patron last week, and there was one more. I gotta find the email where they were like, Ayo, Ayo, people have decided to go above and beyond, it's fucked up, what the shit. I'll make you get the book for free. There were like, people, there were like three different things where people bought it on fuckin' Gumroad. Mr. C, Double Geely Mourner, thank you also for becoming a $10 member, that's crazy, I appreciate you guys so, so much for helping me out like this, and believing in this stupid thing that I'm doing. Yeah, so, for mostly this week, like I talked about last week, I've been setting up for doing a Kickstarter for getting the illustrations and remaining character designs done. The first thing I've been doing is working on mockups of four of the illustrations that I expect to put in there, because I'm like, you know, if you have a, the issue of trying to have a Kickstarter for, you know, I want money so that I can get art to be put into this book, I don't have any art to show you, aside from like some of the things that's already been done, I only have enough character sheets, which is like one, like a fifth of the thing I'm asking for your money for, trust me, it's gotta be good, so by having like little mockups, they're not, I'm not really doing like a full like illustration like I expect the final product to be, but like, basically sketches, which take forever for me, because I did say last week that I am focusing on drawing and I've been developing a style, and I was like, oh, I've gotten one that I like. Turns out, even though I've gotten one that I like, I'm not good at it. Especially, especially if you try to, you know, drawing people laying sideways is hard for some reason. I don't know why. I think it's because I'm so, you're so used to drawing them at one straight up or slanted position that like when you skew it, it's like, how the fuck long is this person supposed to be? I don't know. I know you can just rotate the canvas and like draw them like that, but at the same time, it's, I don't know, it's, but something that has been helping with doing that and getting it right is starting the fuck over. I feel like a lot of people are afraid to just say, you know what? This isn't working. Let's just, let's just do it. Let's just do it again. You know? And like, the way you could think about it is, if we didn't start over, if like you don't start over if something isn't working out and you just try to brute force it, we wouldn't have Trogdor. We would have the S's for Socks Dragon. That's all we would have, you know? And then like from that, you start over, you take the things that did work, you take the S, the consonant V's, all that stuff, and then you make something, you make something legendary. You make Trogdor, and then you get a song that goes into Guitar Hero. But, so, yeah, that's actually been really helping out is just the ability to say, you know what? Actually, fuck this. Me from like 20 minutes ago didn't know shit. Or rather, me from like three days ago didn't know shit. Let me come back at it, older, wiser, saggier, tireder, and then when you try it again and things start working, you're like, oh shit, I'm younger than I've ever been, ever in my entire life. I'm so fucking strong and good and handsome and smart. Yeah, I probably should just, I'm thinking about maybe putting together a list of the illustrations. I mean, I probably will have to for the thing, because I have to tell them, like, hey, here are the things that, like, I'm not just farting around. I actually have a list of things that I want to, like, I know the illustrations I already want done, so, like, I know of the ones that I can get, like, from just a baseline, like, not even getting to the stretch goal, the additional ones. I know the scene where Rich leans over Nick and he's, like, he's, like, telling him the whole, like, if I couldn't do it, then you can't do it thing, because he's trying to be nice, except he isn't trying to be nice. That thing, just to get the three bobcats and Nick just as a good establishing illustration to just, like, here's four characters. Here's the dynamic that each of these have. And then after that, Selma and Nick rubbing shoulders is just such a, it's such a nice visual that I really like that I feel like is, I don't know. That in particular was just, like, I don't know. I don't know. It's just a very, it's a very iconic thing that just doesn't really, I don't really know why. I don't know why. I think that's, like, it's probably because that's the first time that they're not on antagonistic grounds, where they're just, like, and I can tell that it does mean something, because I wrote about it in the third book, where, like, they're, like, they're telling Tess and Monica about the first time that they, like, actually bonded, and he's, like, yeah, when we, like, first met Eleanor, it was, like, the first time that we really clicked on something. So Eleanor's, like, we bonded before that. We were cool before that. Remember when we were, like, rubbing shoulders? And Nick is, like, yeah, that was, like, that was, like, 20 seconds before you stole the light in my apartment and squeezed my soul. And she's, like, yeah! Yeah, it's bonding! Um, and then, like, I guess, just jumping, I'm not gonna list every single one of them, because that, I don't expect that to be interesting to you. That's more of, like, a, that's a patch notes-ass, like, like, announcement page kind of thing. So, like, I know other things would be, like, them sitting on the bench and looking at the sky when she first realizes that it's not orange. Uh, the, obviously, when Tangraft first shows up in the alleyway where she's, uh, where she's, like, running into Laevito, uh, uh, what are things? Um, her chokeslamming Nick into a coffee table and holding a, uh, a collector's plate above her head like a belt buckle, um, or like a championship belt. Them on the phone were, like, just, like, cut it diagonally with her on one side looking at the, the board that he wrote his own phone number on, and on the other side Nick just looking really ashamed, but in the background there's Mr. Graves and Tori raising the roof over calling that a ghost would call back. Uh, you know, stuff, stuff like that. I could, uh. Uh, I said last week that this is supposed to be a thing where, like, if you want to listen to me ramble on about my own bullshit, this is the place. If you are a freak, this is where you be a freak. And even still, I feel embarrassed about, about blathering on about my own horseshit, and I really shouldn't, you know? But I do. I feel really, it's, it's like, uh, cringe is, cringe is not a, like a, like a, it's not a, it's a, it's a limitation that I think that both you and haters and yourself, when you are your own hater, put on yourself. Or put on yourself. Because it's like, a lot of times when, like, you look online and, like, uh, fucking 4chan or whatever, or Reddit, and they're talking about, like, oh, this guy's so cringe, it's usually just, like, this is a person who really enjoys something and they're not, like, they're not held back by the perception of other people to enjoy the things that they enjoy doing or seeing or what have you. And, like, I, I know the, the saying is, like, I am cringe but I am free. And that, it's such a hard thing to just, like, know it and then acknowledge it and understand it, to understand that to be cringe is to be free. But at the same time, it's just, like, okay, no, it's not that I feel cringe as in, like, oh, I'm embarrassing myself, it's cringe as in I'm, like, I'm boring you, aren't I? You know I hear this shit. I'm sorry, I'm talking about stupid and dumb. Please talk to me about your passion. Tell me about your savings bonds, please. Thank you. You know, it is cringe. It's so ironic that the people who call things cringe are usually the ones who are, like, I mean, it's the fucking, is that your fursona you're drawing? That's so cringe. You're cringe. It is. It is. I think, like, the fucking scumuloid racists on 4chan are so unbelievably cringe. The idea of, again, I'm sorry that I'm getting off topic, but I just have to say, racism is really cringe, isn't it? Like, I know that sounds like a fucking, like, ad council. They're like, huh, you know what's really cringe? Racism and not accepting others and skipping school and not doing your homework. That's pretty cringe. But, like, hear me out. I think the idea of a person being so, because it's never, it's never just, like, casual racism. It's not, like, just, like, ooh, I don't trust those kind of people. It's always, like, that's their entire thing. Like, they can't go five seconds without being racist. They have to, like, it's, like, you know how, like, crypto tech bros are always, like, everything, they, like, make wraps and, like, wear t-shirts or, like, when they tweet, all they talk about is, like, their investments and how much they make or whatever or, like, I just bought a brand, I just bought, like, a billion different units of fart coin. Yeah, I've got, there's nowhere to go but up on fart coin. Like, that's their entire personality? Try that, but, like, try that but for hating, like, one singular kind of person. That's their whole personality. Like, everything that they talk about, that worms their way into their, like, interests, the way they talk, they spend time on it, like, the way that if you were, like, oh, my new hyper fixation is Delicious in Dungeon. I love that show. All I do is just draw fan art about that. It's like, well, my entire personality is hating a singular kind of person, my whole personality is hating people browner than me, so I guess here is, well, it's not even because, you know, racism can't be a fandom, so it's more of, like, I guess my interests are finding people to, finding brown people to antagonize. It's, it's cringe. It's really, like, it's, like, this is, this is what you do. This is what you've decided to do for your life, uh-huh. All right, cool. I mean, not cool. You're a loser. Why did I talk about that for, like, five minutes? Five minutes! I, okay, it's episode, it's the second, it's the second part of this. It's the second part of this. You only, you came here to listen to me ramble on about anything. By, I assure you, I'm not gonna, I was gonna say episode, I was gonna say five. I'm gonna say by show eight. By show eight, I will be so comfortable in this that I will just be going on tangents left, right, left, right, and center. I'm gonna be on left, right, and center, and they're gonna be like, coming up next, this weirdo keeps talking to himself about whatever. It is under a blanket. Left, right, and center is, that's a, that's like there's, no, left, right, and center is like an interview show, right? So, yeah, they would have me on here. Would I still be under a blanket? Maybe I could do what Kevin Perger did, and I could be on left, right, and center, but I can use a plastic skeleton as my, it's a radio show! Why, and I've been on broadcast. People have seen my face. What the fuck am I talking about? Kevin Perger, the Defunctland guy, he, he was on the, the, the, what is it? Maker? Watcher, he was on the Watcher show about theme parks, their visual podcasts, and instead of being actually on film, he just put a plastic skeleton in the chair, and I think he sat behind them, and he just talked from there, which is just, just such a, just such an iconic move. I've almost been talking about not making things on this podcast. I talk about being creative for almost ten minutes. Is it seven minutes of me just rambling on about horseshit? If you, if you like this, leave a comment. If this is what you like, please tell me. Please reassure me. If you, if you, if this is what you're in for, then, then just say like, yeah, actually, I, I like when you just keep talking about horseshit. That's, that's kind of what I'm here for. But if you don't, if you're just like, uh, hmm, I wish you would talk more about your weird book, don't, don't say anything, because if you say, I wish you would talk more about your weird book, I will, I'll get really self-conscious. I will add an extra ten minutes to the show to make up for this rambling, if I still have things to talk about. I'm not, I mean, there's not like a hard time limit on this, but whatever. Um, third book. Writing, writing's going good. I had a really, I had a really good, uh, I was writing, yeah, I go to, uh, I walk down to a coffee shop to do my writing, because I can't, uh, I live in a very small house. Well, it's not like really small, but it's, it's not, I don't have like a, a, a, enough space to designate a place where I sleep and play video games and a place where I, uh, where I work. So, uh, going out to different places to write really helps me focus, because there is literally nothing else I could do but write. So I just take a, take my iPad and, um, to go down to a coffee shop and, uh, I just, I, I get a chai tea and I, or a chai latte and I, uh, I just write. And, um, if you, if you notice me, don't say anything. Don't acknowledge me. Don't, don't talk to me. Please don't. Don't look for me. If you see someone writing with a, with a, on an iPad in a coffee shop, it's not me. I can guarantee you, it isn't. Um, but, um, usually when I was writing, it would be like, uh, I would write, uh, very hard and like me talking to myself. It wasn't really prose. It was just like, no, it was more of like just generally trying to like word out, just talking to myself, saying like, and then this is how this happens and here's how this stuff happens. But this was like the first time in a long time that I was actually writing like prototype prose for the book as opposed to just like, because I think I don't, I am not ever going to shut up about this, but I got a new mattress and, uh, the previous mattress I had been sleeping on was like 20 years old. And for the first time yesterday was like the night before was the first night that I had slept on it. And for the first time it felt like I had gotten up and wasn't beaten with a lead pipes for eight hours. I got up, I felt great and I was able to work because I had gotten good sleep. And I think that might have something to do with it or it's a placebo effect. Either way, I'm happy and I'm writing and I feel good about it. And yeah, um, and, uh, like I said last time, it's, it's not like, obviously this is a rough draft, so it's not like none of this is, a lot of it is going to get trimmed and cut out and reworked anyway. Um, and I don't expect it to say, so I just write just to build the framework and then I'll adjust it later. Um, but a lot of the stuff that I've been writing has been coming really easily and it's not like I, I don't write and feel like, ah, we'll just knock that out and post. It's more like, yeah, I could actually really work on this. I could really work with this. This is, this is really working with, for me. Um, and, um, yeah, it's, it's good. Good stuff. Um, I will not have something for you to look at for a very long time. Uh, cause we're only in like, I mean, I'm, I'm trying to write a chapter a week. And, uh, so that means, uh, on average, these books are like 25 chapters. So you're going to have to wait another 20 weeks. That's like, you're going to have to wait until, oh God, wait, oh no, I just realized, oh no, wait, 1, 2, 3, 4, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, oh, okay, May, well, no, May is pretty late. May is pretty late. That's like five months. That's like five months. I gotta, I gotta speed things up. I can't just do one. See, like, I was going off of when I was putting out the, uh, the first draft of the second book, and I was doing a chapter a week. Um, that's, that's not gonna be fast enough. I gotta, I gotta speed things up. Well, it's a good thing I was talking about this out loud, cause I wouldn't, I would and it'd be too late. I'd be like, huh, it's, it's like May and I'm almost done. Wow, that's pretty, oh no, that's like halfway through the year. Oh shit, time is a linear, time is a linear progression. I mean, I guess I'm working on other stuff while I'm doing it, but I guess I could be more active while I'm doing things, but I, whatever, I'll think about later. Things are going good. Things are, things are progressing well. I'm, I'm happy with the way that things have been progressing with writing this, and, um, yeah. Um, hopefully I can get Kickstarter stuff done and write this at the same time. I am only one person, but I, I, I want to get these things done. I want to do these things. I wanna do it for you. Specifically you, Roger. I'm going to bet that I don't have a single patron named Roger. That seems like the kind of name that would not be, I don't think a Roger would, would be interested in books. Anyway, um, the thing that I really wanted to talk about was, um, last week I, I think I, I hinted towards talking about, uh, certain characters because, um, uh, if you're like one of the, if you're around, uh, around like last year I think was when I made it, or maybe it was a year before. No, it would have to be last year. Uh, last year I was playing out, like, I like made a video about like, oh, I'm just doing these little videos about, like, character design so I feel like I want to do and talking about character design because I like, I like character design. I think it's really fun and I'd like to do that. And then I did one, I was like, editing videos is fucking hard. Fuck this. So I only did one. Um, I wanted to talk about, uh, some characters, or character designs and, um, I wanted to start with the Bobcats, uh, Rich, Dave, and Ian. Uh, when I was thinking, I was like brainstorming making a video about them, uh, I was, I was thinking, like, uh, there's like a billion video essays on, like, oh, why do we love villains? Why are villains so cool? Why do we love them? Why do we hate, love to hate them? And I'm like, that's not, well, first off, the Bobcats are not villains. To call them villains, to even call them antagonists, is, that is a stretch, that is a yoga, that is a, a dolphin level stretch. That is a full screen stretch. It's like, no, no, those three are not, those three are not enemies or antagonists. They're jerks. They're just, they're just jerks. Um, but, like, the way that I look at them, it's kind of like, uh, The Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog. That's a great way to, that's a great way to start this sentence. The Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog, and Ed, Edd, and Eddie, have, they're, they're parallel in one specific way, and that is, they are two cartoons in which the antagonists are kind of the protag, well, the antagonists in Ed, Edd, and Eddie are the protagonists. The Eds are three kids that are looking to scam, they're three outcast kids who are looking to scam their, uh, neighbors out of their allowances. And in Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog, uh, Sonic and Tails are fucking annoying and terrible and you don't like them. But Robotnik is extremely charismatic, and there is a reason why YouTube poops of, uh, Adventures of Sonic the Hedgehog are all focusing on Robotnik. It's because he's the best character. He's the character that people like. People actually care about Robotnik because he's, well, he's a character with a goal, and he's got ambition, he's got charisma, he, and in a certain, and it, like, it kind of, in a sense, when you watch the cartoon, you actually kind of want him to succeed, but he never does, because he's the antagonist, and Sonic has to ruin his plans. In the same way that, like, Ed, Edd, and Eddie is a cartoon about three antagonists who have plans, they have ambitions, and those ambitions never come to fruition. They always end up, they always end up coming up short. They never end up with money to go to the candy store, or if they do, it always ends up turning on their heads. And that was kind of the, the idea of trying to make, when I was, like, coming up with those three, the Bobcats as characters, that was kind of the thing that I was thinking of, is that you want to make, if I just made them completely unlikable jerks, then things might get a little too real. It would just be like, oh, god, I hate that these guys are around. Because, like, um, it's, it's like, there's a, there's a very fine line between making an Ed, Edd, and Eddie, and making an Eric Cartman, where it's like, why the fuck do, why the fuck do these kids even hang out with Cartman? And, like, I know people will be like, oh, because the Scott Tenorman thing showed up, he's like, he's like, they're like, oh, we can't mess with Cartman, he's, he's crazy, dude. It's like, no, no, he's a dumb, he's a dumb, bratty, idiot kid that keeps flip-flopping back and forth between being a genius mastermind and a dumb, idiot, bratty kid. Because, I'm not gonna get into it, but, the thing is, they should be like, I want them to be, the idea was to make them antagonistic, but ultimately harmless. They're just, they have a charisma like, like Robotnik does, where Robotnik is just a mean-sum bitch, but, like, you still kinda wanna hang out with him. So, the idea was to create three guys that embodied sort of, uh, I think I've gone out of tangent, because I don't know how to really connect these things together, but I'm gonna try. So, initially, when I first came up with, like, as a series, coming up with these, like, with these three guys, the idea was just to create three guys that just embodied, um, painfully average white guys, like, uh, and you can kinda see where that kind of prototype has, like, stayed with them, where Rich is, you know, tech bro, investor, uh, investor mind, uh, I got, everything is about making money and status and, uh, success. You got, um, I completely removed from any kind of actual research, because I have a job, and I just kinda go with what the, uh, status quo mentality is, kinda guy who seems to, who feels like he knows more than everybody, because he just does what his parents did, and then you have guy who peaks in college and hasn't since, and wants to continue, uh, being in that same kind of status in college, but can't, and for added flavor, he is also extremely unlucky. And, you know, it eventually got to a point where, like, I was, when I was writing them, I don't know if it was in the very first draft of the, uh, of, uh, book one, but they were really just insufferable. They were monstrous in, like, the way that they were designed, and I think it was because it was like, I didn't even, like, I didn't even like them. It was, they were just designed to be, like, the most hateable assholes just forever to work with, and it was just like, Nick interacting with them was just like, it was like, uh, it was described to me as just a social beatdown. It was not, it was depressing, it was just, it was, it was not good, and eventually it got to the point where I was just like, this seems like both mean to, this is a mean thing for Nick to go through, but it's also a mean thing for the, for the reader to go through, but also it's a mean thing for the bobcats themselves to go through, you know? Cause it's like, it's kinda like, who really benefits from having character, like, does the story really benefit from having characters that are like this? That are this, like, there's a, there's a, I talk about it, like, it's talked about, it's referenced in the third book, but there's a, there's a concept that I heard in a Dan Olson video about, it's this concept called the magic circle, which is the boundary between play and reality, where, like, uh, when you play soccer, everybody assumes, like, everybody believes in the role that they have to play as soccer players, where it's like, you can't go outside the boundaries, if the ball goes outside, everything has to stop and we have to throw it back in, uh, you can't touch the thing, the ball with your hands, you, you know, it's like all these different rules, and those are the things, and we, and those are the rules, and the players buy into those rules, and that's what keeps play continuing. Um, but then when something, when reality steps over the circle, when they step over the line of the circle, that's when the boundary breaks and everything in play has to stop. So, if one of the soccer players were to, say, kick another soccer player straight in the nose and break his, like, break his nose, the magic circle is broken, and play has to stop, and that, because reality has crossed over into play, so now we can't play anymore until we address this thing and we can reestablish the circle, and if we can't, then play has to stop altogether. Um, so, in creating people who are just, like, realistically just the most awful kind of guy, like, the most, like, venomous coworker, the most venomous toxic coworker to work with, it kind of stopped being like, this is no longer, like, this fun, weird book about, uh, about demons and pasta. This is, like, a weird, almost hateful kind of, like, vitriol, and I think it, it also comes back to when I was talking about Yelp last week, where, like, tropes that I hate would somehow, like, weasel their way into my writing, where it's like, uh, a trope that I fucking despise is in anime where, like, you have a man or a woman that is just, like, comically evil to the point where it's like, this feels like, it feels like it's supposed to be a stand-in for someone that the author knows. And, like, or, you know the, the type where it's like, they go from having, like, looking like a face on the caliber of everyone else to a highly, like, uh, a really detailed face with a bunch of wrinkles and their pupils go small and their, they, like, like, their, their, like, faces are overshadowed and shit, and it's like, uh, okay, uh, alright, yes, I, I get it, you're the, you're evil now, you are secret evil person, oh no, great. I mean, I, I guess this is overtly evil and, like, you have the, like, characters that are just like that all the time, but I, I don't like it. And it got to the point where I was just like, the, this isn't working for this story, this is not, these are not the kind of characters that should be in the story. So, and it also kind of came out where, like, in the narrative, it was also pointed out to me that the narrative was extremely mean to them, where, like, in the first chapter it was describing each of them as, like, these guys suck, these guys suck, these guys suck, these guys suck. And I decided that, yeah, oh, the recording thing is getting a little weird, is, is Tenacity recording still? I have no idea. It, it, it went again. Over. Um, it got to the point where I was, I, I came to the decision that it would be better to keep them as three guys that suck, but I want the reader to, to come to that conclusion. I don't want to tell them. I don't want them to understand that they suck, but I also want them to, I want the reader themselves to come to a conclusion, like, their own conclusion of how they feel about them. And that opened up a, a new avenue to where it was like, instead of just saying, like, like, just having it be the binary, this is a bad person, instead they could find, like, why is this guy a bad person? Why are these guys, like, jerks? Why are they this way? And then it also kind of informs them as to how their own, uh, the things that make them bad or mean or just unpleasant to be around is also kind of the reasons why they are the way, like, why they are that way to everybody else. And, um, I think the reason why I wanted to talk about them in this video that I think, I think I talked about last time is that they do kind of play a pretty big role in the third book in that they've been kind of passive characters just kind of in the background, uh, adding flavor to the whole thing. Like, in, in book one, they were just kind of there to establish what the working condition that Nick would be in and, uh, kind of establishing, like, why he would feel so lonely enough to, uh, want to try to make friends with a monster. And, and then book two, they're kind of there as like, it's kind of like, you get kind of a taste as to how certain other coworkers think of them. And, uh, in the way that Delia won't even talk to Rich and it has to deliver her lectures secondhand through Nick to Rich. Um, so I guess, let me just, let's, let's just start, let's just start with him. Richard. Richard. Richard. I love Richard. I love Rich because of just how, how just, I don't know how to, how to describe it, but he, I think it's, it's that his name, I mean, obviously it's, it kind of comes from like, uh, yeah, he's a, he's kind of like a money obsessed kind of guy. He's a, a wealth and status kind of person. He, it's, it's, but it's like, it's also that, like, there's a, the, the superficial, uh, status of his being also comes through the fact that his name is Rich. Let, let me explain. So, I don't, in, uh, the first, the first version of book one, there was, uh, the, the idea was that to, to have like a portrait of the character and then like a little rundown of them. But again, in the, uh, show don't tell kind of manner of the book, I decided to drop that. But it did have a bit of a backstory for him where throughout his entire life, Rich has had this kind of idea that the way that the way to success is to associate yourself with people above you. And, uh, that kind of, uh, imbibed itself as integrating himself with like older people, like he wouldn't play with kids his own age, he would play with older kids. He would talk to adults. He would, uh, he, he has an idea that people are on certain levels and he needs to be above his level and that anyone below him isn't worth, uh, talking to because there's, there's no success to be found there. And in doing that, it's kind of changed him to be like, he's no longer about himself, he's more about what other people want. And in his design, one of the things I brought up was that he should show that in having a bunch of accessories and having a bunch of rings that he wears, a bunch of watches and like clothes and everything. Those are the things that he shows to be like, yeah, I'm a big time Rich guy player. Absolutely. Oh wait, you don't like the rings and the watches? Yeah, no, that's no problem. I can take these off. No, that's, that's totally fine. I'll do whatever you need for me to move on up in society. I'll, I'm absolutely here for that. Yup. Yup. And it's like, again, I think that, Oh my God. Oh my God. Holy shit. We're making a call back. It was all planned. No, I, I did it. I meant, I meant it. I meant it. I meant to do this. That whole thing where I was talking about how like, uh, tech bro investors, their whole personality is based around, um, crypto or more importantly, it's all based around money. It is all based around earning. It is all based around status. It is all based around technology, but it's not, their personality has nothing to do with themselves. That's kind of Rich's problem in that he doesn't really have anything to himself that he's really kind of cultivated except the, an obsession with status and money and, uh, what other people perceive him as. And even though he's like, yeah, no, I don't really bother with people who are below me. He still needs people to be below him and he still cares about what people below him see him as because he needs to have them see him as someone above them, you know? And I, I think that's really what I enjoy about him is that in, in having that lack of real like self-acknowledgement of not really knowing, he doesn't exactly know who he as a person is in that sense. He kind of, I guess he doesn't really realize like how far of a, like how far beyond boundaries that he's gone or how big of a fool that he's made himself. And in a certain kind of morbid way, that's sort of admirable that he doesn't have those limitations, that he'll just keep doing what he wants. It just, like, he does what he cares about, but what he cares about is bad. And I don't know, I think that's, that is why people like villains, why people like bad people. People like bad people because they're kind of like a gross misinterpretation of things that are very human. It's the, I think I, I read it somewhere where it's like, it's sort of the, the, the ability to, to see, it's kind of like in having the ability to, well, okay, no, villains, let me get my thoughts together. Sorry, I'm, I'm going too fast, which is another thing that Rich does I'll talk about. Villains are usually people who are outcasts and people who are on the outside, right? They're people who, in most cases, they're people who have, who are trying to change something within the universe to fit to their own, like, view of how the world should be. And that is a very relatable thing because all of us who are not extremely rich or extremely powerful are on, in a society that isn't made for us. Society is made to work for the most wealthy, the most powerful, the extremely privileged, and the fantasy of not having, like, just doing away with the care of like, well, I mean, I can't do this because it's evil, because people would get hurt. Just being like, nah, fuck that, I'm, I want it, so it's mine, I'm doing it, fuck, fuck them kids. That is what we admire about antagonists, and I guess that's what I admire about Rich. I guess just another thing. The whole thing, he has that thing where when he talks, he says something wrong or he says, he, like, says something that could be misconstrued as something else. His phrasing is bad. It's, it's a way of establishing that, that kind of mentality of like, he's just kind of saying things to say things, and in doing that, his brain moves slower than his mouth, so he'll just keep talking, and then eventually his brain catches up with what he says, and then he, he feels obligated to change it to be like, oh no, I'm blowing this, uh, no, actually, no, wait, shut up, hold on, wait, wait, let me rephrase that, no, I'm so cool, I'm so cool, please give me a job. Um. David. David was, uh, he began as, the idea was to create the most painfully basic person on the planet, and that is a challenge in two ways. One, I don't, I have to actually find out what, what, I'm not going to say normies, because that's, that can be, that can mean anything. The term I use is general audiences. I have to look into what general audiences are into, what they enjoy, what they think of, what the, their opinions, um, I have to find, like, the most common denominator, and the other, the, the, the issue with that is, um, oftentimes I forget that Dave is supposed to be basic, not boring, and there is a difference between that. Um, boring is to enjoy things that are not exciting. To be basic is to enjoy things that other people, that, like, everybody likes. And a lot of times, it's like, Dave isn't a boring person. He's not, by, by any means, he's not boring, he is just, there's just not anything extraordinary about him. And that on itself isn't bad, it's more, like, sure, you can be, being basic is, I mean, I, I saw, there was, um, uh, I'm going to shout out a very good, uh, uh, video essayist, uh, Shansphere, uh, let me actually get the spelling so that, uh, her, yeah, S-H-A-N-S-P-E-A-R-E, like Shakespeare, but Shan, then. Uh, she did a video on, or they did a video on, uh, basic bitches, and it's, um, it does, it goes into the idea of, like, uh, what it, what it means to be basic and why it's been vilified as an attribute for a person, usually for women, but, um, it's kind of like, the idea that, that you are not special, or, like, that you don't have tastes that are unique, or that other people, like, you don't have anything that a person would be like, oh, what is that? That makes you not interesting, or that's bad, but it's like, things that are popular are popular for a reason. So, like, it's, um, it's not boring to be basic, it's just not extraordinary, but it's not bad. And the issue with Dave is that he is, Dave is a know-it-all. Dave is, is, uh, characterized by his smugness in believing that he knows, like, his, the fact that he feels that, like, his basicness has mutated, we should say, it's mutated into, uh, a form of smugness where he feels like, by doing everything that his parents have done, that's how you get success. He thinks that the things that his parents did were, he did, their parents, his parents did everything right, and therefore by doing everything that they did, he should be able to find success like they did. Very easy. You know, the same kind of, uh, mentality that boomers have where they're just like, why don't you just get a job? Well, I've walked into a Big Five and they said, hey, are you looking for a job? Yes? Here's enough money to start a family. This was 50 years ago. So, and in the books you can see that his attempts to emulate his family have ended pretty poorly in that he's had to deal with, like, uh, dating app psychos and his own being a, a sort of dating app psycho, um, his inability to, uh, follow through on each step. He bought a house, he bought a two-story house like the one he grew up in, but he's alone in it. Um, and the barrier that his own ego kind of puts in front of him progressing anywhere, it's like, he doesn't really understand the, that things are nuanced and that times change and that things, uh, you, you can't just copy what your parents did. And even then what your parents did might not actually be that, like, the perfect way to get happiness, but he does it anyway. He is a know-it-all. He thinks he knows, uh, how to get what he wants. And also, like, in book two, um, the, when he, his whole idea of, like, he's only gone after the same kind of girls, but then the minute he sees Selina, a woman who is not, not a woman who is five foot five and has bangs and grew up in a small town like him, but is actually six foot three and also from another fucking plane of reality, he's kind of had this bump in his life where he, it's kind of like, well, this is a different person. That's kind of thrilling and exciting and scary to me. Oh no. So it's kind of like a giddiness of, like, do I actually like things being different? Do I actually want to do things differently? But at the same time, he's also like, this is aberrant and it's exciting, but maybe I could force aberration back into, into normality. I can't really go into much else, but that's, yeah. Um, oh, another thing I forgot. Um, Brojumbo was the, uh, the, the artist who designed Rich and he is, I will be going back to him, uh, to design both Dave and Ian, but something that I brought up was there are two philosophies, or rather three philosophies that I go with, uh, for designing these guys. Uh, the first one is one that I'm going with for a lot of characters who are together where I want them designed by the same person. Um, I follow a kind of what I call the Bubz and Coach Z dynamic where two characters that are usually seen together should look like they go together, which is why I have the same character, the same artist draw them, because I, it's just like Bubz is, uh, short and stocky. Coach Z is tall and thin. They're just two characters that look like, the two-oh duo look like they go together. And to emphasize that even harder with the Bobcats, the second philosophy that I went with was basic shapes. Uh, Rich is triangles, Dave would be squares, and Ian would be circles. Not to make them directly shaped like them, but, uh, you can see it in, like, uh, Rich's design. He's got sharp, he's got, like, sharp pointy teeth, not like demon, like a demon shark teeth, but he just has sharpie teeth. Uh, his tie goes into his, uh, vest at angles. Uh, the bottom of it opens up into a triangle. Uh, his head is shaped triangularly, his hair is shaped triangularly. All of it is very angular and sharp. Dave is going to be very boxy. Uh, Ian is going to be very round and soft. And then the third thing that, uh, that, uh, I designed them around is this one Tumblr post that I saw that was, um, okay, uh, apparently, it's, why is it a gif? This, this is not a gif, it's a, it's a still image. Um, uh, the, it's a, well, okay, it's a, it's a cap of a, um, of a tweet that says, the fact that cis straight guys are still so insistent that they have to be muscle hunks to get girls when, frankly, most women I know want a little elf prince, a depressed middle-aged father, or a line cook is so funny. And then they have a picture of, I don't know who any of these people are, but it is a vent, a three-way vent diagram of a K-pop singer as an elf prince, a, some kind of YouTuber with very sunken, sunken eyes, but an angular look as a line cook, and then a dude slumped over with a full beard and messy hair as a depressed father, and all the combinations of them, I know one of them is the combination of depressed father and elf prince is Andrew Garfield, and then line cook and depressed father is, uh, Mads Mikkelsen, I don't know who line cook elf prince is, and then in the middle is some guy in a, in a tracksuit, and then someone said in the middle, of course, Jerma is the fucking center, but none of the men are Jerma. That is the, anyway, the, the three kinds of, of, these three types of people are what they're based around. Riz is a line cook, Dave is a depressed father, Ian is an elf prince. Except, well, I guess this goes into, this is a good way to segue into Ian. Uh, Ian looked like a proper elf prince, but, uh, since he, uh, since his, he peaked in college and it's been going downhill, he's kind of hit that kind of, he looks more like a, uh, an elf prince with depression after a few years of set, of wallowing in that depression. Um, so, initially, the idea of Ian was supposed to be just a guy who has some bad luck, and I didn't really, it wasn't real, there wasn't any kind of archetype of mediocrity that was supposed to go into him, and frankly, I don't actually know if I want to explain what kind of archetype he falls into. Because I feel like, narratively, Ian as a character works best if you once again make your own, uh, assumptions about him. Uh, if you, again, uh, going back to the, the little character blurbs in the, uh, the first version of the, of book one, uh, Ian is, I have described him as the human equivalent of falling downstairs, and he, when he was, when he was in high school, he was a very attractive and very popular person, and he got married the minute he got out of high school, and that didn't work out, he got a divorce, and around the time that he graduated was the time that everything started to go downhill, and he started a slew of just very inconvenient bad luckitudes that have never really, that have kind of kept him in a position of not, like, optimism, but more of just, it's okay, guys! Not exactly like, everything's gonna be alright, but more of like, oh, you just gotta keep trying and trying and trying again, and eventually it won't be as bad, you know? It'll work out eventually. And he's just kind of been trying to recapture that, uh, that height where he was a popular person who, uh, everybody liked that he was in college and high school, but he cannot. But he feels that, like, well, again, he's a character that works best if you make your own assumptions about him. And, uh, the part with him in book two kinda sets up where his trajectory is going to be going. Um, all three of them, I guess I can spoil this much, all three of them do have an arc that they will be going through, and all three of them will go through a certain change as every single character in the book is going, or in the series is going to. Well, just about every character. Some characters are just like, they're not going to change. They are too stuck in where they are. But, um, uh, they're, each of them has kind of shown, I think as early, at least in book two, or even in book one, each of them has shown where their trajectory is going to go. And, um, I hope that they stay Robotniks and Eds to you and do not fall into just, you know, obnoxious Rick Sanchezes or Homelanders or whatever the other fuckin' guys that, uh, Edgelord boys get into for the wrong reasons. Oh, that's been an, that was an hour. That was half as, that was twice as long as the last one. Um, yeah, well, uh, thank you so much for listening to me ramble on for an hour about my own things. Uh, I won't keep you much longer. I, I know you have, if you have a podcast going, you are probably doing something important anyway, so, whatever. You're great. I appreciate you. I'll just leave you with the idea to just, whenever you get a chance to, I know, like, it's, it's really easy to just do things. A lot of us really just want to do things and get them over with. A lot of us are just kind of moving on autopilot. Take the moment when you can to just chew a thought over. Especially nowadays when people, lots of people are taking advantage of the fact that a lot of us are so bogged down with everything that we don't look into things as much as we want to, that they'll just take advantage of our, like, your busy life and they'll make sure that, or they'll take advantage of the fact that we don't have time to really think things over. It can be really pleasing to just kind of stop and think critically about things instead of immediately reacting, you know? Especially to stuff online and on social media. I don't know, it, it, it really helps, it really helps to just, like, not give into cathartic anger and just think about how things have gone and how patterns kind of repeat themselves and, you know, maybe you should take some time to look into some things instead of immediately reacting to them. Chew your food before you swallow, is what I'm saying. Anyway, have a great day, or night, or whenever. I'll see you guys next week.