record

You have two options to break into the sales industry. The first is to join a small organization with limited resources and low pay, where you will gain experience but not much compensation. The second, better option is to work with third-party recruiting agencies specializing in placing candidates in contract-to-hire positions at Fortune 500 companies. These agencies will guide you through the interview process and help you find a role that matches your requirements. By leveraging the expertise of an executive recruiter, you can increase your chances of landing a job at a reputable organization and build a successful sales career. Okay. So, there's two paths you can take if you have little experience or no experience, or the other barrier to entry, a degree. So, the first path, which most people are aware of, is going to be targeting bootstrapped organizations that do not have private equity or venture capital funding, where we're talking about three-man operation in a 400-square-foot office, right, where you're going to be essentially in a boiler room, smiling and dialing with lack of resources, technology, you know, product market fit, what, you know, product messaging will be, and essentially, you're going to be figuring it out flying blind right next to the CEO, and you're going to be compensated very little for it. Now, that is the path Fidel had to take while I was at university. Without having the knowledge and experience you guys are about to learn on this call. We don't want to take that path, but that very much is a route if you want to be any means necessary, you know, part-time, put in some work with an organization to put it on your resume, and use that as an asset to get a better and proper role moving forward. But that's not the route we want to take, right? So, a better route where you will be valued and compensated for your time, and build a long-term asset in that insurance policy of having a Fortune 500 logo on your resume. For context, you know, having a big logo, we'll use Microsoft as my example, as always, will pay dividends in the future. Essentially, you can always guarantee yourself a role. You can always go to a smaller organization, like, you know, a Series B organization, a Series C. They're going to see that you had the infrastructure behind you. You know, Microsoft and those larger organizations, they invest a lot of money into training and ramp-up periods. I think the average cost, year one, of a sales rep is like $80,000, right? So, you know, on average, you know, excluding benefits, package, vacation, et cetera, et cetera, it costs about six figures for them to hire an entry-level rep at a Fortune 500. So, with that being said, you have to realize that, you know, most reps that don't hit their quota, they are negative on the first year and the investment of that employee. So, you know, some organizations are quicker to cut their losses, or they don't invest much money into you. That's why when you join a smaller organization, they're not going to give you a 12-month period for you to hit your quota and figure it out. They're going to let you go within the first quarter because they didn't invest as much capital and resources into your employment there, right? You join a startup where your CRM is an Excel sheet, right, at these pre-seed companies or some of these contracts, you know, your CRM is an Excel sheet and your lead list is Google, right? And you're calling local businesses or whatever the fuck. Those are the, you know, more bullshit opportunities where, you know, as I just explained, you're going to be able to build an asset that you have set sales experience as an SDR, but obviously you don't want to be there long-term because you're not going to be compensated, you know, or have a living wage doing something like that. So how do we specifically break into these Fortune 500s and have a better situation and that lifetime, you know, insurance policy of always being able to get a job? It is working with third-party agencies. Work with third-party recruiting agencies, these staffing agencies. They specifically niche down and place candidates that are contract to hire for these Fortune 500s. So to give context, the way it works is essentially, you know, use the example of Fidel, you know, six years ago. I am, you know, don't lack experience, I don't have my degree yet, but I want to get my foot in the door at a SaaS sales role at a good organization where they're going to give me actually like training and guidance and give me like a basic infrastructure for me to build off of for my career, right, versus working at a very small startup. If I could go back, that's exactly what I would do. So when you, you know, go ahead and find these staffing agencies, they call themselves like executive recruiters, essentially, they are going to sign a deal with you. You sign a contract with them for them to represent you as like a ambassador, as a recruiter. And essentially, what they're going to do is they're actually going to source these interviews based off of what your requirements and what you're looking for. So basically, they do a screening call, just kind of like a job. It's quicker, obviously, but they screen you to make sure that you're actually like a quality individual to work a job at a company, right? It's very, very easy to get past those screening interviews with the 22-year-old Brittany, right, straight from ASU University, Kappa Kappa Sig, right? So you should be able to, you know, pass that screening interview with little experience or guidance from anyone. She's going to assign you as a candidate to represent. So what that does is basically take out the market competition of other executive recruiters, you leveraging, you know, four different executive recruiters to get you interviews with companies. So you're going to tell her what your requirements are, what are you looking for in a role? Well, I want to be in soft sales, you know, paint your dream case scenario for her, right? Because essentially, that contract, what it says is, okay, I'm going to go ahead and feed you these leads of these organizations, get you interviews. And she's really on your side, because once you sign that offer from the organization, she gets paid a percentage, typically, it's 10%, not off of the OT, but the salary. So she's actually going to be guiding you through this process, like, she's going to be checking in, checking up on you, because you're like her, her prospect, right? You're a little, you're her commission check. So you know, they do this for a living. So she'll take you through the process of like, hey, okay, I see that you passed the first round of the interview, let's use Microsoft again, with Microsoft. You know, these are the things you should be looking for, you know, do some research on the company, like, they're going to be with you handholding you through that whole process. Okay, I've worked with Microsoft before Fidel, at the second round of interview, they actually want you to do a mock cold call, so go ahead and practice that, she'll practice it with you. You know, you're like her little asset, her little deal she needs to close. So long story short is, you sign that offer, let's just say 50k, like she makes 5k off of that. Right? So she's gonna be following up with you checking in on you like, hey, did you send a thank you email after that interview, you know, on Tuesday, like, so number one, having that with a little experience and executive recruit on the side, not only is she going to give you insights into like, the whole interviewing process, and what specifically that company is going to be looking for. But like, you kind of have your own little VA, like bringing you inbound opportunities and interviews, right? So you're going to leverage that an executive recruiter and paint your dream case scenario, and she'll be honest with you. Like, if you're like, oh, I want to be an account executive, she's gonna look at your resume and be like, that's not possible, right? So she'll kind of bring your expectations back down to reality based off of her experience, because she does this for a living. She's representing 10 different fidels trying to do the same thing. But what you want to tell her is, we know the reality of our situation as a newbie, right? We're not going to get an account executive role for 120k and a 250 OTE, right? So you're going to tell her, you're like, you know, honestly, what I'm looking for is, you know, a series B startup for, you know, whatever, 100k OTE, 110k OTE, 80k OTE, whatever it may be, to really break into the industry and like define my sales career, right? So I want an organization that has like an infrastructure, you know, tenured reps that have turnover, get as specific as you want, right? But also specifically for this scenario, you are going to tell her that you are open to contract to hire opportunities. And typically the organizations on average, right, we're speaking in generalization here, but on average, if they're hiring, whatever the title is, SDR, inside sales representative, I like that one if you're taking notes, inside sales representative are a direct contract to hire for Fortune 500s. Essentially what that role is, is an inbound low ticket item sales role where you're paid a base salary. It's actually the perfect entryway into sales and folks stay there for their whole career because it's extremely easy. Give me one second here. I'll be right back. Okay. Perfect. Okay. So we left off talking about inside sales representative. So you're going to tell her I'm also open to contract to hire opportunities. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. She essentially, what they do is they're going to narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. So what that's going to tell her is she can narrow down her search and also look for those contract to hire opportunities, right, to bring you that opportunity. You know, maybe she gives you a shot if things are slow, whatever it may be. You know, target someone that's, like, decently seasoned, right, because you want to have a good representative, a good ambassador that has relationships in the industry to get – lend you those opportunities, right? So let's say you have Kelsey. You look at her LinkedIn. You're like, hey, you know what? She actually hit quarter her past two years. She's pretty good. She probably has some relationships and can break the door down. I want to take a call with her, right? You pass the screening interview, as we already discussed. But let's say you have Kelsey. You look at her LinkedIn. You're like, hey, you know what? She actually hit quarter her past two years. She's pretty good. She probably has some relationships and can break the door down. Let's say she does have a relationship already, which makes things easier, gives you that, like, internal referral because she's placed people exactly in that role before, like you. Let's say she has it with Microsoft. Perfect scenario. Okay? So because she's already placed candidates in that role and they trust her that she's not going to bring a headass into their organization, basically she's vouching for you. You know, you're going to get a shot at that interview with the Fortune 500. And actually, excuse me, you actually don't interview with them directly. Her team is going to vet you, submit your resume. If Microsoft says that they're interested, they'll give the approval off the strength of the relationship. And they'll close the deal on your behalf. Typically, you cannot negotiate your salary or what the compensation is. And actually, you will be a W-2 to that staffing agency. So you will work for Microsoft and your sales manager will be a Microsoft sales manager. But technically, you're an employee of Kelsey's staffing agency, okay, like your payroll versus, say, her recruiting agency, where you're still getting a W-2 opportunity where you're getting typically hourly since you're a contract to hire, an hourly role that's decent, right, whatever it may be. Each opportunity is different, right, but, you know, whatever. Let's just say on average $26.50 per hour, full-time 40 hours a week, plus you get benefits. It's a decent opportunity for your first, you know, role. So you land that, and they will, you know, the Fortune 500 and Microsoft, they will determine what the project they call or what the contract details, right. They'll let you know, obviously, before you sign what that role specifically is. But typically, they are, you know, as I said, entry-level roles or the higher quality ones, the inside sales representative or inbound account executive roles. Those are beautiful opportunities where essentially you are a customer service rep. Now, follow me. The 1-800 number at, you know, these larger organizations, think about, fuck, I don't know what's a good example without, you know, think about 1-800 accountants, for example, right, like the name says with their 1-800 numbers. But, like, on their website, if you're going to buy, like, accounting services, you can call their 1-800 number, and the person that picks up the phone will be you on the other end, the inside sales representative. Now, what they're selling is, like, a $500 to $15,000 product, and their whole goal is to close you on two calls, where the leads are extremely hot. You don't have to cold call. They're inbound, right? You don't have to appointment set. There's no, oh, yeah, let's set an appointment for Tuesday. There's no demo. They're bullshit, right, just kind of like a high-ticket closing role. They come to you, credit card in hand most times, where they, you know, essentially you land them on a product and take the credit card information over the phone. They close it, and you, you know, collect your $26, $50, $40 a week. Now, you're into this Fortune 500 directly. It's not the – to move from the staffing agency to, let's say, 1-800 accountant or Microsoft, right, is if it's, number one, a contract-to-hire opportunity. You should have told your recruiter, Kelsey, that up front, right? Contract-to-hire opportunity, you know, large organization or, you know, a Series B startup SDR. Okay, she'll go find that for you, right? She landed you in the scenario with the, you know, the inside sales representative role. Essentially, whatever the contract length and the terms are of that agreement, if it's a three-month contract, a six-month contract, typically these large organizations hire these people temporarily from these recruiting agencies to do like three to six months just for their busy season. So, to give more context, 1-800 accountant, they're going to hire people around tax season. That, like, the business owners are calling in. This is a scenario. The business owners are calling in. They're like, oh, fuck, I haven't done my bookkeeping. Like, I need a bookkeeper. You know, like, how much does it cost? And you're like, oh, well, sir, you know, it's going to be $3,000. He's like, okay, it doesn't matter, whatever. Here's my credit card. Let's get a bookkeeper because he's about to, you know, get penalized for taxes, right? That's how extremely easy it is. You're like a cashier at Target, essentially, but you're going to be paid $2,650 in the beginning. Now, you're thinking a little bit of an L, right, because you're not getting commissions, but sometimes they offer incentives depending on the program. You know, maybe 1-800 accountant has a, you know, $1,000 bonus if you're here at Target, right, to make things a little bit more decent for you because, at the end of the day, you've got to think about it. They're going to have full-time employees that are direct hires for 1-800 accountant, the inside sales rep opportunity, where they're making whatever their full-time role is, you know, $60K base, $60K plus commission. There's going to be guys that are making $120K and you're making $2,650, right? So, obviously, use the same methods that we're using here, you know, refine your sales skills. Plus, it's extremely easy, guys. Like, if you can't, like, if you've ever cold-called in your life and been at SDR or set an appointment or even done high-ticket closing before and you've actually closed a deal before, that's way harder than what I'm describing. It's the exact scenario of, like, they're fucked and they have their credit card out and they call, like, they're calling to be closed. You know, if they're calling the 1-800 number, they're pretty in a bad urgent situation and that's all of your calls all day. You know, you're just collecting credit card information all day, right, and closing. So, you're going to have a high volume of call activity where sometimes, like, you even may be on, like, a call queue, like an actual customer service rep, like, headphones on tied to your computer. That's why it's not a long-term solution. And I've actually done it myself. That's how I originally broke into the industry. I got my degree, but I did this while I was at university just because it was so easy. But with that being said, you know, you're going to crush it and typically your manager, as you should be working with them, with my advice of getting an internal promotion from SDR to AE, you should be working the same processes, even as a contract to hire, of, like, hey, you know, Johnny, my sales manager at Microsoft, I know I'm a contract to hire, but you guys let us know that you're going to hire three of the, you know, 100 people you hired this tax season. What sort of things are they looking for outside of quota attainment, right? It is going to be like, well, Fidel, they're also looking for whatever. Work with them to vouch for you, to get you at least an interview with that fortune 500, to be their long-term black hat. Fidel will tell you, if you get into a situation where it's a longer term project and they'll actually extend you, they may deny you a W2 role, but they're like, hey, you know what? If you're interested, we'd actually like to keep you though for another six months. I mean, thinking long-term about your career and upside, I would take it even if it's lower pay because you're working inside that massive organization and black hat Fidel would tell you, if you work, like I said all the time, if we work there eight months, we say 12 on a resume, right? And if we're working in contract to hire for Microsoft, we're putting Microsoft on a resume. We're not putting a recruiting agency, right? So you can see how that could be an asset long-term. You can talk about how you have closing experience, you work for a fortune 500, even though like you've never been a BDR before and immediately go to an account executive role. If you're hired to be one of those candidates, right? You're going to go from making 2650 to easily making six figures, like easiest money you'll ever make in your life. Six figures, no worries, no, you know, pipeline management, follow-up, whatever it may be to, you can, you know, if that's not enough income and you're hungry like myself, you know, I transitioned that into an account executive role. So you can very much skip the SDR role. I wouldn't recommend it because if you've never built a pipeline before, you're going to be kind of fucked as an account executive. There's going to be a big learning curve, which is why I did this as a middle step. Like my career, I was an SDR while at university when I was a sophomore, right? Through junior, my senior year, I, you know, had a recruiter executive recruiter actually DM me on LinkedIn to be an inside sales representative for Intuit. And I was like, that's a big logo. I'll take it. Right. Plus I knew they wouldn't hire me because I didn't graduate yet. So I did the contract to hire things. I absolutely crushed the rest of the candidates was hired within three months. And then, you know, I ended up being a top rep, even above their veteran veteran inside sales representatives. And, you know, was 170% of quota. But I think that also to like, not, not, you know, gassing myself up, but the reason why it was so easy for me was because I've been at an SDR before at a shitty no name company having to like strong on people into appointments, right. Or the level of difficulties 10 and then I just went to like a five. So to me, it was like a one in difficulty. Right. So I think that it's an asset for any of these guys. Like if you, any of you guys that they've done high ticket before, they've done cold calling before they've done SDR contract work. I mean, you know, go ahead and do what you got to do, make your money, pay your bills. But I mean, if I don't have a degree or, or much real experience, like, you know, some folks may feel like they have six years, sorry, six months of experience with, you know, high ticket, or maybe a BDR role, you know, in the background, I'm going to be aligning myself with executive recruiters, not only to hopefully just give me a W2 role as an SDR or whatever it may be, but also the, the contract to hire with these fortune 500s because I mean, I wouldn't have been able to move to a mid market account executive by, you know, 24. If I, I didn't make the moves that I did if I didn't have that closing experience very early. And, you know, it's an asset that still, you know, people take a look at my resume. If I interview with them, they're like, Oh, you worked at that organization before? And I'm like, yes, I did. I'm not saying, Oh yeah, I was a contractor for three months and then it turned into a 14 month opportunity. Right. But you know, at the end of the day, like you technically did work for that organization. So you just put it as a full year and a half or whatever the fuck it is. That would be my recommendation. I mean, I was working next to guys that were 50 years old and, you know, at the end of the day, that's a great way to build wifi money. It's an extremely cush job, right? Like, you know, just answering the phone all day, hard closing, you know, all those kinds of more guru tactics do work in that sort of situation where they're like, bring me up at the cash register with their card out. Right. That type of shit doesn't work as in the SAS world where you're doing outbound as in BDR or account executive working more expensive ticket items. Right. Because in the inside sales representative world, like you're closing $2,500 deals where you're making like, you know, I don't know, 25 bucks or 50 bucks on each commission check. Right. But you just close so many per day and learn to upsell to where you can actually make, you know, 120, $150,000 a year doing it. So, I mean, there's some veteran guys, they just kind of decided like, Hey, this is the level I want to stay at. You know, I already have my house, 125 kids, you know, a lot of those guys in those roles that were veterans, they had like businesses on the side, like lawn scaping business, that like their wife ran or, or they, one guy sold like charcuterie boards and made 50 grand a year doing that. Right. It's, it's a very relaxed environment and you just, you know, to crush quota very easily. If you have like a decent level of like customer service sales and hustle, right. People can get very lazy in that role as well, too. The people that didn't hit quota, I mean, number one, you shouldn't be in sales if you're not able to hit a quota in that sort of environment, but they just got lazy where it's like, you know, they're just like, take it or leave it. Like, do you want it? And those people they're like, Oh, well, I'll think about it. I'll call back later. Right. Or yeah, let's do something on Tuesday. Right. It's like, you shouldn't be appointment setting. This is like a make a decision now. Like, do you want to get fired? For example, the 100 count thing, do you want to get fined $50,000? Or do you want to spend 5,000 right now, which is a tax write-off. So it's really 2,500 and it's on credit. So you're going to make installment payments on it. Right. It's like, do you want to spend the $250 credit card payment this month? Or do you want to, which is actually less, it's like 180. Do you want to spend 180 this month to make sure you don't pay 50 grand in taxes? Or do you want to think about it? Right. Like you can be as direct as saying that and then like, yeah, you're right. You know, so that's, that's kind of like the perfect scenario obviously of like aligning yourself with a recruiter, like getting that win, right. Like she can break into a fortune 500 or her recruiting agency has that relationship, you know, obviously crushing your role. And then getting it to that fortune 500, but it's very much a path that I don't know if it's thousands, but hundreds of people are doing it right now. And it's possible. And nobody talks about it. Right. All of these, you know, make six figures a year, break and attack tech SAS. They all don't mention it, but I've done it. And I know it's out there. So why not have it on the back burner? Maybe not actively search for that because the right stars have to align. But I mean, why not do that? You know, with extra time to have like it correctly, if I'm wrong, but it sounds like a perfect scenario to me if I was getting started. So that's my rant. And hopefully you guys use that information to your benefit. But with that being said, any questions? Yeah, I got a question. So what would you do if you already have like experience, you know, being a SDR slash BDR, like an insurance company. We're talking like six months. Yeah. So you would, your targets would have to be a little, little different. Just because it's not for whatever reason. And it's sort of true recruiters and organizations. They want people that have specifically a, their industry SAS experience, right? Like if you are applying for a cybersecurity organization, like they want you to have cybersecurity SDR experience, right? So that's number one. That's our ideal candidate. The candidate B is you have general SAS experience. And then three is out of industry, your situation, even though you do have SDR experience. And to be honest, insurance is way harder than being a BDR or something like that, to be honest with you. But I would lower my targets. I would go for a, you know, mid market or if they have it, or enterprise BDR role, because you have sales experience. And you could speak to like how difficult in that world is, because they're probably not aware. But I would lower my targets. And how you succeeded in your role. And like you say, six months, especially because you're out of industry. I'm going to give you the honest truth. I would put 12 months, 14, ideally. Cause 12 doesn't show, you know, it shows a little bit more bullshitty. It's like, oh, exactly 12 months you left, right? Let's use our head here. 13 months. I'll put it as 13 months because they're not going to reach out to your insurance company and verify that. Plus you're out of industry. They're not going to know. I wouldn't fake metrics outright just because, I don't know. I mean, you can roll the dice and do that, but you're going to have to have like specific KPIs to back that up and shit. And sometimes they ask for verification. So you run that risk, but, you know, just put 14 months, talk about your experience and how it translates to, you know, being a BDR. I'm not, I'm not telling you to be a BDR. I'm not telling you to be a BDR. I'm not telling you to be a BDR. You can very much go to a larger organization with a decent situation. W-2. Where you could be a mid market or enterprise rep, where you are, you know, 12 to 18 months away from an account executive role, you know, where you can earn. If not in an enterprise BDR role, you can hit six figures a year. Correct? Yep. A hundred percent. Exactly. So you can, if not make six figures, you know, your first year, if you hit your quota at those levels, but you, you can, you know, go into the roles where your, your base is much higher. And, you know, you only have to hit like 30% of quota to make, you know, a hundred grand. At the end of the day, you're not going to make a lot of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You're not going to make a ton of money. You know, you only have to hit like 30% of quota to make, you know, a hundred grand at the S and D account executive level. You know, so going back to the part where you were saying to find these executive recruiters, I didn't hear the part, or I don't know if you mentioned it or like, where did you go about finding them? Is it like on LinkedIn or is there another specific site that you can find them on? Yeah. So like my situation, they reached out to me, but you can, you can actually like, um, not to be an asshole, but like Google, like executive, uh, recruiting firms in your state or area. You're with inside the States. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Search for your city or your state executive recruiting firms, look them up on LinkedIn, look to see if they have, um, you know, obviously people are going to be listed under people search for recruiters, make sure they're in your same state. Right. And those are going to be your reps for your territory. I would do an outbound and inbound approach outbounds. I would reach out to those recruiters directly and try to align myself with them and be like, Hey, you know, I'm actually like a survey in the market right now. I wanted to align myself with that staffing agency, whatever, they have different loans, a staffing agency for, you know, whatever title, whatever, you know, organization or, or sorry, whatever title you're looking for. And, you know, you're an inbound lead for her because you're dealing with salespeople. So she's most likely going to take the call, like, and just qualify you. So like, yeah, like we'd be happy to chat on Tuesday or whatever the fuck. And, uh, that screening call that she's going to do that qualification call is very easy because like I said, at the end of the day, she's a salesperson. She wants you in her pipeline. She's willing to take the risk of making, you know, the five grand off of you and placing you in a role. Um, so just start reaching out to those recruiters. If not, they have a job listing, um, a job listing posted and they'll clarify internal. If it doesn't say internal and it says sales, whatever SAS sales or, or, you know, sales representative, um, you know, take a look at the staffing agency and do your homework on their website to make sure that they do specifically software or whatever you want to do. If it's logistics, they usually nudge down, like, there'll be like a ABC company staffing agency in your state. And like they'll have marketing and their website will say like specifically, you know, whatever, whatever representing fortune 1000 contract to hire opportunities, right. Or, or whatever their, their specific niche may be. Just make sure that it aligns decently to SAS sales. If you want to be that, um, and they go ahead and book, book that outbound by reaching out to them directly or applying to that, uh, the job description that's posted on LinkedIn on their company LinkedIn, they'll have jobs. If it doesn't say internal, it's an, it's a higher on behalf of the company where they already have a contract signed and a relationship built where they just feed candidates to, uh, typically, like I said, larger organizations, right. So, I mean, you need to qualify them too, because, you know, if, if they don't have exactly what you're looking for, um, there's a ton of staffing agencies. They don't have to be in your state, these bigger name ones, which you can do a Google search and look for, staffing agency, SAS sales or, or staffing agency sales. And, um, they, they will, they will be, you know, across, even sometimes the globe placing candidates and roles. Did that answer your question directly? Yeah. Yeah. I was just looking at them right now. I was doing some Google search and shit. Yep. You can also look at them on LinkedIn too, you know, uh, you know, staffing agencies and then filter for your location, but yeah, I mean, you know, definitely dive into it. If you're thinking about doing it, just learn a little bit about their like business model and stuff. It's always good to have, you know, information on how the industry works and, you know, information on how the industry works. This isn't really related to SAS, but have you heard of WGU, the online university? No, I haven't. Tell me about it. Oh, it's pretty much like an accredited, uh, university, but it's online though, fully online. And, uh, since it's competency based, you like, you're able to get like your bachelor's in like six months a year, like depending on how many classes you take and stuff like that, like if you pass. Interesting. Have you seen, you know, companies be receptive to that route? I just found out like two days ago, so I haven't really dug too deep into it, but I like checked out on Reddit and stuff like that. And people say like, like they're getting like jobs. And today a recruiter actually reached out to me, but it was for like a, like not a SAS related role. It was still SAS, but he had his, um, on his LinkedIn. I saw like he went to WGU and got his bachelor's in like the same year. So interesting. Interesting. Um, I know there's someone I follow. Her name's Simone Bees. Um, she talks about it. She vouches for it. Um, I would say it's more for like getting into cybersecurity as like a engineer, though. It's not really for sales from what I've seen. Yeah, unfortunately it's just one of those old school bottlenecks, barriers to entry where they make you get one. Cause I mean, obviously, you know, taking calculus at a university doesn't help with a discovery call, but tech companies want to see it for whatever reason. Um, yeah, but I mean, there, there's definitely ways around it, you know, smaller organizations. I think I spoke about this on a, on a space like this previously, they're willing to make the bet, right. Like I said before, where they're investing less into their employees. Like you cost less, not only in like OTE, but like training and employee turnover. That's real. Employee turnover is very real. Like you get fired from Microsoft. Like you cost them 150 grand. It's like a massive L for them, you know? So obviously they're going to be more picky and it's harder to get those jobs. But when you do get that job, you speak to any recruiter or any manager that's not a clown. And he's like, Oh fuck. Like they were willing to like invest 150 in this motherfucker to like the chance of him hitting quota. Right. So it gives you a ton of leverage. It's basically like having like double D's like as a woman, you know what I'm saying? So that's what I'm saying. Like early in the career, I'm not saying do the corporate thing your whole life. I mean, some people do it. I personally can't, can't really handle it. They, there's too much red tape and they don't let you employ these like black hat methods as much. But I mean, it's, it's like the life insurance policy for the rest of your SAS career. If you, if you can, you know, spend as much time there as possible. Just to clarify Fidel, is it, is it absolutely necessary to have a degree? I just want to kind of like clarify this point. It is that these larger organizations or anal companies, but it's safe to say like at a fortune, like 1000 SAS organization, one, 100%, they're going to require a degree. The larger organizations are going to require a degree. I think it's a blanket statement. That's safe to say that anything series C and above in terms of company size, is going to require a degree, a series B, B, you know, a, or, you know, bootstrap company or, you know, not mom and pop, but like a very small startup where they have like two clients and they just need a BDR. They will take a chance on you because they're, they're removing the red tape and the barriers to entry, because they unfortunately can't attract top tier talent because when you join those smaller organizations, they don't have their shit figured out. Like a lot of these organizations, that's why, like I preached to 1099 stacking. Like, if you don't, if the stars don't align and you're trying to break into the, sorry, let me rephrase. You can't break into the industry and the stars don't align that you get that contract to hire at a fortune. You can't break into the industry and the stars don't align that you get that contract to hire at a fortune. Like going into the 1099 market to like, if anything, just like put it on your resume that you've been in SDR before, you know, to where you can break into, you know, a series B organization that doesn't require a degree. And then after that point, like you have to, like, to be honest, someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but like you have more than like two years of experience and that specific industry and you're applying for it. They're going to at least give you like a screening interview to be like, okay, is this guy competent? You know, to, to go through the interview process and they don't care about your degree. The more years you gain. I don't even put a degree on my resume anymore. I mean, I do that because like, I don't have enough space because I'm trying to fit all my like information on the resume to keep it one page. So it doesn't get, you know, red flagged by their HR system or whatever. But yeah, like I don't even put a degree on my resume anymore just because it's not relevant anymore. Like what's more relevant is with the last company I worked for and how much I sold. Right. But in the beginning where you don't have much experience, I'm like, Oh, where'd you go to school? Right. Like they're trying to qualify you out to, to show some level of competency for whatever reason they think you're going to be competent. It doesn't directly translate, but that's sort of the, the game we have to play. And a way to go in is, you know, unfortunately kind of, if you don't want to fuck yourself on terms of income job hop, right. 1099 job stack, make your cash while you can. Right. Like I recommend, you know, make your six figures in the 1090 market while you can. And then, you know, if you really do want to go sass and, um, you know, if you really want to go into the industry, you know, if you really want to go into the industry, you know, if you really want to go into the industry, And then, you know, if you really do want to go sass and, um, long-term career job hop to a series B after 12 months, whatever you feel comfortable with, they're going to give you a shot as well too, because you don't have a degree work at that series B. If it's a good organization, they're growing, try to get that past promotions for account executive. Right. You see where I'm going with this? Like we're, we're trying to get as fast as possible to account executives, because that's where the real money's at. Number one, and why people do sass sales, um, uh, because, you know, like I said, like in a previous space, wherever you leave from at a job at that level, you're safe to get that same role, right? It's a little bit more strategic to job hop and get promoted, but you know, you're not going to leave a job and go below where you were at. That doesn't happen unless you're like, can't interview at all, you know, or you you're yeah. Basically if you can't interview at all, that will happen. Gotcha. So if you're kind of like a, without a degree, then the best route to go is kind of like a sales that's brought a route. Right. Yeah. That's my recommendation just because it's like, you could go series a series B as an SDR and possibly they give you a chance. They're like, all right, man, you're, you're out of industry, but you know, we like you, you did good in the interview. We could tell you could sell, let's give you a shot at BDR. It's like at the smaller organizations, you're going to make, you know, 70 K probably, because they're going to pay you 40 K for your base. Right. And then it's like you grind your balls off making 150 calls. And then at the end of the day, like you only make less than what you can, being a manager at Taco Bell. Right. So it's like instead of having to like sacrifice that much to get into the industry, I'm like, Hey, let's put the same exact asset on our resume as being an SDR because that's a smaller organizations, unless you're like going to a direct competitor, they have no idea if that company is even real. Like, to be honest with you, that's a small startups. So, you know, you go into a series B after that and essentially make no money. Then I'm like, instead of making no money and doing that, why don't you, you know, maximize your, your income potential, you know, doing the sales desperado method, make as much as that account executive role that you do once already you're one. And then, you know, if you really want to get into the industry, then you just use that to go into an AE role directly, you know? Gotcha. Thank you so much. I really appreciate that. Yeah. Okay, cool. That's going to be it for questions for today. Obviously send me, you know, something in the chat. I can get back to you or if you want like personal advice on your situation, I do have the 15 minute Q and a typically I go over the sessions like I am right now. But we can give you one-on-one tailored advice and make sure you're on the right path. But with that being said, Nav wanted to share a little bit about you know, his win so far, his experiences. Yeah, definitely. So I think it could apply for a couple of guys who are speaking here. So I was running my own FBA type business for a year, actually two years during COVID and slowed down. So I wanted to pivot into tech sales because I saw that as an opportunity for like an actual career. And so I joined a bootcamp, which I know not everyone's like a big fan of, but there are a lot of free ones where they make money on the back half by recruiting you, working with companies and they'd make commission off you. But what you can do is you can just take the training that they give you, put that on your resume and just externally apply. That's what I did. And so I think that's a way that if you don't have a degree, you can get into a company. And if you're coming from a different industry and you may be getting the interviews, but not getting the offers that puts you like a step towards getting across the line. That being said, I do have a degree, but I do think that helped me because there was a lot of skepticism of like, Hey, you're running this business. Like we're not really sure if you're going to take this role seriously. Is there any recommendations what degree you should get? Cause like I'm kind of halfway through it, but if I could switch it, like one gives me more leverage than the other. No, honestly. I studied economics. I'm in cybersecurity. Don't think it really matters. Yeah, it does. In my opinion, I was like communications. Now I'm in Texas, so definitely doesn't matter. What was the question? I missed that Carlos. Basically, if there's one degree, it gives you more leverage than another degree. Yeah. If you do want to get a degree, I'm a little bit of an unpopular opinion compared to a lot of advice online. I personally think my degree was worth it. So like I said, if you're coming from a different industry and you're coming from a different industry, I think my degree was worth it. So like the path I took is a little unorthodox, kind of like everything else, but it works. I didn't go, you know, large university at first, right? Like your basic classes that you can take at any university. I don't necessarily know about the online world just cause I didn't do it. Maybe that fits your situation. Check it out. But as far as the first two years, before you actually get into your career that everyone at university has to take English one, right? I just did that at a community college where like you spend like $500 a semester and it's affordable, right? I did two years of community college. And then that's actually once I, once I was finishing my last semester at the community college, before you go to university to finish up your degree. That's when I started doing the SDR work, but I went ahead and basically like those classes are also like way easier compared to going to a university directly. Like they're just like level of work and the complexity of the work. You're taking the same exact classes. For example, going to Arizona state versus Arizona state community college, Arizona state community college. English one is like extremely easy compared to Arizona state. Arizona state university English one. So it's kind of an arbitrage. It's like you save money, you're going to get like a way better GPA. And then after two years you go ahead and apply to those universities. And like the world is kind of your oyster because it's like so much easier at community college because of the level and requirements of work of getting a degree there that once you transfer to a bigger university, like I was never the smartest guy, but like, I had like a 3.6 leaving like community college. And that's like the highest GPA I've ever gotten in my life. Like I think in high school I graduated with like a 2.3. Okay. That's like a 72. Okay. So like I went to community college, I had like almost an A and you know, I had all those options open up to me where like you don't have to take like high level math and sciences at the university where they're difficult. Like I got a marketing degree with a specialization in B2B professional sales. It was unique that my university had that program. So it was more relevant. Like I learned LinkedIn sales navigator prospecting when I was 21 at the university. So, I mean, if you do have that opportunity in your state or you think it's worth the move going to university where they have a professional sales program with their marketing department, 1000%, I think it's worth their time. But, you know, you know, just go about it, you know, desperado style, you know, save your money. Don't don't pay a ton of money for a bootcamp or, you know, going to a big name university, take the harder classes at the easier places, essentially, you know, for pennies on the dollar, leverage the high GPA, go to a good university where they have programs that are going to be relevant for what you're looking for. You know, marketing is adjacent to sales. You know, you're going to at least learn like digital marketing, like people sell for a course here on like, you know, SEO and Google ads. Like I did all that at my university. And, you know, leverage the, the B2B sales program as well, too. I can, I can give you a list. If that's the route you want to take and you want to make the investment, I can definitely help you out with that. No. Yeah. Cause we're like on the same ball. I'm in community college right now and then I have one semester left and then I'll get my associate's degree. And that's all. That's what I was asking. Like, maybe. Yeah. Yeah. No, for sure. Just drop me a DM so I don't forget. I can, I can tell you based off where you're at and stuff like that. I had a quick, quick question. That's okay. Yeah. Go ahead, man. I just want to clarify like on a W2 fiddle, can you still start a SDR agency? I mean, in theory you can, I'm going to say yes with a caveat. The caveat is that you need to make sure, and I'm giving you the, the right answer. And then I'm going to give you like the black hat Desperado answer. The right answer is no, because it's going to be too much to manage. And if you're already in the, let's just say the W2 world, like the corporate world, like the corporate, like SAS sales, like you're in the industry, actually. I don't know what level you're at, but. It's entry level. And I started like two weeks. So. Okay. So what like specific title? It's an SDR for an enterprise software company. Like fraud. Yeah. Very nice. Yeah. Cyber, right? Yeah. It's for fraud security. So they prevent like scammers and black market stuff. Congrats. No, no, for sure. No, I mean, to be honest with you, if it's your first experience in that, like, you know, SDR, BDR role, I would really just lock in for a year and like really get prospecting down, not only for the OT and to hit your targets, but like that's going to pay dividends in the future. Like, even if you decide not to say in SAS sales, like you decide to start a landscaping, landscaping business, like you're going to know all the software and tools. You're going to know how to do cold outreach. Like everything's just going to come much easier having that sales background. If you actually 100% like commit to it. Okay. But after that one year point you decide like, okay, you know you're in a unique situation where you don't see a path to promotion or you want to just really like go full desperado and, and make more money. Like, you know, quick, you know, 100% open up that SDR agency. But then again, like, I don't, I don't know about balancing a W-2 and 1099, especially not a 1099 agency because it's just going to require full commitment for you to do it correctly to, to make the money and get the experiences that you're going to need early in your career. Okay. Desperado. Desperado would say like you could 100% manage one depending on your level of time management skillset and how quick of a learner you are. I know that in interviews are like, Oh, I'm looking for a quick learner. Like for real though, like how fast are you picking up the SDR role? Like within your first two quarters, if you're absolutely crushing it, I mean, desperado would say, go ahead, you know, pick up one contract while doing that. If it's passive for you to get appointments and you're just a natural to pick up that extra income which would be worth it at that level of just comp and OTE. And you know, obviously be very strategic about time zones about setting up your agency, which I'll, I'll describe in the course. And then make that decision of like, okay, do I want to, you know, fork in the road now? It's like, do I want to finish out the year? Do I see a path of promotion? Am I aligning with my manager to promotion? Yes. Then personally me, I wouldn't, you know, get to AE as fast as possible and then start making kind of more like alternative decisions. Because like, even if you are in the SDR agency, would you agree that it would be much easier to be like, I was an account executive, like setting appointments for me are very easy and have that be true. Or you'd be like, yeah, I was a BDR for a year, but I want to be your agency provider for leads. Right. So you gotta, you gotta think about those things. But you know, very much so. You could, you could do one if you have an understanding of your role, but you know, to be real with you, I tried it as an account executive and it was too much for me. I also was, you know, selling enterprise software, but, um, it's very complex, but I couldn't do it. So. Okay. Got it. Cause I'm technically right now, uh, before starting this SDR, I wanted 1099, um, kind of like SDR slash appointments and a contract. Um, so would you like, is that kind of like desperado as well? Would you say? Say that one more time. The beginning. Yeah, absolutely. So I'm an appointment center slash SDR right now on a 1099 contract. Um, it has a 2k base plus commission. So, um, I'm making around like five to 10 K a month, depending on how many deals I get. But, um, I'm starting that SDR position in two weeks. So. Right. So what's the question? I was saying like, is that kind of what it is? Would you say that's an SDR type of like contract or like desperado? Thing I would be doing or is that what you're doing now or, or like you're saying, keeping both of them. Yeah, exactly. Pretty much. Is that kind of similar to it? Yeah, I think it's, it's similar. Like, I don't know exactly what that role is, but it sounds like it. Um, yeah, for sure. Okay. Thanks. Yep. All right guys. Um, this session is going to be recorded. I'll post it if you're joining here late, but, uh, speak to you guys soon.