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The speaker discusses their stock based in Singapore and their focus on linking investments in China with opportunities outside of China. They have invested in various deals in Singapore, including deep tech and AI infrastructure companies. They also talk about their own background in materials engineering and their experience in investing in startups. They explain that their startup, Ion Membrane, is a deep tech, clean tech company focused on energy transition. They highlight the importance of membranes in various technologies, such as batteries and fuel cells. They mention that their membranes are PFAS-free, which is a major advantage in terms of health and environmental impact. They also discuss their plans to relocate the company and seek funding to finance their operations. So my stock is based in Singapore, pretty much time between Singapore and China. So the number one business is how to link where we invest in China and use the angle to help our investment outside of China to grow. Obviously, to introduce them to China as a market with one angle. And second is how to leverage the budget and engineering capability of China to help the NFT company to develop their product and commercialization. So in Singapore, we have invested more than 10 deals already. Among those, Deep Tech won. We have been investing in things like mobile internet, fintech. So that's not maybe something related to you guys. But Deep Tech, we invested. The reason we're down is that a new material deal with NUS, National University of Singapore. It's a proboscis new material for solar material. So that's one. And another one is AI Infra Company, which is doing the post-agency infrastructure services software deals. So those are the two deals that we've done in Singapore. Just to give you a kind of what we are looking at. Okay. Great. So next slide, please. Well, maybe before moving on with the Ion Membrane Disastration, I can share a few words about myself. Congratulations. We know him for a while. Well, I'm a materials engineer. And I've been working for a large industrial group for almost 25 years. And in different group companies, mainly serving to the auto and home tech industry. But then for the last five years, I was leading the innovation hub or that group where we were investing in startups. We were helping them grow and also giving some tailored consultancy services to other corporations for their entrepreneurial activities. One of the activities was also creating startups from scratch. So if we see an area which is high potential and we could not find any startups to invest, then we, in some cases, we were also creating back startups. So we have six startups so far. And in the last one, I was mainly leading those projects as well. And in the last one, I say I was over-motivated. So I've not only established the company, but I joined as a co-founder. So I moved out of the innovation hub and now I work in Ion Membrane to make it work. And during that innovation hub, of course, we had close collaboration with various organizations, including Enterprise Singapore. And so that's how we knew each other. And for our startup, Ion Membrane, you'll see in a while, it's a deep tech, clean tech company. And unfortunately, we do not have any market picture. So there is almost no potential customers here. And also for funding in terms of investments, we are a bit too deep tech for Turkish investors. So that's why in our business plan, we considered moving to a foreign country, namely Europe or US. That was already a part of our plan. And while we were working on that, I mean, I always had good relationship with the Enterprise Singapore team and we had good feelings about Singapore, but we never thought about it. So someone suggested, why don't you focus on Singapore? And we realized that Singapore has a special interest in nanotechnologies, and they're very focused on the interest area. So we considered Singapore as a high potential, maybe area that if we can fit into the country's preferences as well, then maybe we can relocate to Singapore. And that's why we're in close contact with UNHCR's government and EOD. So this is our scope, and we are now both looking to relocate the company and advance our customer relationships and also, of course, look for funds to finance our operations. So let me show you what we actually do. Please stop it whenever you have a question. So this is actually an energy transition project. So, you know, the cleantech investment has been growing and last year it was $2 trillion, and it's probably fossil fuel. And mainly it goes to solar and wind. And when we look at the forecast, it's, I think, around 15% nowadays is the share of wind and solar in the whole energy, and it will go up to 80%. So it will be further increasing in the next year. The problem with this energy type is the production is not in line with consumption. So you only produce solar energy when there is sun. You only produce wind energy when there is wind. So the capacity is normally a bit higher and in-depth, so that energy has to be stored. And I don't know if it came in Singapore or in China, but in Turkey now, if you will invest in a solar farm, you have to ensure that you have enough storage on the site so that the energy can be stored efficiently. And yeah, energy, yes. You have a question? Yeah, no, I'm just echoing. Yes, okay, okay. And for that storage, you know, there are different technologies, but obviously battery is the most common one because it's the most mature technology. But if you go either towards the battery side or the hydrogen side, which is another high potential, in every technology, actually, there is a membrane. So in batteries, between anode and cathode, you have a separator, which is a membrane. Result, low batteries, you have a membrane. And it's not only lithium-ion. In sodium-ion lithium-sulfur, you always have a membrane. In some high-temperature technologies like solid-state batteries, maybe you don't have a membrane, but mostly these are like the microchips. So without these, nothing either on the battery side or the hydrogen side does work. In electrolyzers, you have membrane. In fuel cells, you have it. In fuel cell humidifiers or ammonia processing, it's like the microchip of this process. If you are not familiar with this technology, so membrane is actually a very wide range of product groups. It is simply a filter. So if you, you know, the mask you use during corona times, it's another membrane type. So over there, you filter the viruses and you allow air. In, you know, water filtration, again, membranes are heavily used. And what we do is we filter atomic-level ions. So it's all the way on the left-hand side in the table. And here we have a patent pending nanofiber technology, which my co-founder has been working on for more than 15 years. So the market for this is extremely big, about 138 billion. But the major part of it, of course, comes from batteries because it's the most mature technology. So in the hydrogen side, many technologies are still developing and we expect them to grow more after 2030. But still, until that time, it will be kind of a $5 billion market. And I'm not speaking about the whole battery market or the hydrogen market. It's the membrane market. And when you look at the battery side or the others as well, so some, in every technology, some companies or companies dominate the market. So in terms of battery separators, China is dominating the market. And Europe and North America, they are going to have, they are going to need to import a lot of separators unless they invest. So in the time of, you know, we are facing a lot of terrorist wars nowadays. So with those terrorists, I think it will be harder, even though the membranes are very small. In products, the continents will need to invest and develop their own technologies in every area. So today, we are working on two products. One is the membrane for batteries. It is called the battery separator. And the other one is proton exchange membrane, which are used in fuel cells, electrolyzers, and redox low battery. So PAM technology is one of the technologies used in hydrogen world. But there are two others. Actually, there are more, but the major ones are these. So ionic exchange membrane and alkali. We don't have, I mean, our solutions so far do not serve to those yet. But we are, our core strength is PAM membrane. But we can use similar chemistry and process to develop further products in the future. But due to our limited resources, we are, we couldn't spare capacity to those until now. So what is different in our product? In the proton exchange membrane side, we have a non-fiber membrane. So you see the benchmark with the commercial one on the left-hand side, and ours is a really different structure. And it comes with a lot of advantages, which I will mention in the next stage. And on the battery side, mainly the products are extruded films, and then you stretch them in two dimensions to have little holes, which are called pores, so that filtration is possible. In our case, we do that in a chemical process. So one of the major advantages we have is, you know, both in Europe and in the USA, there is a big regulation to come, which is nowadays a big discussion. It's called the PVAX, which is a fluorocarbon material. It is also called the forever plastic, because these are the strongest bonds in the matrix, let's say, in the world. And they don't disappear in nature. So when you have a PFAS material, it stays in the environment for ages. And then, of course, they turn back to humans within our foods, water, and etc. So it's very dangerous for human health and also for the nature. That's why today we use PFAS content material. It's a big discussion. There are already many preparations of that. And PFAS is the core of proton exchange membrane today. Also, on the battery side, the materials used are polyolefins, which are, you know, they have low heat resistance. These are the nature of those materials. And to improve the heat resistance, they coat it with a ceramic layer, which is, again, PFAS content. And, you know, the battery separates is a critical component in the battery, because when it melts down, the battery fire starts. That's why the heat stability is critical. So in both cases, our solutions are PFAS-free. And this is a big advantage for the industry. So the chemistry is PFAS-free. But when we eliminate the PFAS content, we also have come with a different process. And this process also has two main advantages. One is the PFAS process is very expensive. So we reduce the cost of K-tags and also the cost of the product. But we also reduce the carbon footprint of the final product. So within the clean tag, we are an environmentally friendly product. And also, due to lower K-tags, we have a cheaper product. Besides these, the nanofiber structure comes, again, with some other advantages in the process. So our ionic conductivity, which is a key performance, is higher than the commercial membrane. Due to our chemistry, we can work in higher temperature. And another key fact is the current commercial membranes work with humidity. So if there is no humidity, they don't work. So therefore, before the fuel cells, they put a fuel cell humidifier to humidify the membrane for the function. But in our case, we don't need humidity. So that's why you don't need to humidify it. And it also allows the high temperature application. On the factory side, our TRM level is lower. But again, we see that we have some advantages compared to commercial membranes, especially in the adaptability. The adaptation with the electrolyte is better in our polymer. And we can achieve similar porosity levels, which is one of the key factors. So in a nutshell, we have a PFAS-free chemistry. We have higher transportants and lower costs, which comes with lower carbon footprint. And it's a quite important fact for many tech developers that we can feed our products according to their needs. Because this industry is mostly dominated with giants, and they only serve off-the-shelf products. So a lot of companies actually like it when we can fuel our product according to their needs. It's a product where we have applied for the patent already. It was in PECT and Turkish patent. But we also made a freedom to operate study. So we searched the whole world, patent, and there is nothing to block our technology. So as I mentioned, this is currently dominated. This industry is dominated by giants, like Chimor, Supone, Gore. In some areas, Puma Tech, Asai. So it is a procrastinating company. I'll just separate it as a Chinese company. I can tell it later on. So how do we compete with them is actually through this tailored need of membrane. So the companies who could not find the membrane they need, or if they are looking for a PFAS-free solution where they need to be ready. So we start making a joint R&D study with them. And then we send them samples. They test our product. They tell us what to improve. We continue that study until we reach the validation. And obviously after validation, we'll start production. And later on, we'll try to make a standard product as well. As always, we plan to start with the R&D team, making a tailored product according to the need of the customer. So until now, we have reached a very wide range of potential customers. And we nowadays have around 12 POC studies going on with even some large names. And also, we don't hesitate to work with small companies as well to advance the technology. So we are a team of four. Seta, as I mentioned at the beginning, is the founder of this, inventor of this technology. And she is the Ph.D. She has a Ph.D. on chemical engineering. She did her doctorate study and master's study on the subject. As I mentioned about myself, we have two good chemical engineers, and a team of advisors. So we have a good lab. We are, by the way, established in May 2023, so it's almost two years now. We have a good lab where we can make our, prepare our chemicals and work on testing. We also have a lab where we can make post-op sites for the TAP membrane, the non-refined membrane R&D. The structure is a bit more, a bit better. But for the field sub-pages, we will need to move into more equipment to make more, to advance that program more. So what we plan to do is, for the ongoing POC studies, our target is to have a minimum one validation this year. So if we can get that up to the end of 2025, then we'll start building up a manufacturing line in 2026. And hopefully the products will be commercial by the end of 2026. So for that, we are looking for seed round funding, $1.5 million. In our previous round, we raised $500,000, and we also had some grants, both from the Turkish Institute of Technology and the Foundation Supporting Technological Development. With the $1.5 million, we will invest both to our prototyping equipment efforts, and also we'll increase the size of the team. So this is all. If you have any questions, I can tell a bit more, or I would be happy to get your feedback if it's in your interest. Thank you. Thank you, Eric, for your presentation. Yeah, this is interesting. We actually invest a lot of, you know, battery companies in China, like the CATL, and also a company called Finio. It's the biggest one for two-wheel vehicles. So I can definitely check with them, and also we have invested some float batteries in China. So let me clarify. Number one is, among all the valuation, a value proposition should be measured. Is it performance play first, or is performance cost ratio, or is it EFT sort of equatable, all the things should be measured. So what's the priority? One, two, three. In our – I think it depends on the technology. So exactly today, I think the major – I mean, the market will be looking for cost-competitive product, because in terms of technology, of course, you can always improve it. But then I think nowadays it's about prices and dispatches. So the reason why we developed the sealed version is because of the price, because for the nanofibers, and also the data I showed you is for the nanofiber membrane. We know that it works well in batteries, and it comes with advantages. But a nanofiber membrane in a battery is over-expensive. I think that we thought that the market will not pay for it, although it's a more expensive product. And so that's why we are working on that film version, which can compete with the price. But of course, for that, it runs more reasonably. On the hydrogen side, of course, the price matters. But in hydrogen – by the way, a hydrogen membrane per square meter, the price is around – let's say it depends heavily on the amount, but from $1,000 to $3,000 per square meter. And for a battery separator, it is $2.5 to $3.5 per square meter. So the price gap is huge. But even at that high price, in the hydrogen world, the main part is the performance. So if you can increase the performance of the membrane, because the whole hydrogen system costs much, much, much more. So if you can have a positive impact on the performance of the hydrogen electrolyzer or the fuel cell, then people are happy and they don't mind paying the gas for the membrane. So I can say in hydrogen side, it's more performance. In battery side, it's more cost. But you mentioned EFT. If this PFAS regulation comes, then, you know, nothing matters because no product will be available. You cannot use it because it's regulated. So of course, they all have it in mind that – they're all keeping in mind how to be ready for PFAS. But as today, there are not – almost no commercially available PFAS-free options. The regulators are keeping – keep postponing the regulation. Because if they start today, the industry will collapse. But if they don't act seriously, then the solutions will never come. So in particular, we talked to various partners also from China. And I asked how is the situation in China. And what we heard from the Chinese membrane suppliers and others, they believe that the PFAS regulation will actually – at first, China will follow much later than the others. And they do not consider that as a serious issue. So in our case, we mentioned that we are PFAS-free. It is a high motivation for some companies. But we know that we have to be serious in terms of performance and be competitive in terms of cost. Otherwise, PFAS will not take us anywhere. Hello. I don't know if I covered everything. But as a small startup, as you mentioned, we are competing with giant companies. How to – I mean, how to really make our product very strong to our giant downstream clients. Because the cost always comes with the scale, right? So we need time and we can't have investment to make our product. So the cost is very important. Otherwise, people just do – of course, we need POC. POC. So talking about POC, you mentioned it's going to come by the end of this year or the coming next year. POC. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Well, today, the main – I mentioned these two products. One is battery-separated. The other is proton-exchanged membrane. And the proton-exchanged membrane for fuel cells, electrolyzers, and also batteries, they're actually all three different products. Because the working environment is very different. Although the function is proton-exchanged, in an electrolyzer, it works in 30 bars, in a liquid form. In resin-flow battery, it's either a very acidic or acidic environment. So they are different products. So our core know-how and, I mean, set-up studies was mainly on fuel cells. So she actually has her own fuel cell running, and we know that it functions well. So our most advanced area is fuel cell-separated, fuel cell membrane. Today, we are – I mean, we hope to get some good results until the end of May for the initial testing from two companies. One of them is Soyosa, which is quite good, actually, because Soyosa is one of the leaders in fuel cells. And we managed to collect their attention, which is already a good success, we believe. And the other one is an NEA company, a German NEA company, who – NEA is membrane-electrode assembly. So this membrane, our thin layer, is coated with an electrode layer, and that is used in the fuel cell stack. So some companies, like Soyosa, they do their NEAs internally, and some companies buy NEAs. And this German partner we have, they're quite good in terms of polymer science, and they already have some customers. So our main interest is to have a fuel cell membrane validation until the end of this year, and we can start commercialization from there. For electrolyzers, for rhythm-slow batteries, it will come a bit later. But having said this, we also, during our study, which was not our core product, but we are working on a fuel-cell-communifier membrane as well, which is less complicated, but it's also a good product with a good volume. So we hope to get a validation from them as well. But when you come to lithium-ion batteries, I mean, CATL or those, you know, all the big battery manufacturers are in China. And to pull their attention and to work towards a POC study with a Chinese giant, I think currently our technology would not be that attractive. That's why we did not contact with Chinese manufacturers so far. We are more advancing the studies and seeing all the results than we were planning to contact with them. On the hydrogen side, even the Chinese fuel-cell companies wanted to make the studies because there is a high need of technological advancement. But in batteries, for lithium-ion, I mean, if you talk to CATL, probably they will say they don't care because, you know, it's already a commodity product for them. But if you say, okay, but what if the ceramic coating you do will be bad? Do you have a solution for this? Probably they do work on it. I don't know what they do, but if CATL is huge, then it may be interesting. And what we do may have some other advantages, but for that, I mean, if you are an investor in CATL, if you invest in us and then they say, hey, if you connect us and say, please work on that together, maybe they will be motivated. Otherwise, for companies like those, it is difficult to pull their attention. Even on the hydrogen side, some of the companies, I mean, Toyota showed the attention. Mazda showed the attention. I don't know that they're all giant companies, but also we have, say, companies like Cummins. They say, please make your product commercial first and then we can talk. It depends on the company and the need, but you're right. It's not an easy job for a small startup to get into a world of memory. Oh, yeah. Just as a check, we have a portfolio, just one topic on call. It's called refiled. Do you know that? It's here. It's a hydrogen fuel cell system. Okay. 02570. Can you do that again? 02570. So the name is refiled, refiled hydrogen fuel cell company. So is there any possibility that they would be interested in your, yeah, we should probably make the introduction. Yes. With a fuel cell company, we would be very happy to collaborate, share our samples. If they, I mean, they probably would be interested in what we provide, because most of the fuel cell companies are happy to try, only if they don't want to further R&D and only make sales, because we see that in some companies. But it would be great to talk about that. Sure, sure. Another one is Rongke, R-O-N-G-K-E, Rongke Power. Can you spell again, please? R-O-N-G-K-E Power. P-O-W-E-R. So that one is a strange company. Again, with ADMs, well, that's the company. So those are the two I can immediately think of. Yeah, I would like to know if I can come up with any downstream customers. So for us, as an investor, we want to really create value by introducing maybe new downstream clients. And for our deal, if you can successfully down the TOC, that will drive the next round of financing, we are in the same page, on the same boat. We have the motivation to do that. But as I said, you have to maybe go through the first alpha stage to come up with maybe the first generation of products. So then we can prepare to do the business development. Yeah. Well, for WeFire, I think we would be very happy to, if you can introduce us to them, and we would be very happy to share some samples for them to test. We can start the TOC with them. Actually, we only have two TOCs today, but we know that it will take some more time. So we can also start the third one, no problem. We can provide samples. There's no problem on that. How quickly the TOC happens? It totally depends on the customer, because we can send the first sample in a couple of weeks. But then some customers test it in 10 days, some customers test it in 10 months. So it depends on the customer's need. And then we can make a new round of samples. So in my view, it will take around a year for validation. But it depends on the, as I said, depends on the customer's need. So for the fuel cell humidifier, we have been working for that in, I think, in almost now five months. And the COPSR part has been quite fast. So when we send them a sample, we get a feedback in three, four weeks, which is good by the way, three, four weeks. So we are now running the third loop, and we believe in two or three more loops. So we may come to a point where we pass most of the tests. So it takes from, let's say, six months to one year. But if you say a battery, I think for a battery, the full validation will take even longer, because the battery is a very sensitive product, which is probably going to take about two, three years to be placed and that rate to come. Okay, okay. So how's the burn rate now? How many do your company have right now? The burn rate? Yes. I mean, we don't spend much. We are a small team, so we are burning around $20,000 to $25,000 a month. Okay. So it's not much, mostly our equipment, because we are not investing in new equipment. For that, we need rounds. So mostly we are spending to chemicals, you know, overheads and fatigue costs. So our burn rate is not high, but obviously we need, with $500,000 initial investment, we invested in some really good equipment. So we have a good prototyping machine. We have a good lab. And, by the way, I also have to say that my partner, co-founder, she also brought some equipment, which are quite valuable, free of charge to the company. From our previous studies, she had those, but we did not pay for them. And then now, we also are spending an effort. Of course, I think we have about four to five more months to find a new investor or a fund to continue working. So five months is not a long time. So we are trying to secure an investment so that we can continue working on. And for that, obviously, investments like yourself is an opportunity, but we also heavily look for R&D grants from different programs in Turkey, Europe, or if Singapore will be the case, of course, to move to Singapore. It's also another cost and effort. So there has to be combined with some R&D funding so that we can continue, move everything there, and then we hope to, as I mentioned, get a validation. The first one is tough, but when we have the first one, in membrane roles, which is actually a good opportunity for the investor, in the membrane roles, there are almost no small players. Because when a player becomes commercial and starts selling to some customers, then one of the big guys come and acquire the company. It is the same story again and again. They don't let small players be in the market. Someone comes and buys. They won't even buy products from each other. So M&A activity is very active in the membrane role. And if we can achieve to get one commercial product with good customer base, and if we see a growth opportunity, then probably we'll be a candidate company for someone to acquire. So in terms of an investor, maybe it presents a good, quick exit opportunity. Or if you see a really good feature and you want to go to higher valuations, you want to be a big player, then you remain there because this business is super profitable. The cost of the membrane itself is really low in terms of product price. The main cost is the R&D and effort to get into the commercialization step. So once you get there, you don't have any profit earned. Just invest in the equipment, start running it. If you sell, then the business is highly profitable. I think that's the reason why the chemistry guys don't want new players to get in. They protect the market by acquisitions. Okay. So maybe my final question is, assuming you are more than sustainable and assuming it, so how much cap time do you need to set up a kind of pilot lab? Our lab is actually ready. So we will move what we have. We just need to invest in the battery separator. And for the pen, we have some missing equipment. And those missing equipment will, I think, including the testing equipment we would like to buy, will total sum up to half a million dollars. So half a million dollars, in terms of cost, will be enough for us to have all we need in-house. But, of course, the testing and so on, we will need to use external labs. It becomes extremely high if you want to invest in everything, and it makes no sense because we don't use them all the time. So we use more institutions, universities, and so on. So even if we stay in Turkey or if we move to another country, we will spend almost half a million on it. Then we will need a condition, if possible, a clean room environment, so that we have high-quality products at constant quality. That cost changes heavily where you go. So I think in Turkey, if we stay where we are, it can be done in around $100,000. But in some places, like it can be also the case in Singapore, maybe they provide us a ready infrastructure so that we don't have to invest in it. We just move the labs there. So it depends on the discussions. But the movement cost, I don't know how much it would get. Maybe one or two container costs. Yeah, those kind of things will be maybe another $100,000. But most of the equipment, we already have it. We need the investment mostly to continue making new prototypes, testing, improving. So those improvement moves is taking time. And obviously, testing is not very cheap. And we need to do it a lot at this time of the technology. We are at TRL 6. And with this investment and the studies, we'll go up to 8. And then from 8 to 9, of course, we need to invest in serial lines. And for serial lines, with our Turkish cost structure today, we estimate that we will need a new round before serial production of $7.5 to $10 million. And that will be enough for our initial serial investment, serial production line. And then with that investment, we will have commercial products in the market which we can sell to customers. Okay. Sure. The third investment is for pen membranes. If you go to battery separators, battery separator is another story where the investments are higher, but the volumes are also very high. So, I mean, you can ask the CACL, most probably their battery separator purchase is more than a billion dollars. Because for a small player, lithium ion battery player, their battery separator purchasing amount will be probably around $200 million. So, if you have only one customer in battery industry, you're already in multi-hundred million dollar range. Okay. I see. So, can you please send the projection? Maybe a simple one is okay. Because we typically discuss cases internally every Monday. So, by the weekend, if I can get this, I can put together very simple material so that I can discuss with my partner, get the feedback. At the same, if you have a deck outside, I can send over to my portfolio so they can have the initial feedback to us that will definitely help for our project. Okay. So, we'll be delivering quick feedback next week, I suppose. Okay, perfect. Perfect. Tony, if I may ask a question. Last one, maybe before we hang up. I understand you were supposed to meet in Hanover, but it couldn't happen. Just curious, are you also affiliated with Syncfion Solar Company? Yes. Maybe I missed that. Yes, I invested in Syncfion. Okay. I just wanted to ask from the professional from USA. Okay, okay. Just curious. That's why I asked. Okay, okay. Okay. So, is that a solar film panel company, I guess? Yes, it's a Purple Sky New Material Syncfion. So, let's name our accounts. Okay. Okay. Sorry to jump in. This is ASG. Tony, by the way, sorry I couldn't attend for the first minutes of the meeting. And I'm also working with Yuvancham Yordi as a business development manager in Istanbul-based office. So, thanks for the meeting today. Thanks for accepting our meeting. And we are more than happy to support you in Turkish market. So, if you would have any questions, please let us know. Sure, sure, sure. Okay. Thanks again. Thank you. Thank you. Have a nice day. Bye-bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.