Interview 401 Part 1

The speaker is a male born in North Africa in 1463. He is a Jewish descendant and grew up in Morocco. He has two brothers and his parents are deceased. His family now lives in France. The community in Morocco was diverse with Muslims, Christians, and Jews living together harmoniously. He played outdoor games like soccer and marbles as a child. His hobbies included playing and watching soccer. He attended a Christian Catholic school and also learned about Jewish customs. His favorite Jewish custom is eating fish on Friday nights. He did not have any influential teachers but mentioned that women were not educated the same as men in his community. Meal times were not formal except for Friday nights. His family did not have a car for transportation and they would go swimming at the nearby beaches. He enjoyed hanging out with friends, listening to music, and engaging in some illegal activities like smoking hashish. He relied on holistic medicine and only started taking pills when he met his Okay. My first required question. I'd like to start by just asking if you can tell me a little bit about yourself. I am a male, born in North Africa, June 1463, Jewish descendant, Hispanic, but not Latino. Where exactly were you born? In Morocco, North Africa. The name of the town is Tetouan. So most people in the United States, they don't know Tetouan, but they know Tangier. Tangier is 25 miles from Tetouan. Who else is in your family? I have two brothers, my father and my mother. My parents, they're deceased. I have two brothers, one younger than me and one older than me. At present time, they live in France, in the suburb of Paris. Forget you're a middle child. I am a middle child, yes. Are there any traditions that, are there any like traditional names in your family passed down or anything? Yeah. For example, for me, I used to be, my name is Alberto. This is like my nickname, but really my name is Abraham. So, and our name used to be Boaknin. We're like a descendant from the Berber. So Boaknin meaning the little Jacob. So this is the reason we changed the name from Boaknin to Jacobi. Little Jacob. Yeah. I love that. What kind of work did your parents do? My father was like a real estate and my mother was a homemaker. Yeah, homemaker. Okay. Did other, did you have other family nearby? Yeah, we, I used to have an aunt and a cousin. And the other family, they were all over Spain, but the closest was, it was my aunt and my cousin. What did your community look like outside of your family? My, it was very, it was a, of course it was a Muslim population. And also we used to have like a Christian people and Jewish people. And everybody was getting along very well at that time. So it was kind of mixed between the Christian, Catholic, Muslim, and Jewish. That's really interesting. And it was cohesive, like everybody? Yeah, everybody was getting along very well. That's very, that's very cool. What kind of games did you play when you were young? A lot of outdoor games, like soccer, playing with, we used to play a game with rocks. I don't, I forget the name. Then they, you throw the rocks and you put it under your finger or something. Paula, I told Paula one time, and she knows the name of the rocks. And also we used to play with the, I don't know how you say in English, but it was like a little sport, like a little ball, like a crystal. And we used to play with the ball. Oh, like marble? Marble, yeah. Nice, very cool. A little crystal, I love that. Did you have any hobbies? Growing up, not much, except I used to be a big, as you know, I used to like a lot of soccer. So my hobby was to play soccer and watch soccer. Very fair. Do you collect anything? Collect anything? No, not that I remember. Fair enough. Okay, so I know you have kind of a story of history and school, and you've been educated all over the world. Can you tell me a little bit about that? So the place where I grew up, it was Morocco, it was Muslim. But before that, it used to be Spain. So I went to a Christian Catholic school, and the name is Nuestra Senora de Pilare, high school, meaning Our Lady of the Pillow. So I was in a Catholic school. And after school or something, we used to have like a Jewish school or something for like a one hour, two hours. I used to love to go there, because when we used to go there, they used to give us a sandwich with chocolate. Interesting, my memory about this. I mean, they got you on the door. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Maybe it was more for the sandwich, the chocolate sandwich, than to sit there and learn. Were you learning about the Bible, or were you learning Hebrew? Yeah, Hebrew, the Bible, the Jewish custom, all these things, yeah. Interesting. What's your favorite Jewish custom? What's my favorite Jewish custom? Very interesting. Where did you learn it? I learned all my customs in Morocco, in the city I was born, Titouan. So it's something very interesting that I didn't find out until I married my wife, Paula. Then we used to eat in Morocco, we used to eat fish every Friday night. And Paula told me that the Catholics do that. So I didn't get it, but the Moroccan Jewish is very famous. Every Friday night we eat fish. So it was very interesting when I found out, oh, it's the Catholics. That's really funny. I grew up Catholic, so I'm familiar with that. Did you have any influential teachers or mentors? Not that I remember. I used to have one teacher, and I liked him. He was very friendly with me, but no mentor or something. Do you think that women or girls got differently educated? The same, but unfortunately, the place where I grew up or something, the women, it wasn't the same like if you're a man. So it was a little like a notch down or something. It wasn't the same. I wrote a lot of questions, but we don't have so much. It's okay. You can ask me. What were meal times like at your family? Mealtime, I don't remember if it was sitting, it was like we come, the meal time, the real meal time with the family sitting was only the Friday night or the Sabbath, but most of the time it was like eating and running, going out. Kind of like a very active child. I also was very interesting because my mother used to bake bread or something, and we didn't have an oven or something. She used to take it to the public oven. She made the bread or something, take it to the public oven. That's great. That's really interesting. I bet that saves a lot on fuel. Okay. Where did you get your clothes? The clothes, I don't remember. I didn't buy any clothes for sure. So somebody, yeah, hand me down or maybe my mother used to buy a used one or buy from a cheap store or something. But your mom never made clothes? No, she never made clothes. She fixed, maybe fix is not the right word, but if it's something you cut here or something, you pin or something, she know how to fix. Ah, fix. Okay. No, I got fix for sure. Yeah, like with the thing. Fitting back to it. That's very cool. That's a very useful skill. Did you have any pets or did you look after animals? No pets. We didn't have any pets, no. How did your family get around? Was there transportation? No car for sure. And the transportation, it was a small town, so it was very easy to get from one place to another one. So if you didn't have, yeah, you didn't have, if you went to another city or something, they have a public transportation, but everything I wanted was only walking. We didn't have a car. Did you have any vacation? Vacation? We used to have a, because the city I grew up, it was in the Mediterranean, and it was a lot of very nice beaches. I hope I say this right. Beaches where you go swimming. This is what I mean. So it was, you go there and the water, it was like a clear, like a very clear, very nice. So we used to go there a lot in the weekend. And we'd go there, it was maybe 20 minutes or so, we used to take a public transportation. That's pretty fast. Do you swim? Yeah, I swim. A lot of swimming. What sort of entertainment did you like growing up? Do you have like stuff you listen to on the radio? Was there a Troubadour? Only hang out with friends and listening to music and other illegal stuff. No, I can say no is illegal in Illinois. So we used to smoke hashish, because hashish was very cheap in Morocco. It was cheaper than the cigarette. So hang out with friends and sitting and talking, listening to music. And that's it. Who did you go to for medicine? Medicine, we used to have like a clinic. So we used to go there for three minutes. And also, I don't remember taking medicine. I think in my memory, the last 30 something years, the first time I took pills was when I met my wife in the US. Because my wife said, everything, if you have something bothering you, take two of that, three of that. So it was more holistic medicine. Growing up, my mother said, oh, my stomach hurt you one day. I put all these kind of weird stuff, onion or garlic or something in your stomach. So it was more holistic. It wasn't like a medicine or something. And do you remember going to the clinic very much? No, I don't remember going there. The only bad memory I have is the dentist in Morocco. Yeah, so I don't remember going there to pull something or pick something. No, they don't pick that. So when you're growing up, if you have a bad tooth or something, they pull it. And I don't remember anesthesia or something. Another thing that they do here. So yeah, or laughing gas or something. So this is the reason when I come to the United States, I was like a boy in the dentist. And I used to go only when my tooth was hurting me because all the bad memory growing up. So when I found out they had a gas, Novacaine and all this stuff. So I go more often, but it was too late. So my teeth are not very good. Okay. When did you, did you live in Canada? Yeah. Yeah. I did. What? For when? Like almost a high school. So I went to Canada when I was 14 or 15. I went to Montreal, Quebec, Canada. The reason I went there because a rabbi, a rabbi from Canada, they're trying to open a school for Sephardic. So the Jewish people, they have two, no sect, but they have a Sephardic people and Ashkenazi people. So for example, I'm a Sephardic and my wife is Ashkenazi. So Sephardic means then the people from the Mediterranean, from Spain, Turkey, Greece, and Ashkenazi people, like my wife, they are from Eastern Europe, from like Russia, Ukraine, all these things. And we have very different way to eat. The food is very different. Everything is very different. So for example, when I moved to the United States and the people, I didn't like so much a lot. A lot of people used to give me a hard time. They said, you're Jewish and you don't like a lot. I used to explain to my friend, a lot of people, that I'm a different Jew from the Jews in the United States. I am a Sephardic, like I'm from the Mediterranean. So we don't eat the same food. We don't pray the same way. So it's a lot that we are all of them Jews. So I moved to Canada because this rabbi want to open the first school, high school for people from the Mediterranean, like Sephardic people. So he come all over Morocco and he's trying to get two or three kids from each city. So they picked me and a friend. So we went there for two years and we went to study. And we were studying with a half day math, science, and everything. And the other half day was like only the Bible. So it was kind of religious food. So we used to take it a lot. We used to trail something and we used to wear the yarmulke all the time. Then when we used to leave the building, we used to take the yarmulke and hide all this thing and do all the bad stuff. Okay. How many times have you had to explain that in your life? A lot. About the Sephardic and Ashkenazi. A lot of people. Even Paula Ann for years, for years. They say, how come you don't like Latin America? I don't like Latin America. I never had bigger amount. I love that that's their problem. Because of all things. I have a friend, me, I work with him. He's an Indian, but Indian from India, from the country of India. They say, you don't like Latin? I say, no, no, I don't like Latin. I didn't grow up with that. And it's a different food than I grew up. So we, for example, the Sephardic people like a lot the spices and sauce and all these things. And Paula, people like Paula, the Ashkenazi, like more sweet. I didn't, I never had a matzo ball soup in my life until I met Paula. So I make a very good one right now. I didn't grow up with matzo ball soup. How did your healthcare change from location to location? I remember when I moved to Canada, we have a doctor, a dentist, everything. So everything was very easy. It wasn't that easy like in Morocco. So everything was something better or something. Okay, we call the doctor, we take you to the doctor or something. In Morocco it was different. We didn't, I don't remember my family or me having health issues. So. You didn't need to. Yeah, I didn't need to. So everything was like I told you before. Oh, you have a headache or something, they used to put you something, I don't know, onion, tomato, something or vinegar or something in your head and this thing and then go away or something. Whatever works. Yeah. Okay. How did you initially get healthcare when you moved to the States? How did, when I moved to the United States at the beginning, of course, insurance and the healthcare in the United States is the biggest scam on the planet, because most countries in Europe and Africa and all these things is like a socialized medicine. You don't, you don't have to go to, you don't have to pay or something. So the government provides for you. It is very hard if you have like insurance and you have the deductible or something. Sometimes you think, oh, I'm not going to go to the doctor because my first $3,000 is deductible. So I will let them go by. So sometime and before, and even at present time, I don't go to the doctor if something is a minor or something, because I have to pay the $3,000 or $4,000 in the first $3,000 or $4,000. Pre-treatment required. Yeah. Pre-treatment required. So I may have, and also I make a point, I have some family members and they have very good insurance. Some people, some of them work with the government. Sometimes some of the, the state or something, and they have very good health insurance. And I don't know when to say that. You know what? Sometimes they abuse it because they say, oh, I have insurance. I'm going to go to the doctor for every little thing because I have the insurance. And when? Mine is the opposite. I don't have the insurance. So I say, I'm not going for a minor thing or something. I will wait until it goes away or something. And there's something to be said about taking up resources from other people who need them more. Yeah. The factor, the time is finite. Yeah. Do you, did your town ever get sick as like a group? Were there any, like an epidemic? Like a zone. All right, go ahead. I'm like in cholera, but no. Yeah. I don't. No. What was your first job? First job? Oh, I used to, when I was a kid, I used to, we used to have like a country club, casino. So I used to be like a 14, 15, 13. I used to be a runner for the gambler or something. Oh, don't get me, don't get me, so this is one of the first jobs I had. Then when I was a little older, in high school or something, I worked in a, in a place where they make a, no ice cream, what do they call it? Ceylon? No, popsicle. So I worked there also for a period of time. You making popsicles? Yeah. I love that. So this is one of the first jobs when I was under 18. What did you do when you moved to the States? I don't really know what you did for the first time. When I moved, when I moved in the States first, in the beginning, my English wasn't that good. So I worked with a friend of Paula, not Paula's friend, her husband, they used to have a company. I used to sell the equipment for restaurants. Okay. So we used to, the focus was more to like a Latin people or something because my language or something. I speak Spanish fluently. So this is what I used to do, work with the rest of the restaurant. Also, I used to, like a delivery food, like early in the morning, like I used to go like, yeah, yeah, delivery like a muffin and a bagel, all these things, like a six o'clock or five o'clock in the morning to all these restaurant or little coffee shop or something. And also when I was a little older, when I was living in Israel, I used to work in the post office also. Post office? Yeah, I worked in the post office there in the like international section because I could read the Latin, like Spanish, French or something. So a lot of the local people in Israel, they don't know that language. They speak Hebrew. So Hebrew is very different than the Latin language, like Spanish or English or French. Can you tell for falserity how many languages you speak? I've told a lot of people. I'm very impressed by how many languages you speak. I speak four and some English. I speak Spanish fluently. I speak French fluently. I speak Arabic, but the Arabic I speak is Moroccan. It's a different dialect. And I speak Hebrew and English. Also, I speak the Spanish, the French and Arabic. I speak it because I was born in the border between Spain and Morocco. So fortunately, most people outside the U.S., they speak more than one language. Everybody is bilingual. In the United States, I don't know about that, but I used to have a friend from Texas. Then he used to tell me, I am bilingual. I speak English and American. American. Sorry, it was a joke. Sorry. But really, I used to have a friend from Texas. Funny. So you can believe that. American. Always making me proud. I speak English and American. I don't know which language is American, but it's funny. Okay. What did you, did you have like other opportunities like of working? Or like, did you take what you could get? Well, I think I took whatever I could get and it was comfortable with me, or with me doing the job or something. So I didn't have like a big opportunity. I don't have a, I didn't go to college. I started college, but they dropped out after the first semester. So I have a high school degree. I have the DGD, what do you call it? DGD? No. DGD. DGD, yeah. And I have some college course like an accounting or something, so. What did you want to do when you went to college? What'd you want to go for? Like accounting or something. Why'd you drop out? No, I was thinking because it was more opportunity to like go work and make money or something. For sure. Did you ever have problems making ends meet? Ends meet? I don't remember. Maybe my parents or something, but I don't remember here, moving here in the United States or when I was living in Israel or my friend. No, I don't remember. Like I was living maybe paycheck by paycheck, but it wasn't like a saving or something or do something, luxury or something. Fair enough. Did you, how neighborly have you been throughout your life? Like how many, do you make friends with your neighbors? Oh, yeah. Well, yeah. Always I used to make friends. I also used to live in a different place before here and I made a lot of very good friends in there for life. So, yeah, I'm very friendly and I like to talk to people and make friends or something. They're nice people. You make friends like no one I've ever seen. I think you gave Benjamin that a little bit. He will talk to a stranger for sure. That's definitely a very cool thing. What kind, okay, so a third space is like, so your first two spaces are home and work. And so any like bars or like playgrounds, those are third spaces. What kind of third spaces have you had in your life? Can you repeat? No, can you repeat? So like when you go to the beach with your Moroccan friends, that's a third space. Yeah. So like anywhere that's not work or home that you can spend time in. Yeah. I like to go like a bar, watch like a sports scene when the local team like Chicago Bears or the Cubs or the Bulls, the one that Michael Jordan used to play. So I used to go a lot out. I like to go out, watch like a sports venue or something. And also I have a very good friend and he has, he's very involved with music. And all the time, he's like maybe two or three times a week he has, he goes to concerts and a lot of bands. So sometimes he, a lot of times he has like an extra ticket and he calls me and goes, oh, do you want to go to Lincoln Hall? Do you want to go to the Sugar? Do you want to go to this thing? Oh, this band and this band playing. I say, oh, sure. So I go to my phone, I go to YouTube and see what is this band. But I say, yes, then I heard the music. Venue. Do you feel like your education serves you? Like is, has been, is a good thing that you've been able to apply? Yeah, I think most of the service is the language that I speak. So it's very, make me very comfortable here because here in the state, especially in Chicago, they have a lot of people who speak Spanish. So make me very comfortable. And also I used to work, and I still work, but a different company. I used to work with all the foreign consulates. So I used to get visa and passport for all the foreign people, American people going to overseas to China, Ecuador, Brazil, Colombia, all these countries. So I used to help them get the visa. And for me, it was very comfortable to talk to like a foreign consulate or embassy and talk to them with their language, their Spanish or French. So yeah, it helped me. Very cool. Do you feel like you, the question is, do you think you would have had better outcomes elsewhere? I don't, I don't know. Maybe, maybe not because before I moved to the United States, my plan was to move to France. So my wife was worried and she doesn't expect France and this thing. So this was my first choice. I think that maybe I made the right choice to move here because even with the healthcare situation, I think the United States is the freest country on the planet, even with the douchebags that we have now. I hope they know. Yeah, I don't think they're going to drop me. And the good thing about the United States, not like in some countries where I live, you can say the president is a douchebag. I used to live in Morocco when I grew up. You cannot say anything bad about the king. So we have a monarchy, we have a king. If you say the king is whatever, something bad, you will get in big trouble or you will, or you will disappear. Dang. Yeah. So the United States, you can still, even with the douchebag, you can call him a douchebag and nothing will happen to you and nobody will come to your house and nothing will go. For now. For now. Okay. I think one more question before we like take a break. I meant to ask this earlier, but you said you were one of two kids in your town that got picked for the school in Canada. Yeah. How did you get picked? By chance. These guys started coming and they started interviewing something and talking to me. The only problem about that, it was, I like it, I love it, but when I moved from North Africa to Africa to Canada, it's like a big difference. It was like, you couldn't see your parents or something like only one time a year. One time a year in the summer, they send you go back for two months or something. But they, I think maybe they interviewed, they asked me a question or something and then. Okay. That doesn't sound like by chance. It sounds like he heard it. It sounds like they were like, he can succeed. Like let's give him more opportunities. I feel he's trying to convert me to make me say, oh, maybe this guy is a good potential, will be a religion because the mind of the person who interviewed me, it was like, make people like a religion. So yeah. That's really cool. Thank you. We'll take a break now. Is there still a lot? We still have.