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Elise introduces Andre Mertz, head coach at La Perle, one of the biggest water shows in Dubai. Andre shares his journey from gymnast to successful circus performer with Cirque du Soleil. Transitioning from gymnastics to circus was different but fulfilling, focusing on artistry over competition. Performer nerves differed, with gymnastics competitions being more pressure-filled. Andre encourages gymnasts to explore circus, noting the transferable skills and creative opportunities. Circus offers a unique path for athletes to continue their passion in a new artistic form. Hi everyone, welcome to the Circus Playbook. I'm Elise and today we've got a really exciting guest, Andre Mertz. Oh, I'm excited, nice, I'd like to hear it. Andre is the head coach at La Perle and for those of you that don't know, La Perle is one of the biggest shows in the world, it's very famous. It's a water show, the largest water show based in Dubai, in a custom-built theatre and it's amazing. There's a lot of exciting acrobatics, it's got it all, high diving, everything. And yeah, we get to talk to the head coach, so very excited to hear all about his experiences. And yeah, Andre, so tell me, how old were you when you started circus? When I started circus, I think I was about 19 years old, but first let me say thank you for inviting me here, Elise, and it's great to sit with you and yeah, I'm definitely looking forward to this interview. But yes, when I started circus, I was about 19 years old, I had just finished my gymnastics career and was looking for what was next in my life, I guess you could call it like a quarter-life crisis. Okay, interesting. So you were a high-level gymnast before that, is that correct? Yes, I was a gymnast for the Canadian Junior National Team and I was competing for the Senior National Team or to get a card on the Senior National Team and I got injured in that competition and then kind of my hopes and dreams went out the window and I decided that it was time for something else. Yeah, I think that's, I mean, there's always a big risk with gymnastics, circus, anything like that, anything physical, any sport really, but you were so lucky you were able to turn it around to then go from being injured into having a really successful circus career. Yeah, it was definitely, for me, right place, right time, how my circus journey started. So how did it actually start? So after I left gymnastics, I still had lots of friends that I would hang out with, that we competed against each other for maybe 12, 14 years of my life, so it wasn't like I was done with the gymnastics scene, I was just done with the five hours a day of training and putting all that effort in. I just wanted something more and a little bit more free time to, you know, explore who Andre was outside of gymnastics. So I went to watch my friends compete and one of the judges who knew me from over the years asked me if I was interested in a job and I thought he was going to offer me a course in judging and I was going to be able to judge some competitions and I wanted some extra money so I was like, sure, yeah, I'm interested and he's like, okay, after the competition we'll talk and I was like, cool. Then after the competition he came to me with a business card and it was this weird looking sun and I was like, whatever, and he's like, have you ever heard of Cirque du Soleil? I was like, no, and he was like, well, they're looking for someone your height, your size and your color and I was like, ah, I'm like, okay. He's like, call this number. I was like, okay, cool. Then the awards happened and I'm still sitting there chilling at the competition and then all of a sudden he comes back over to me and he's like, so did you call? I'm like, no, I was going to wait until like Monday and he's like, no, they need somebody mass, called mass. I was like, oh, mass. So, boom, pulled out my phone, gave them a call and they asked me to put a demo tape together with a little introduction about who I was and all my gymnastics stuff. So, boom, put that together and next thing I knew I got an offer to go to Montreal to train in a specific formation for Mystère in Las Vegas and that's how the journey started. I mean, that's incredible. I'm pretty sure that most artists dream to become a performer in a large scale production and Cirque du Soleil is one of the biggest out there and that's fantastic that you were able to transition so quickly because I know that it can take longer for some people. Definitely. Yeah, it's not always easy either. I mean, there are a lot of gymnasts, so to transition from gymnastics into circus as well, I mean, that's different as well. You go from being in a sport to performing and being an artist. Did you find that transition difficult at all? It was not difficult, but it was definitely different. Gymnastics is very rigid, very structured, very toe-pointed. Life's great. Present life better. Squeeze this, squeeze that. And then when I got to Montreal, it was very much more artistic, more about the art side because we already had the technical side. So we had classes called Jeux, which means play. So we had classes where we would just play or we would learn a song or we'd have to freestyle a song when other people would be pretending to be a dog. All in the same area, all at the same time. You need to hit these four things and then at the end of it, come to a revolution. And it was the best, weirdest experience I ever experienced, but I fell in love with the performance side of things because I've always enjoyed plays and television shows and movies. So for me, it was an introduction into entertainment. And how long were you with Circus Delight for? I was with Mystère for five years and then I did a couple short contracts with their sister company at the time, which was 45 Degrees. Oh, wow. And then you fell in love with Circus after that? Yeah, as soon as I got to Montreal, my mind expanded because I didn't realize. I always just thought Circus was Ringling Brothers and Animals and Three Rings and all of that. And it's weird because I lived in Toronto and Montreal was just down the street. But it was never in my, I guess, what would you say, I don't know, it just never crossed my path. And when it did, it was like, huh, the dream I didn't know that I had. I didn't know how I could take these skills that I've been doing from four years old to 19 years old and then get paid for them because I had to pay for gymnastics. We were paying, my parents were paying $300 a month for my lessons. And then I was like, after this, what am I going to do? My dad's like, you're going to be a plumber. And I was like, I don't think that's what I want to do. And I wanted to get into music production and my mom told me there's no money in music. So then I was like, okay, let me take a year off, figure out what I want to do. I had a couple of scholarship offers, but I hated school and I just didn't want to go that route. So luckily I took that year off and then God had plans for me. So I just followed. That's amazing. I definitely think it's important to follow your path, what you want to do, what you feel is right for you as well. It's great that you took that chance and you've had a whole career because of that. Did you find that the nerves were different? Like when you're performing as a gymnast, you've got the competitions, that's a lot of pressure. And then you go from that to performing on stage, doing character work and maybe moving in a different way that you weren't used to in gymnastics whilst performing your skills. And did you find that was different? Was one more nerve wracking than the other? Definitely competing is worse, for sure. As a performer, I felt more free and it wasn't about me. It was about the audience and how we could give them an escape from there every day to create a world where they were lost for an hour and a half and immersed into what they saw on stage. Whereas in gymnastics it's like I have to make sure I impress the judges and I have to compete against all my friends and all these other people from different provinces to show that I'm the best. And yeah, it was great at the time but it's definitely, I'm much more of a collaborative person. So I like to work together rather than compete for the number one spot. Yeah, I think that's some really useful advice for performers and aspiring artists as well because it is normal to be really nervous, especially at auditions, but even when you're performing on stage, especially in the early stages or if it's a new production that you're performing in, and I think it's easy to forget that you're performing to entertain others. You're so focused on, oh god, I hope I don't mess this up or I hope I do a good job. What if I make a mistake? But I think if you switch the focus to, I'm going to entertain others, I'm going to make them happy, then that will really not only calm you down, it will renew your sense of why you're actually performing, why you love entertaining and making others happy, bringing the joy to the audience's lives, especially children and adults too. And do you have any advice for gymnasts that were thinking maybe of becoming circus artists? My advice would be to do it. If you're thinking about it, it never hurts to try and you don't know what other opportunities may come. You may not want to be the performer, but you may want to put shows together or you may not want to perform in a huge circus, but you may want to create a new act on a trampoline, a new act with a high bar or rings or any of the events that you've been doing for many, many, many years. So it'll teach you how to be creative in maybe ways you didn't think you could be. So yeah, my recommendation would be to jump. Jump, go for it, don't think about it, and then once you're in it, you'll find a way. And I think also that the skills are so transferable. I mean, you see gymnasts who try apparatuses that might be similar to some of the events that they've done in gymnastics, and even just their body awareness is just so good, they just pick it up so quickly. Anytime I've been training with an ex-gymnast, it's just like they've just got a new skill immediately. You know, it could be something that I've worked on for three years to get, and they're just like, bang, let's just do it on the straps or whatever, and I'm like, that's nice. That took me three years. But you've done the hard training from a younger age, and often circus performers tend to start later, and you've already done that. You know, you started at five, you're in there five hours a day. Five days a week. Five days a week. Yeah. As a kid, that's a lot, you know, while I was off climbing trees. I don't know what I was doing, but I wasn't training like that. But also, I think at those events, those competitions, I know that a lot of talent scouts from Cirque du Soleil and other companies also go there, because they do have a lot of shows where they have like a group act, and they hire ex-gymnasts to perform in those group acts. Yeah. Yeah, and even artistic gymnastics and acrobatic gymnastics, like when they're doing the hand-to-hand stuff and the bunkeen, they go to a lot of those competitions as well, and you'll see those big acts on stage, and you wonder like, wow, how did they do that? But some of them have been working together for years in competition, and then they were able to transition to the stage. They may have had to change up some choreography a little bit, or, you know, just expand their vocabulary, but if you're willing to stretch yourself and willing to go outside of yourself, you'll fit in in the circus. And if you're weird, you'll fit in even better. Yeah. I think that's what I love about circus so much, is that there's a place for everyone. You know, there's so much room for creative freedom, you know, on top of your skills, and for new skills and ideas that haven't been done before. I don't think overall it's a very judgmental place. I mean, obviously, it's a competitive industry, and that can create, you know, insecurity within some people, but I think overall, you know, everyone's kind of found their weird niche, and they love it, and they're passionate about it, and whatever they're into works if they make it work, you know? Yeah. I think that's one of my favorite things about circus and performing as well. Yeah. And you'll meet people from all over the world. Like, I've worked with people from every country you can imagine, so that's also something I love about it, because you just make family all over the world. Yeah. Because everybody's so accepting of each other. Yeah. Rather than the competition when you're in gymnastics. It's like, no, no, no, like, we're competing. Maybe we could be friends after, but right now it's about me. But there, it's like, how can we help each other grow and be better together? As a team. Yeah. That's something that also attracts me to circus and entertainment. Did you find that you missed gymnastics after that? Like, for a while, was that difficult? Well, not really. A new. No, not at all. Because you're still doing it, but you're doing it in a different way. It's not structured. Well, it's still a structure, but it's not as structured, and you don't feel the pressure of trying to be better than everybody else. Yeah, you want to improve for yourself, but it's not, I'm improving so I can win a gold medal. It's, I'm improving so I can be better for the audience, or I could be better for my team. That's nice. Yeah. Awesome. And do you find that, you know, as a circus performer, when you were performing, you just had a sense of purpose? Or you didn't really think about it? I didn't really think about it. Sense of purpose. No, no. It was more so, I was still in awe, like, I couldn't get paid to do this. Like, this is insane. It was, for me, it was like, it just opened my mind up to so many things, because I was like, I never thought, after gymnastics, I could make something of this. So, when I thought that it was possible, it was like, let's go, and just have fun. Yeah, no, that's great. I think having fun is also a really important part. If you're not having fun, I think that can translate across. And obviously, like every job, there'll be days where you might not be in the best mood or having fun in general, but overall, I think, if you're just enjoying the process, you'll not only shine more, but you'll succeed more, because you're in that good mindset, and I think that's important, too. Actually, did you find that mindset was a very important thing for you while you were performing or competing as a gymnast, and then also performing as a circus artist? Yes, mindset has had a lot to do with it, as a gymnast more so. As a performer, it was more about, it sounds weird, but having fun and enjoying what I was doing, because I enjoyed it, it wasn't work. It was play. I was getting paid to play. I was getting paid to fly on bungees. I felt like a bird soaring through the sky twice a night. I love that. So, it just brought me joy. I guess mindset was remembering that I get to do something I enjoy doing, rather than I have to go to work. It's like, no, I get to go to work. That, I think for me, was what made my career at Mystère so enjoyable, but also, after a certain amount of time, doing the same thing over and over again, it gets a little tedious. So, it was like, what's next? How can I get that feeling back? So, that's when it was like, okay, I need to move on, expand to other shows, expand my bag of tricks, per se. Because I was doing bungee, I was doing Chinese poles, but I was only doing certain tricks on Chinese poles, because it's very structured, what you do in the Cirque du Soleil show. This is your part, you do that. But then, I would see other circus artists, I would watch videos on YouTube, and I'd be like, these guys are doing crazy tricks. I want to learn those tricks. So then, after I left that, it was like, okay, I need to go and find these artists, I need to go play with them. And that's what I did after Cirque. I found other artists, I played with them, and then more opportunities presented themselves. And I worked with smaller circus companies, and did a North American tour, and I worked with, that circus company was called Cirque Mechanics. So I worked with them, Chris Lashaw, he's an amazing, amazing person. His business is very family-oriented, very small, very niche. The reason they call it Cirque Mechanics, is because they also want you to see the mechanics and how they work behind the scenes. But instead of putting it behind the scenes, they show you up front, and it happens on stage, so you see how the trapeze is being lifted. I had a partner act with a girl, and she was doing a trapeze act, but I would be riding a bike on an I-beam. You were riding a bike? And that would lift her up and down. Oh, okay. And then there would be a performer on either end of the stage, but on stage, pulling ropes, and that would spin the beam. Oh, amazing. So, we were all working together, but you could see how the magic was happening. But it didn't ruin the magic, because it just gave another side to the circus. And then again, it was like, whoa! Yeah. So, yeah, I don't know what to say. It's just such a great experience I've had all these years. Yeah, I think that's just amazing. It's quite clever, actually, to show the behind-the-scenes on stage. I think a lot of the time, a lot of shows try to hide all of that, as you said. But to show it is giving the audience a little view into the backstage life of this weird world that they don't quite understand, and that's interesting for them as well. Yeah. But yeah, you mentioned you were learning all these new skills and upskilling. What did you find the training was like as a gymnast versus a circus artist? As a gymnast, I was told what to do. As a circus artist, I got to explore what I wanted to do. Okay. Yeah. So, it gave me the freedom to be myself in what I wanted to learn, rather than... Because in gymnastics, there's compulsory routines. So, everybody does the same routine. But for the judges, it's like, who looked better doing it? Because everybody's doing the exact same thing. With circus, it was like, I like that trick, but how can I make it my own? How can I do that full twist? But if I bend my leg to the side, or if I throw an arm up, or if... How does that look? How does that feel? Oh, this feels good. I can do it like that. But in gymnastics, if you do that, that's a deduction. Yeah. Yeah. So... The creative freedom. Yeah. It was... Yeah. For me, that's the difference is... Don't get me wrong. Gymnastics taught me the skills to be able to have the creative freedom. So, it was amazing to have the structure in the beginning. Especially when you're a kid, you just want to play and do whatever. But it gave me the discipline to be able to train on my own. To schedule myself to be like, go and train rather than... Because I know what it takes to get to where I'm at. It was five hours a day, five days a week. So, if I want to replicate that, I have to replicate that. So, you made your own program, or you just kind of trained with people? Trained with people, but I knew I had to put in the time. People talk a lot about 10,000 hours. And if you want to master something, it takes 10,000 hours. Yeah. It may not be 10,000 to be a master. I don't know. I've never counted the amount of hours I've done something. But I know it's... You're not going to learn everything on the first try. Not everybody can do that. Some people are just that talented. But for those that aren't, you have to put the time in. And it's going to suck. It's going to hurt. You're going to be discouraged. But the more time you put in, the more effort you put towards something, the better you'll be for it. I definitely agree with that. I'm definitely one for repetition and not necessarily naturally talented with a lot of skills. You know, I had to put the time in. High diving is a good example. Me trying to learn how to high dive. That took a while. A long time. But you never gave up. You never... I mean, you were discouraged at that point. Yeah, for sure. Definitely. But you eventually got to 15 meters. 16. 16 meters. That was my last failure. So, I mean, that's a huge accomplishment for somebody who's never dove before. And you did that in a year, two years. Yeah. With breaks in between. Yeah. And that wasn't five hours a day, five days a week. That was 30 minutes once a week. Yeah. So that's why it took that amount of time. But if you had more time to do those things, you would have progressed a lot faster because you have that determination. You have that hunger. You have that spirit. You have that drive. And that's one of the things that... Or, one, many of the things that I saw in you when it was COVID time and you had auditioned or sent your stuff to LaPearl. And I was like, yeah, this girl definitely deserves something. Because after we did the interview, I saw something in you. And I was like, she deserves to be here. And that's why you were here. That's why you're at LaPearl currently. And I also saw a side of you that wanted to, or not that wanted to, but that was able to help and teach others and pull from others because of all the experience you had. That's why I offered you the job to be the aerial coach at LaPearl. And now I think you're thriving. We have two new CCOs, and they are learning at such a quick pace. But I think it's because of the passion and the drive and the love you have for circus that translates to them. So they want to give of themselves because you give so much of yourself. Thank you. I appreciate that. I think the biggest thing that I've always learned is to not be afraid to fail along the way. What you call failure is actually just a process of learning. You're going to make mistakes. I make mistakes all the time. It's the only way you learn, you grow, and you can't be scared to put yourself out there. So even if I'm terrified of something or nervous, I'm just going to do it anyway. Feel the fear and do it anyway. Do it. Fail. Fail hard. Fail as many times as you can. Because the more you fail, the more chances you have of getting it right. It's true. Because you've got it wrong so many times, so the next time might be the right one. Yes. So fail and fail forward. Exactly. There's no way to go back up if you just keep going. To stop is... To fail. Yes, is to fail. But just keep going no matter what obstacles you get in your way. You're just going to try again. You're going to try again. You're going to try again. Put your pride to the side and just go for it. Just follow your passion. Follow your dream. I think that's the most important thing I've learned along the way and something I like to teach others as well. And I think you definitely do that as a coach. You always encourage the artist. You've been coaching at Lapel now for six years. Six years, yes. And, I mean, that's also not easy to go from being an artist to transitioning into a full-time coach. It's different coaching on the side to being a coach full-time. You're no longer on the stage. You get a different sense of joy. You're backstage, but you're watching the people you've coached perform and shine. But did you find that transition difficult or easy? Well, definitely nerve-wracking because I wasn't sure of what I was getting myself into. I've coached kids. I've coached teenagers. I've helped adults that want to learn a backflip, but I've never coached professional artists. So when I got to Lapel for the first time, I was definitely like, okay, how do I navigate? What is my role? Am I teaching them skills? Am I managing expectations? Am I managing personalities? And that was one of the questions I asked when I was interviewing for the position. It was like, so what does the job entail? Give me a percentage of teaching skills versus managing people. And they told me it was 80-20. Oh, wow. And the 20 was teaching skills. The 80 was managing people because you have people from all over the world. You have people straight out of gymnastics. You have people that have been performing for 10, 20 years who have their favorite coach and how they coach. And they don't like this person for this reason, and these people don't get along. And so it's like, how do I manage all of that? And it's not easy, but you get to know people. You get to know personalities. But I feel like as a coach, you kind of have to be a chameleon. Like you set expectations, but at the same time, you have to navigate the personalities because what you might expect from one person who is super talented and can do things like that, you might not get from the other. You need to manage your expectations per person almost in a sense. So yeah, it was difficult to navigate, but I think I'm a better person and a better manager and leader after these six years and after the understanding of how to lead a team of 42 random individuals that all come together for their passion, their love for a circus. I think also the language barriers. A lot of the artists might not have the strongest level of English. Yeah. When we recently did a CCO, we were casting seven artists, and maybe two of them spoke English fluently. So it was definitely a challenge, but in 11 weeks, we were able to teach them the whole show, multiple parts of the show. Because we had to replace 11 artists that had been with the show for two years, so they had to come in and be able to replace those artists exactly. So it couldn't be just, oh, you just do this one part. You just do this one part. No, it's like you have to learn everything. So it was very difficult, and we're a water show, and one of the artists couldn't swim. I'm not a swimming coach, but as I said, you've got to be a chameleon. So I was waking up early. I was going to the pool to teach this guy how to swim, and it was so rewarding when he finally passed the swim test because it was like, wow, I had to step outside of myself, and so did he. We were able to accomplish that together, and I think now he is SCUBA certified, and he has his deep water, and he's gone SCUBA diving on vacation, but on like SCUBA trips. So it's like, wow, I was able to help him do that, and that is where the reward is for me now is being able to help somebody achieve something they didn't think they could. I definitely feel that that's a big part of being a coach full-time is that you feel that new sense of joy in your day-to-day, seeing the happiness in their achievements and that you help facilitate that. But definitely you also learn a whole new aspect of coaching that I never experienced in my previous coaching roles ever, because you're around everyone for so many hours a day, and then there may be some dramas or emotional things that you have to deal with as well, so you feel like sometimes you're almost acting as a therapist. Yeah, I would say for anybody that wants to get into coaching, it might be a good idea to get a psychology 101 degree or do what we did and get immersed in it and get your education in the hours. Yeah, because I don't think I was mentally expecting that to be such a big part of it. I was thinking more it's all about coaching the skills, motivating, but I didn't think about dealing with their personal issues and maybe conflicts, confrontations, things like that. And then there's politics and all sorts of other things that you just don't think are such a big part of day-to-day coaching, but they are, and I think that's in a lot of workplaces, but especially something where you're working with people, they're exhausted, they're doing a very physical job, they're performing two shows every night, five, sometimes six days a week, they've got trainings every day, so that wears you down, you're tired. You're around the same people until 10.30 every night, so I think that also plays a big part on how everyone's feeling and they're more reactive than they might be if they had been at home relaxing all day and just came in to do the shows. Yeah, for sure. It's different when you've just been there for eight hours and then now you've got to go and do something scary on stage, something that might make you get nervous. Yeah, and when those situations arise, our previous executive show director would always say, when you go out there, pretend like it's your first time. And when you have that mindset, you're thinking about why am I doing this, why you were excited to be on the stage in the first place. So if you can manage to put your head in that mind space, you'll always enjoy every show because it's always like you're doing it for the first time. Everybody in their first show, yeah, they're nervous. Their heart is pumping through their costume, but it's so rewarding because you're finally getting to do what you've wanted to do for so long, and now you're finally doing it. And if you can just keep that feeling, you'll never be unhappy at work. That's true. It can happen that you forget sometimes because you're doing it, you've been performing for over 15 years, you're doing two shows every night. People can sometimes forget, not forget, but they're just almost on autopilot. And so I think it's important to try and keep that feeling, like you said. But I think also that's one of the good things about La Perle is they have different tracks. Your show line-up is never the same each night. You have to learn the whole show, you're not just going on and doing your part and leaving. And then your positions in each, whether it's dance, choreography or whatever, even the tracks that you're doing, it's going to be completely different each night, so you need to sort of be paying a bit of attention. Yeah, kind of, yeah. Keep it secure. Keep it fresh. Yeah. And so what do you look for when you're casting for artists for La Perle? What's the most important thing? For me, the most important thing is where... Because I can see, I see the demo, I see the resume, but I look forward to the initial interview because I want to work with good people, I don't care if you're the best because I know you can train to be better, but I'm looking for the people with the right mindset, the people that are still in love with what they're doing, the people that are excited to work with other people, are excited to do something new. I look for that excitement, that childlike spark. And when I see that, that's more so what I look for. But, I mean, if you have no skills but you have that childlike spark, maybe next time. Like, go get a little bit better. But it definitely, for me, it's not just about the tricks, it's about the person. And I want good people. And when I say good people, that means a good personality, not just, I've got the skills. No, I want people who love what they do and will stay in love with what they do and can remember why I'm doing this and still have that love. Yeah, so, yeah, that's what I look for. That's a really important point, I think. I look for that too, definitely. In the last round of casting, it's important to see that someone has a good spirit, good energy. They're going to enjoy the process of going to, because it is difficult and it can be difficult, you know, learning to do well. Things are out of your comfort zone. And you're tired. They're long days, long nights. And someone that's going to keep a good spirit, bring the morale up in general, you know, be enjoyable to be around, have an open mindset when learning the choreography or things that they might not be good at. You know, you have to learn a lot of different disciplines that you would normally perform, you know, Chappelle harness work, all the group acts. And we were saying, like, those people that are willing to come and make mistakes and improve and get better and not be worried about making those mistakes. Yeah. So, yeah, it's definitely, for me, it's about the person rather than what they can do. Yeah. I think also the drive to want to work hard and improve is really important as well. Because if you're not getting something or you're struggling with picking up a lot of choreography, for example, I think it's important that you're going to put the time in on your own, if needed, to make sure you revive the choreography or work on the skills that you need to work on. 10,000 hours. Yeah. I mean, yeah, it all comes down to how bad do you want it and what are you willing to do to achieve your goals? Yeah, and I think that's the same in any competitive industry. And circus is a very competitive industry, you know, because now, I mean, there's so many circus artists out there. And that's not to, don't be discouraged, be motivated that you're going to be one of them and you're going to put in the best that you can, you know, you're going to put in everything, give it your best and shine in your individual way. Yeah, and speaking of, one thing when casting, a lot of artists nowadays, they don't put in the effort of when you're searching for a job, it's a full-time job. Yeah. So you're also selling yourself. Yes, you have to train and do that stuff, but you also have to sell yourself. And when there's an open casting or a casting call and you submit yourself and you're like, here's my Instagram, that isn't selling yourself. That, to me, is a little bit lazy. You should, if you want a job, the casting director or the casting person shouldn't have to leave that one page. Your demo should be on there, your resume should be on there, your height, your weight, your experience, why you are better than the next person for this role, who you are. All of these things should come across right away rather than me or you or the casting director at Cirque du Soleil or any circus company having to search for you when you are the one that came to them. So my advice for them would be to make a demo, a minute, 30 seconds of your best stuff. Make sure on your resume you have your previous experience. If you don't have any experience, the skills that you have. Tell us a little bit about yourself. Tell us what you're passionate about. Show us why you are the one for the job rather than us having to or sending us to search for you. It's so important because there are hundreds, if not thousands of applicants for any job in demand, especially in this industry. What's going to make you stand out at the end of the day? If they've got a busy schedule, things that they need to do, lots of applicants to go through, if they're going to have to search for you or download video files or look for your Instagram when they're on their computer, they're most likely going to go next. No, not most likely. They're definitely going to go next because they're going to look for that candidate who has done that. And if out of a thousand, it's three, those three are most likely going to be the first ones to be reached out to. Yeah, definitely. So that's just something, maybe it sounds bad, but something that everybody should keep in mind when searching for that job. I definitely experience that too because you've got a lot of applicants that will show you that they've taken the initiative and show you how much they want the job. So it's then going to be extremely difficult to take the time to look at someone that looks like maybe they didn't want the job as much or they didn't really care to put much effort into the application. Yeah, it shows a lack of care. Yeah, it shows a lack of care. I mean, yeah, it might have been difficult to type your Instagram handle, but not as difficult as putting a demo together of your one-minute or 20-second Instagram post. But the person that does that shows they want it that much more. And do you think it's important to also enclose a full video of your act, preferably unedited? I think it definitely depends on what you're applying for. If you're applying for a house trip position, then you might want to put a demo together of a bunch of different things. But if, let's say, you're applying to be an aerialist in, say, our show, yes, put together that one-minute, 30-second demo so we see, like, okay, she touched the hooks, she touched the silks, she's done something in a harness, she's done something on an aerial pole or any other aerial apparatus. But then if you have an act, also put that in there so we, again, don't have to search for it or write you back. Of course, in that one-minute and 30-second video, we see, like, wow. Of course we're going to write you back because you did most of that work. But it's also good to just attach a link to YouTube to be like, hey, there's, other than this demo, here's also an act that I did for this show, an act that the more you give, the more you sell yourself, the easier it is for someone to buy in. It's true. And it's show business. It's a business, so you need to present yourself in a professional capacity, provide links that are easy to access, filmed in landscape, not portrait. So it's nice, it fills up the whole screen, shows that you've got professional experience, the required skill level of the required disciplines, and that you've included all of those elements. I don't recommend sending files that are difficult to download as well, I think. Yeah. A link to YouTube or Vimeo is the best. You just press the button, you're right there. The easier you can make it for the person looking to hire you, the better. Always. Definitely. Always. What's the biggest no-no, what not to do if you are applying for a job, applying for LaPel or any show? I think for me a no-no would be... The biggest no-no... Being too informal. Okay. Like, yo! Yo, Andre! And it's like, uh... No, I mean, I understand, maybe that's your personality, and maybe you start with like a yo, but it's like, yo, I'm... And this person said I should message you, give me a job. I'm not... What's your name? How did you... Could you please send me... It's like those... It's... Skip. Try again. Yeah. Hey, I got your... Hey, Andre, I got your contact email from... I'm a... Give a little... That's when, after you've introduced yourself, give a little bit of yourself. Like, yo, I'm super excited to have this opportunity, but like, yo, hire me. No. No, no, no. That is too informal. That is too informal, or when, like, you're applying, and one time... One time, I was doing an interview, and the person on the other side of the screen was smoking weed, and they thought that this was a good thing, and I was like... I can see you. Like, I don't care if you do that, but don't do it in the interview. Yeah, no, that's... You know, to each their own. Yeah. You know, if that's how you get inspired and whatever, fine, but don't do it in the interview. That just shows you don't care. I think that's bad judgment as well, like, if you're applying for any job, it's best to not show that. Yeah. That's very important, a bit of advice. Yeah, always put your best foot forward. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. To show that you're going to be professional, reliable, and actually turn up to work. Not that you might be out partying the night before, and you might not make it to the show. No one wants to see that. It makes them very nervous if they're the ones that hide you, and then they're going to be left going, where are they? Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. Yeah, that is a no-no. That's a definite deal breaker. Yeah. Is there anything else in particular that you would strongly recommend against? Strongly recommend against? When auditioning or when applying online for a position, either at LaPearl or another show. No. If you stick to selling yourself to make it easier for the casting director or casting person or whoever is in charge of possibly hiring you, if you make it as easy as possible for them, the better chance you'll have. So I guess a no-no is don't make it difficult. Yeah. Don't make it difficult for them to know who you are, to see who you are, because it will definitely lower your chances of being the next person in that position. Yeah. I think it's important to show your personality, but within sort of a professional capacity as well, like knowing that you're applying for a job, that you're going to work hard, and that you want to show them that you really want the job and that you're going to do your best to do the best that you can do in that show and performing and you're going to be reliable and you're going to work hard and put on a great performance and that you want it. Yeah. And yeah, don't make it difficult. Don't make it difficult. I think that's very, very important. Yeah. Show that you want the job. Show that you care, because if you show that you don't, then that's what comes across, and then why would you want somebody that doesn't care? Do you think that puts into the person who's trying to hire you's mind that, oh, they'll last for two years, this two-year contract? No, if you don't care, they'll be like, oh, the next opportunity that comes along, maybe they'll just leave, or maybe the first sign of adversity, they'll be like, oh, this is too difficult, I'm out. Yeah. Like if you show you don't care, then it comes across, and also it doesn't help you sell yourself. You're selling you. You are the product. Like would you buy a Coca-Cola drink if in the commercial it was like, I don't know, like it came out of the mud and it was half open, and then like, no, you wouldn't drink that. You buy it because the commercial makes you think it's refreshing and it's going to enhance your day in some way. That's what attracts you to it. So, again, you are the Coca-Cola. You're the Pepsi. You're the product. Be the product. What would you want to see if you were in that position of the casting director? Think that way. How would you want someone to present themselves if you were filing through a thousand people? What would you want? How would you want the process to go if you were that casting person? Sometimes think that way. I think that's really useful information. Also, as you are the product, like you were saying, you need to also look somewhat presentable. Try not to look like you just woke up in pajamas on the Skype interview or Zoom call. Make sure that you look like you've gotten ready for the occasion and that you're switched on. And don't be late. It's an obvious one. No, no. That's a no, no. Or if you know you're going to be late, send an email. Send a WhatsApp. Send something to be like, Hey, I'm stuck in traffic. I'm really trying to get to you. Like communication. Communication if you can't make it on time. Or, Hey, I couldn't make it because my mom needed me to do this. Can we reschedule? You'll win a lot more that way than showing up late and hiding the fact that you couldn't make it on time. You know, it's always better to let us know ahead of time than to be like, Sorry. Like, yeah, there's a saying, it's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is for permission. But not in casting. Not if you're the one wanting the job. Yeah, I think definitely just try not to be late to start with. And then if you are, yeah, for sure, let them know. But also, if you're going to be late, it stresses you out. So then maybe your energy won't be as good as if you were calm. And you're going to be nervous either way. You don't need the additional adrenaline of, Oh my God, I'm going to miss it. You know, that stress. And you'll go into the interview or the audition sweaty and disheveled and a bit frazzled. And, you know, maybe the words won't come out properly. So I think do whatever you can to make sure you're not late. And like you said, if you are late, then let them know. And hopefully it's a very good reason. But I think that's really, really important advice. Yeah. And honestly, so much useful information today. Like so many useful points for artists aspiring professionals and professionals to just really up their game, put themselves out there and just go for it, go for their dreams. You know, perform as much as they can while they still can. Have you got any other words of wisdom that you've picked up along the way? I mean, nothing new, just to remember why you started doing it in the first place. Remember how you felt when you started. Always try to keep that child like spark, and it will never feel like you're working a day in your life, especially if you love what you're doing. So love what you do. If you don't love it, life's too short to do something just to do it. Do what you love because you love it, and you will find a way to monetize it. You will find a way, especially in today's world, like you can monetize anything. You can cut your toenails and somebody will buy it because it's just that we're there now. So love what you do, and you'll never work a day in your life. I love that. That's so true. Thank you. That's very inspirational, very useful, and I really hope you guys enjoyed that as much as I did. I did. I enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it, and I want to say thank you again. I know we work together. He's in the office long, long hours. He's always there early. He's leaving late. He doesn't take breaks. He doesn't eat. Often I'm like, he doesn't eat. I'm always eating. And I just am very grateful that you took the time to talk to me and everyone and just impart your wisdom, and I want to say thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me, and very, very good luck with this new venture of yours, this podcast and all that you're doing. At least you're shining like a star, so don't let the spark go. Oh, thank you. I love that. All right. I'll see you later, guys. Have an amazing day. Bye, guys. Bye, guys. Nice. I should have brought a water.