When Women Speak - Episode 1

A group of women introduce themselves and discuss the importance of self-care and relaxation. They reflect on their own experiences and the lack of role models for women prioritizing themselves. They share stories of how they have practiced self-care and the challenges they face, particularly as mothers. They discuss the impact of societal expectations and the need for women to support and uplift each other. They also explore the idea of redefining identities and embracing self-care without guilt or apology. When women speak, when women speak, when women speak, when women speak, when women speak. Hello everyone. My name is Natasha Burford and welcome to our very first podcast. I am joined today with Patricia McPherson, Latchmi Singh, Marsha Baines, and again, like I said, my name is Natasha. We are doing this podcast brought to you by BBI, which is the Black Business Initiative out in Nova Scotia, and we are super excited to be here. We have lots in store for you today, so let's just dive right in. We're going to start with introductions. I'll introduce myself. Again, my name is Natasha Burford. While we were going through our practice, Patricia mentioned who we are today, and I love that because I feel every day that we're evolving, and so today, I am a mother of three amazing boys, a wife of just one, I am a daughter, I am a sister, and again, also in my profession, I am a lecturer at U of T, OISE program, and I am a teacher, an elementary teacher at the Chironogistic School Board. I am a daughter of Christ. My religion is very important to me, and I just love what I do. I love waking up every single day, and I think at this table with all of you amazing ladies, I am definitely going to be bringing some transparency because at heart, I am a storyteller, so I'm just going to bring my stories and my crazy experiences, sometimes high, sometimes low, but just really using this as a vehicle to give back. I really believe when you leave this earth, to leave it empty, and so I hope to share my experiences of the things that I've learned throughout my life. That's beautiful. Thank you. Let's give it away to Patricia. Thank you. So, yes, I was saying anytime I'm asked who am I, it's always like, I don't know, and I think sometimes that comes from a place of, as you were saying, Tasha, you're very spiritual and you have this connection and commune with God, and being a service person and being in the service industry, I'm very big on just use me, and this way I'm not attached to any particular role, or I just do what I do and what's passionate to me, and try to do it for the greater good then. So in saying that, today I'm patient, I'm a little tired, but I'm here, and I am a yoga instructor, that's what I do full time, and a meditation guide, and I really have a passion, a new passion for helping people to relax. It's become something very special to me. When you see someone, they feel like they can't relax, and you see them generate this energy, this quality, it's really, really beautiful to see people just let themselves go. So, that's a big passion of mine, and then on the other side, my great escape is I'm an artist, and I sing, and I'm an actor, and I'm a writer, and that's where I get to play, and I get to be a child again, and it's a lot of fun. So just being in this group with you guys, it's really nice just to connect with you guys, and I'm really big on women supporting each other, and coming together, and really solidifying that sisterhood, it doesn't matter where we're from or what we look like, I think women need women, and it's important that we share in this way as much as we can. I find people, we need to talk, so the more we talk, hopefully it'll get everyone talking. I love that. Well said. Awesome. Yeah. Thank you. Ooh, it's me. So, I was asked this question a week ago, the who am I question. Currently, I am an entrepreneur, and I work as a real estate agent, and our team, we journaled for an hour on who am I. So, the first thing that came to me, I was first a daughter. Today, I was a nurturer and household manager. I'm always a nurturer. I'm also now a mother. I'm a friend. I am a sister. I am a connector, but yes, professionally, I guess I'm an entrepreneur who currently exercises that as a real estate agent. Thanks so much, Marcia, and thank you, ladies, for welcoming me into this space. I am grateful to be here with all of you, and it has been such a transformational experience knowing you thus far. So, my name's Latchmi Singh. My pronouns are she, her. I am joining you here today. My background is Indo-Caribbean. I was born in Guyana. I've lived in multiple countries in my life, and I would like to think that that has framed the way I look at things and my experiences, and I'm hoping to be able to integrate that into some of our conversations that we're going to have. I've also worked my entire life in post-secondary education. My career spans over 20 years. So, again, education has been foundational for me, but education, I've learned, is more than just academia and the books we read and the knowledge we acquire through books. It is about sharing stories, as Natasha said, being storytellers, the strengths we draw from each other, and the inspiration we draw from each other. So, I'm looking forward to that journey here with all of you today. And as a woman, as a racialized woman, you know, these conversations will involve everything from talking about how we navigate ourselves, our family, our careers, and just life, just life in general, really. And I'm hoping that as we share our collective experiences, we can also grow our collective wisdom with each other as well. That's so beautiful. Well said, Latchmi. So, okay, so recently, you know, I love that you said we're going to talk about different things, and I think we are all on these unique journeys that have kind of met each other at a point, which is really, really awesome, because, you know, what's brought us together is we're the same, really, you know, we're all the same. Absolutely. So, in our last, one of our last sessions, you brought up a post you had seen online that really touched you. So, can you share that with us? Sure. So, this post was posted on Instagram, I believe it was, by Nicola Jane Hobbs, who is a writer, researcher, a therapist, and also a coach. And it reads, growing up, I never knew a relaxed woman. Successful women, yes. Productive women, plenty. Anxious and afraid and apologetic women, heaps of them. But relaxed women, at ease women. Women who won't or don't dissect their days in half-hour slots of productivity. Women who prioritize rest, pleasure, and play. Women who are not afraid to take up space in this world. Women who give themselves unconditional permission to relax, without guilt, without apology, without feeling like they need to earn it. I'm not sure I've ever met a woman like that, but I would like to become one. And I read this message and I shared it all with you because it really got me thinking. It got me thinking, you know, about growing up. I have never, you know, known a relaxed woman. Women who prioritize themselves, prioritize self-care. You know, I'm picturing my mother, my grandmother, my aunts, they're always women in motion, always doing, being somewhere, doing something, taking care of someone. And it led me to start to think about all of the identities and roles that we carry as women. And what shapes those identities? Certainly I think our childhood, what we observe, but who or what defined those identities for us? And then I started to think, when did I start to question this for myself? Like, when did I know that perhaps this wasn't, you know, my complete self that I could be? And without role models who can emulate for us self-care and play and relaxation, how do we as women grasp onto those identities? How do we practice that in our everyday lives? And it wasn't until I met you, ladies, that I realized that other women are also grappling with the same issue. So, you know, I'll open it up for thoughts. I'm smiling because I remember when I first started to exercise self-care, I was probably in elementary school. I didn't understand why we had, like, fancy glasses that were only for special occasions, or my mom had fancy, like, outfits. So on PA days, because I grew up in the 80s, I was a latchkey kid, I drank my water in champagne flutes, and I put on her fancy things, and that's how I spent my PA days. I don't know. And so I kind of started, I don't know where it came from, to be honest, exercising these sort of things pretty early. Like, I would have, but by this time, I was probably, like, late teens. March of Fridays, I did at-home manicures and pedicures, and I would have a bubble bath, like, every Friday. It's weird, though, because once I became a mother, then it was, I found it hard. It's easy when you only have to think about yourself to find time for that, and then there's the expectation that you should be doing, so that kind of shifted. I went from being a person who's fairly self-indulgent, I'm a Taurus, I'm hedonistic, I love taking care of myself, but all of a sudden, there was this whole other being that I had to take care of, and I couldn't always find time for me, I mean, I didn't find time today, I haven't combed my hair in two days, so, like, it's a very different existence. But early on, I think I was very, I would say, like, rebellious towards what I saw. My mom got divorced when I was young, and I noticed her shift. She went from being, like, so concerned with cooking and eating less, to being like, okay, we're going to have McDonald's today, we're going to have pizza tomorrow, all of a sudden, there was a freeness, and I noticed, and I was bothered, which could also be why I'm not married. But, like, all those things, kids notice, they're taking note early, because I took note very early, and, like, all the decisions I've made since were based off observations I made probably before I was 10 years old. So you had someone, then, Marsha, to, as a role model, to say, you know, it's okay to put yourself first. The world's not going to fall apart, the house is not going to fall apart, if, you know, you just hit pause for, for, let's see, that shift happened once she had less people to take care of. Right, right. Marsha, you're absolutely killing me. You're killing me, I'm trying not to laugh. You're killing me. I think, you know, Lashmi, you said a very important thing, because you think about self-care, but you also talked about identities, and the balancing of identities, I think, like, thinking about those two hand in hand, because I've always, you know, associated my importance with an identity that I carried, you know, even now, when I did an introduction, I'm a professional lecturer, and I'm an elementary teacher, and I'm a mother, and, you know, I, and so, those held importance for me, or to me, for a very long time, to be very, very honest, until I got sick, I got really sick last year, and ended up being hospitalized, and then, it wasn't until I was sitting in a hospital bed, that the social worker came, and I think I shared it, and I'm literally having the laptop on my, on my stomach, doing work still, and this was not, like, the flu, this was kidney failure, this was something serious, and I was still doing work, because I associated, again, my, my worth, and my importance to my work, and to my identities, and the social worker thought there was something very, very wrong with me, you know, and at that point, I thought, holy cannoli, there was something very wrong. And did you realize in that moment? In that moment, I broke down, I started crying, I just thought, what the heck am I doing? I'm like, this is not, this is not, like, I can die, right? And she gave me a book, so as someone actually called me when I was released, and someone called me, and they spoke with me for, it was almost like this, just, this call, right, for help, and they spoke to me, and they suggested a book called When the Body Says No, and by Dr. Gaber, right, Dr. Gaber Matei, and it was like, it was, it was wonderful, it opened my eyes to the fact that I needed to start saying no to my children, I needed to start saying no to my husband, I needed to start saying no to my mom, no to my brother, you know, everything that I, like, my whole life, I just did for everybody. And don't get me wrong, I had days that I celebrated myself, but it was once a year, and it was my birthday. You know, for my birthday, I went all out, but every other time of the year, I was just constantly giving to people. And so, you know, it came full circle while I just thought, you know what, I need to live, and not just live physically, but when I do, and God gives me another chance, because that's what I consider it, another chance to live, I need to live for myself. You know, I really need to put myself first. And so that's, you know, I'm very, I feel very blessed to be able to do that today, and be here, and share the space with all of you. But it's hard. I think, especially as black women, as racialized women, I think that we, you know, we do, like you said, my mother, my grandmother, my sister, you know, I'm always seeing them do, like, my mom worked, you know, two, three jobs, you know, when I was growing up. And so it was just, it was normalized. It was normalized for me to just do everything. Like, I literally did, like, I have three boys, I would take them to football, hockey, dance, and then still turn around and, you know, come home and cook and, oh, I won't say, clean, cook and clean so much, but I was still holding up the house. I was finding other ways to balance everything. But I was still holding the house together. And it was something that was normal until, you know, God said no, or my body said no. My body definitely said no. Well, relaxation is a calling. I'll tell you that much. As much effort as it is to move is as much effort as it takes to be still. And then I noticed this in yoga, people have the hardest time being still and just relaxing. So it's funny that this is what we're talking about today, because you guys, I'm working on my little daily affirmation book. And today, without even thinking about it, today, my entry was, sometimes you just need to relax. Sometimes you just need to relax. What I realized in that sentence is the word just. And a friend of mine the other day, we were talking and he was contemplating the word just, and why do we always use the word just, right? And we realized it's the short form of justify. Right? So even me writing, sometimes you just need to relax, is a reminder again, and a conditioning that we subconsciously feel like we have to justify rest. Or we have to justify relaxing. You know, and what you were saying, where does that come from? Yeah, you know, it's your belief system. And that's what you have to question. And you know, our parents and a lot of that is karmic too. It's generational, right? Colonialism. That's right. You know, but it really is a calling. You know, another thing that's been floating through my head this week, too, is self-care isn't self-development. You know, that comes back to the identity, right? People, you know, become a self-care guru. There's no such thing. And if you are, it's for yourself. You are your own teacher in that, in that space, you know. But just to come back to, you know, it takes work, it takes effort. And say it's like someone from me, I've been practicing yoga for almost 15 years. I've been teaching it for almost 11. And I still mentally have to tell myself, it's okay, Pat, you can sit here, roll a fat one and have a drink and chill out. It's okay. It's a practice, for sure. And another thing, too, that's been, I'm telling you, there's a reason I knew I was going to see you guys this week, because everything just came to me this week, all these downloads. Effortless requires effort, you know, to be effortless, it requires effort, you know, and it takes work. I guess hearing you guys speak now, I just wanted to ask and turn it back to you, you know, if someone was to ask you today, are you a relaxed woman? Yeah, it's so funny that you would say that, because after everything I just shared, I had one of my students, I was teaching on Tuesday, and I met one of my students going up in the elevator. And you know, she sees me, I'm dressed up, I have my little briefcase. And she says, Dr. Burford, how do you avoid burnout? And I looked at her and I said, I don't. And she just howled, she started laughing, because I'm just like, don't think I have it all together. Like, I didn't even want to get up that morning, I actually was so tempted to go online and cancel the class. So tempted. And I just thought I deserve that. Like, I'm tired. However, I still forced myself and went to that class and taught that class. And it was great. It was a great class. But I thought to answer your question, it's like, are you now relaxing more? I mean, I do say no more, I'll tell you that. I don't say yes to everything. Like when I'm tired, my voice can be embarrassed. True story. And I was like, you need to find your way home. You know, you succeed now, like you got there, find your way home or sleep over. So I do say no. But I am not quite you like you said, I love that you're hitting some deep spots today. Effort to be effortless takes effort. Yeah, I love that. Because I have not found my zen moment yet. But now I'm curious, you retired that day, you did not choose rest? No. And did you rest after the class? The next day? When did you make time for that rest? That's a great question. Because after my university classes, I go to my elementary class. And then on Tuesday nights, my son has hockey. So I was at hockey practice with him till nine. And then after hockey practice, I pick up my son from dance. So I'm still waiting for the rest. But again, my husband does more stuff. Now we definitely like on the weekends, I'm not bringing my sons to hockey. I'm like, you don't work on the weekends, you will bring my son, you know, you will bring our son to hockey. But I have a lot of catching up to do. Okay. Yeah, I do. I'm not gonna lie. It is a relearning. If you think for so long, we've been wired to, to just, like we said, just be in productivity mode. Yeah. So switching off is, like you said, being you have to be intentional about it, you have to be mindful about it. I think one of the things that I find a little bit ironic for me is that I, even though I say, okay, I'm going to like, relax, then I think I need to fill that space with a hobby. So I have a room in my house with many started hobbies that are now either have never come out of a box, or they've been started, and they're, you know, off to off to one side. So it's being intentional about not filling that space with something else. Now you got it. Yeah. And I it's so hard, like, Natasha, when you said saying no, I'm not even there yet. I don't even know how to say no. You know, so how did you do that for the first time without feeling guilty or? I'll be very honest. It was something that I had no control over because I was sick. So like, I would never, like, I would never leave my 15 year old son in Barrie. But I knew if I got in that car and drove, I would end up in the hospital in Barrie. You know, and I was so afraid, like, I was just like, you know, he was begging me for like a whole month to go to Barrie, then he gets to Barrie, and he misses the gold train to get back. And I just thought, if I get in that, because again, that would have been me, that would have been me like, 10 o'clock at night, I'm in the car picking up my my children are my everything. So I just thought, just like the social worker said, you need to take yourself first. If you don't take yourself, you will not be here for your sons. And it hit me like a rock. I'm like, they're going to be motherless. And that's like the message that I want to like, you know, for like you said, women need women. And so if I could share anything, because I am such a private person, but I shared my story on Twitter. And you will believe I had women literally DMing me saying, thank you for sharing your story. Because, you know, I haven't been feeling well. And I've been pushing myself to go to work for the last two months. You know, or I like you said, I don't know how to say no, like your children and I've learned this actually from my mom, Marcia, when you said you learned after your mom got divorced, you saw a pattern. I learned this from my mom and her friends, where you give everything to your children, and then they grow up and leave. They grow up and they leave. And it's not like, you know, it's not to be like, I'm not gonna give them anything. But you cannot neglect yourself for your children. You like and that's what I've done. I have learned to balance I did my my master's and my PhD while they were like six years old, because I'm like, I am not going to put myself aside. And only do stuff for my children. My children are very accomplished. But now so am I, because we felt I balanced that time, you know, and so to answer your question, it wasn't something that I consciously said, I'm going to start saying no. It was like, if I don't say no, I'm literally going to die. Yeah, I was just about to say that I'm going to die, I'm going to die. You have to get there. Yeah, you have to you have to get there when they say you have to hit rock bottom. Yes, I hit rock bottom. Please do not wait to hit rock bottom. Yeah, I agree. I agree. Like, yeah, we it's a it's not a place you can come back from. So yeah, we definitely need to like, and I think that's why I when I saw this, this post, I thought it really resonated because I thought, you know, maybe I didn't have that growing up to emulate or to, to learn from, but now I have to be that person that perhaps other people learn from and, you know, surrounding myself with with people with other women like like yourselves that, you know, we can say to each other, hey, it's okay. You know what, it's okay. The house doesn't have to be super clean. You know, there's no one coming over. Right? And like, all the chores did not have to be done. Yeah, you have a full day. Why did we? Why? We could, we could clean the bathroom. And yeah, we don't have to do everything in one day. Like we could spread them out throughout the week. That's a good point. It doesn't have to be put away. And I think our exercise for this week, ladies, is learning, like practicing saying no. Like just practicing saying no. If it's for only one thing. Yeah. I wanted to hold each other accountable to that too, because I think we should share when we said no and what we said no to so that we can say, yes, I did. I agree. But speaking of which as well, I think the flip side of practicing saying no, we had tried to get to yoga. And I really want to go. It's my first Tuesday that I don't have hockey. Oh, yeah. Coming. Yeah, this Tuesday coming. Halloween. Halloween. I'm still teaching, but it is Halloween. I'm still teaching. I'm on yoga this Tuesday. Sorry, I'm not coming guys. No, I'm definitely going to come out. Good. I didn't realize it's because of Halloween. So I'm going to take it because I need to. I need to find some time. Yeah. So I really want to add to what you said. You said when I'm relaxing, I still am trying to stop myself from filling that space with something to do. Yeah. And it's because we haven't been taught how to relax. You know, we really don't know what relaxation is. And I'm so grateful for yoga because it's taught me so much. And I'm grateful for this platform because then I can share all these things. And this is what I've learned. Yogis have realized that relaxation is an activity. Okay. Meaning every activity that you do in your life, you witness yourself doing it. If you go for a ride on your bike, you know you are presently in that moment riding the bike. If you're reading a book, you know you are presently in that story reading the book. So in a way you are witnessing the action. Right. When it comes to relaxation, we haven't been taught to witness no action. So we don't know what it is to not do. Right. To really understand non-doing. So yogis believe in order to experience relaxation, you have to witness it. I love that. Or else you end up just filling the time on your phone with something else. Yeah. You're not relaxing. You're only accumulating more tension. Okay. So how do we do that? How do we watch ourselves relaxing? Do absolutely nothing. And be okay with it. And be okay with it. I'm going to share a story. When I first started meditating, I would start crying every time. And I would speak with the instructor and I was like, so weird. Every time, even when I meditate at home, tears just start pouring. And she's like, what do you think it is? I think it's the only time, I'm not rarely that kind to myself as I am when I'm sitting in silence. So that it's, right, you open up space to be able to feel whatever you're not allowing yourself to feel when you're constantly moving. And it's probably a similar thing for people who don't let themselves relax. When you sit there, it's going to be frustrating. But as time builds, you'll realize how kind you are. No, you know what? I love that as well. Because my girlfriend did mention that she went to like a retreat where there's like no talking. And I just thought I would lose my freaking mind. I would lose my mind. That's hard. But that would probably be me, like what Marcia said, where I'm just like crying. So I think as we close off, I'm so excited that we're coming to your yoga retreat. Do you want to like share where it is? Well, it's just class, downtown Toronto. That's okay. So you guys would be coming to a restorative practice, a yin practice. There's movement. But yin is, you know, it's easy to cultivate stillness because you hold the postures for longer periods of time. Whereas it's, you know, other classes, you're moving from one thing to the next. So these are ways that you can start to understand what relaxation is. Sometimes it's easier to understand it in somewhere, somewhere else amongst other people. Because, you know, you feel like, oh, I need to behave then. I need to pay attention. And also sort of take yourself out of your own environment. And take yourself out of your own environment. Yeah, I love that. Right. So it's these ways that you can learn how to be okay with doing nothing. Wonderful. Yay. So when women speak is when we learn to support each other. When women speak, we see ourselves in each other. I was going to say something similar. Because I think when women speak, they hear that they're not alone. When women speak, we can inspire each other, we can lift each other up to higher heights. And we can, as you said, support one another. And I look forward to doing much more of this work with you all. When women speak.