This week at Eike with Jolene Martin the Khoe Queen

The conversation on This Week at ACRE focused on culture, identity, and heritage preservation. Jolene Martin, a cultural advocate, shared her journey into cultural advocacy and the inspiration behind her company, Koi Queen. She emphasized the importance of representing and embracing one's cultural identity. Jolene's experience at a heritage day event led her to start her business to ensure no other brown child feels the same embarrassment. Her bold representation on the SAFTA red carpet was praised by Sumizy, highlighting the significance of celebrating indigenous roots and honoring lost lives. Jolene's actions resonated with others, including a listener who expressed gratitude for her representation on national television. Hello, ACRE family, and welcome to another edition of This Week at ACRE, the show where we bring you the people, stories, achievements, and conversations happening across our school community. Today, we have a very special conversation as we explore culture, identity, heritage, and the importance of preserving our history. We are joined today by Jolene Martin, Koi Queen Cultural Ambassador. We're going to talk about the Kwek Kwek heritage, language, cultural identity, and what young people can do to keep our heritage alive. Jolene, welcome to This Week at ACRE. Hi, thank you so much for having me. You guys are making me emotional, I'm so proud of you. Also congratulations on your successes. You are exceptional ambassadors for our country. Thank you so much, ma'am. Let's get straight into getting to know you as a person. Please introduce yourself and tell us about your journey into cultural advocacy. My journey into cultural advocacy. I usually find it quite awkward speaking about myself, so I'll keep it very, very short. I am simply Jolene. I am the first born of three kids to a design engineer father and an opera singer mother. They sent me to ballet when I was four years old in Mitchell's Plain. I became a TV presenter at the age of 13. Then I went professional the moment I left high school. So I left for Johannesburg and I became a game show host, I suppose, most notably for National Lottery. I hosted Powerball and Lotto. You didn't know this about me. Now you know. And then I did some producing in Johannesburg as well. I had my own production company. I did corporate content for big companies across Middle East and Africa. And then I moved into acting. So I've been working primarily in Afrikaans television. Het Rot Met Rugby, Arends Vle, Kouders van Geheimen, etc. I just got back from Jo'burg, filming two movies back to back. And besides all of that, like you said, I'm a cultural advocate. Yes, I consider myself also to be a cultural architect. That's because I believe that culture needs to be rebuilt from the ground up in cases like The Koi and The Sun. Because there's been an attempted erasure of the people and the culture. So when one sees yourself as an architect, you realize it takes every little brick, every little piece of cement, it takes a solid foundation and everybody is a builder. So my chief way of doing that is through my company called Koi Queen. And you are all wearing headpieces that I've bought for you. You look spectacular, absolutely spectacular. And that's how I ensure that everyone has a way of showing the world who they identify as. And that's their way of asserting their culture and their identity. Definitely, yes. And it's also a way of us not only embracing our culture, but unifying us as of Africa. Do you feel unified by your headpieces? Yes, we do. Awesome. So ma'am, you spoke about your company Koi Queen, right ma'am? How is it, or let me ask, what inspired you to start the business in the first place? That's a fantastic question. So, what it happened was, I was doing a show in Johannesburg and they had a heritage day. And they invited everybody to come to work in their heritage attire. And I hadn't started my journey of cultural discovery yet. So I was quite lost. But I did know that I had some friends who had a business and they were doing some t-shirts. I think it was Koi Culture, something to that effect. So I phoned them and I said, I need a t-shirt, please. And both of them rocked up like superheroes and dropped off a couple of t-shirts. And I came to work that Friday, I think it was a Friday. And I was wearing a simple t-shirt with a brown skirt and some wooden earrings. And I arrived at work and everybody was just dressed to the nines in perfect cultural attire from head to toe. And I felt embarrassed. I felt humiliated. I felt like I had let myself down. I felt like I had let my people down, my family down, because I wasn't representing adequately. So I ran to my dressing room and I just got dressed into my first outfit for the day of filming. And then I got a knock on the door and they said, Jolene, the director and producers want you to come and join us for a group photo. Everybody in their cultural attire. And I said, absolutely not, I'm fine, not me. They said, no, no insisting. And I panicked. And I said, just ask the wardrobe lady if she's got anything African. And they came out with some bizarre African print. I don't even recognize which tribe or culture it belonged to. It was just a generic African print. And I put on this dress and I sat myself at the end of the row. And I sat with my back to everyone. I was so demoralized. And that photo is somewhere on the internet. And I realized I had really dropped the ball. I didn't do enough to find out who I was. But it was done. So I ran back to my dressing room, got changed and got to sit and I just put it behind me and wanted to move on. Problem was that the lady that was directing me that day, and she is a very good friend, was and is a very good friend. She came to work in full Furtwäcker attire from head to toe. But Furtwäcker attire that looked like it came out of a museum. It was pristine with the bonnets, everything. And I just assumed that she was going to change into something more comfortable for the rest of the day, the working day. But she didn't. She stayed in that attire. And good for her. She's proud of her culture. She has that right. But something strange happened to me. Because I'm an actress, I'm an empath, so I immediately put myself into certain positions. Or my brain automatically puts me into certain positions. So I walked onto set. And as she was telling me what to do, which is her job as my director, I just saw her in this outfit, which took me back. I went back into time and I thought, this could be the 1600s. And in the 1600s, I would have been her maid. I would have been a slave girl working for her. And then I couldn't stop my brain. My brain immediately went through all of those emotions. What a slave girl would have felt like in those days. What kind of work she would have to do. And my brain did that for the entire day. So I filmed the entire day. But my brain was filming. It was on another storyline, in another narrative. And I just empathized so much with the Kratoas and the slave girls that had to take instruction from people who were dressed like that. And it wasn't their fault. That's just what my brain did. And at the end of the day, I just wept. I got into my car and I put my hands over my steering wheel. And my knuckles went white because I was gripping my steering wheel so hard. And my crying turned into sobbing. And I was just sobbing because of all of the emotion that I had felt that day. And also the embarrassment that I had not represented myself adequately. And I was driving. I was in Joburg at the time. I was driving through Houten. And I stopped outside a mosque because there was lots of parking. And I just stood there in my car and I cried and I cried and I cried. And I prayed and I said, Father God, if you spare me one day, just spare me one day, I'm going to make sure that no other brown child has to go through what I went through today. And that was how I started my company. And I launched it that year on the SAFTA red carpet. I made a decision. I was going to be bold. And there was nowhere to get any koi or sun attire. So I had to make it myself. I made it. And I got a designer to make the evening gown. And I was shaking on that red carpet. And I thought, they're going to call me a clown. They're going to throw tomatoes at me. This is going to be such a joke. And I walked out onto the red carpet. And all the cameras turned on to me. And they had this massive jib. And the jib came in and did like a slow creep up from the floor to my head pieces. And I thought, oh my gosh, they really like how I look. That's so good. And then the ultimate happened. Sumizy was doing the red carpet. I still have this photo. And Sumizy said, get Jolene to come over, to come over, to come over. And I stood in front of Sumizy. And I thought, oh boy, here it goes. Like either he's going to trash me or treasure me, right? Because Sumizy has got a mind of his own. And the most powerful thing happened. Sumizy said, who are you dressed by? I said, Sumizy, I dressed myself. He said, outstanding. We've never seen anything like this on a red carpet before or in public before. I said, yeah, that was tough to do, but I did it. And he said, so you're proud of your indigenous roots? I said, I am. And then the cherry on top. He said, and this was live television. I said, it's power heads in a moment of silence for all of those indigenous lives that were lost in the genocide. On national television, Sumizy did that. And that was the moment I knew, I'm going to run with this. The country needs it. So that's how I started. Wow. Really inspirational. Thank you for asking me the question. You're welcome, ma'am. It's our pleasure that you provided the answer, that we all need it, I think. Especially for me, I'm also a brown child. And I feel like, I don't want to generalize and say that every single brown child goes through it, but it's a majority of us. Because when we hear the word heritage day, then we have this mindset of dressing, especially Cretonian colors, this mindset of dressing in gowns or bonnets and rollers and things like that. When it's not actually our culture, but we are, how can I say it? We take in our surroundings and then we say, okay, this is who we are, this is what we obviously grew up in. And we immediately establish it as it is our culture when it was not. And I think that the fact that, ma'am... You can call me Jolene. The fact that Jolene took a step forward and represented us in that kind of way, not only for yourself, but on national television, means a lot to colored people that doesn't, let me say, insecure in some form. You're going to make me cry. But first of all, what I want to say is I have seen these photos that you're talking about and these videos that go out on heritage day of our young people dressing, and this does make me emotional, dressing in gowns and rollers. And it's not their fault, it's not our fault that we don't have the information. The information has been kept away from us. We are owed the truth. In 2026, we are owed the truth. And the truth hasn't been forthcoming. So first of all, I want to get that out of the way. I don't hold anything against the young people who are identifying with that as their heritage. Then I want to say, even white folks have got Korean son DNA. So if they have Korean son DNA, how much DNA do you have? So when I did my DNA test through this university, Dr. Rajeshri Mahabir said to me, almost 100% of people from the Western Cape, if you have your roots in the Western Cape, you have Korean son DNA. Automatically. Automatically. So you do not have to spend the money to go and get a DNA test. I'm telling you, you have Korean son DNA. Okay? Now, we also need to understand the difference between race, culture, ethnicity. Those are three very different things. I do believe that being colored or colored can be a culture. We have a culture that is our own, right? We've got the Yacht Numbers. Other cultures don't understand our culture. We've got a culture all of our own. We've got Cuxastore on a Sunday. That's part of our culture. But it's not our race, and it's not our ethnicity. Now, race, in my view, fabricates it. Total lie. In fact, in my world, I do not see white, black, and colored. I refuse to use a categorization system that was thought up, created, invented by someone to create division. It's a lie. It's a joke. We are all human. And ethnicity is what we probably need to speak about most during Heritage Month. Because ethnicity means, do you identify as Khoi, Sun, German, Afrikaner, Scottish, Irish? We have all of it in South Africa, mostly in Cape Town because we're a port city. But your ethnicity is something which is important in Heritage Month. And if you want to upset me, call it Braai. Call it Braai Day. Call it Braai Day. It's not Braai Day. So for those young people who don't know what to wear on Heritage Day, if you can't get hold of something like you're wearing, which is made by Khoi Queen or another producer of Khoi and Sun attire, it's quite simple. Anything leopard print. Because the Cape Leopard is a spiritual animal to the Khoi and Sun people. And if you remember during COVID, because everybody was locked up in their houses, all of a sudden the Cape Leopard appeared out of nowhere. People thought the Cape Leopard was extinct. But there's photos of the Cape Leopard coming out in Franschhoek and in Stellenbosch and on the West Coast. And now there are apparently about three Cape Leopard which are being taken care of in conservation circles on the West Coast. So the Cape Leopard, which we thought was extinct, was very important to the indigenous people. So if you don't know what to wear, wear something leopard print. If at all, if you do have access to something in springbok or porcupine quills or ostrich feathers, those elements too are significant. Now ma'am, or Jolene, let me rather ask, what made those specific kind of materials or those things like the leopard print and things like that, what made it significant to the Khoi Sun or the Khoi Khoi people? That's a deep question. You guys are very smart. I'll give you one story because I can't go through all of the elements. But the porcupine quill as a cultural element, the reason why the porcupine quill is important to our people is because the porcupine as an animal lives very close to the ground. And so they eat all of the medicinal plants growing on the ground, like shrubs and so forth, but all of the things that make you healthy. So when the, and I learned this from the Komani Sun in the Kalahari Desert, they told me that when you eat the meat from the porcupine, you are eating the medicine of the felt. It is the healthiest meat you can eat because it contains all of that goodness that the animal ate from the shrubs. And now here is another reason why the porcupine is important to the Komani Sun, because they have a proverb or saying that says, even a porcupine can kill a lion. Isn't that beautiful? Now what that means is, and it's a David and Goliath story, it means what it teaches is no matter how small you are, you can win the battle against something greater. But why the porcupine is specific in that story is because as a defense mechanism, you know the porcupine shoots its needles when there's danger around. But those needles are so sharp. Those calls are so sharp. I work with them on my hands, and actually last night I got a little pinprick. But what happens with those needles, if one needle pierces the chest of a lion, it can cause internal bleeding. And that lion will limp away from that scenario. And in just a few minutes, it will die because of the internal bleeding. So those calls can puncture the organs, go straight through the skin and into the organ. And that's why they say even a porcupine can kill a lion. So that also teaches us that even though we might have something very challenging in our lives, there's always a way that we can win it. That's the beautiful lessons our ancestors used to teach us. Okay, ma'am. I'm so sorry. It's like imprinted into my mind. It's fine. You remind me of myself. I interviewed Dr. Villa Busak and some profs, and everyone says, just call me Wayne. Call me Dr. Villa. Call me Will Villa. And I'm like, that's not going to happen. I'm just going to call you prof and doc. I know. I know. It's because we're so respectful. Yes, ma'am. It's fine. Don't stress. Okay, ma'am. So now moving on to the formal questions. So when you talk about Koi identity and heritage, why do you think South Africans, especially us as young people, often misunderstand, and what would you like them to understand? About Koi. Yes, the Koi heritage and the history of it. Okay. So I think what we need to unpack is that Koi, and you've done it already because it's been evident in your questions, is that Koi and sun are two different, they're two separate things completely. So they're brought together as one noun, Koi sun, for convenience. So I don't judge people who say Koi sun. It's just easier. But I think it is important for us to teach that Koi and sun are different. And I think when we do that, we eventually are able to understand now they are clans underneath those umbrella terms. So now you're going to find that the Koi were Koi Koi, they were Koho Kwa, Khorin Kawa, Strandlopers, all of those other different, and I don't even know if I've said Khorinai Kwa or I definitely got it wrong the first time, but they are different clans under those umbrella terms. Then you also understand that we are not standalone, that we are actually connected to people in Namibia. We are connected to the Nama. The Nama Koi. Yes. See? So people like to put us all under one umbrella, but it's incorrect really. And only when we separate it are we able then to study further, to go further. So like the thing is I've read somewhere that the Koi Koi, right, is the umbrella term for both, but I don't like it's not adding up in some kind of way. So I feel like because of that misunderstanding, it spreads to other people and then automatically it gets passed on like that and then future generations will be like, oh, no, misinformation. But to the people that actually understand the culture, they're like, yeah, no. Yeah. So what I want to say on that, and this question might come up later, but I'll answer it now. Don't get hung up on it. Don't get too hung up on it. Because some people are going to try and steal your hard drive space by making you argue something which they don't even know is true. So until we have the new history curriculum, do you know that the South African high school history curriculum is being revised as we speak, right? So until we get the facts in the new confirmed curriculum, that is an argument that is going to be a debate for a very long time to come. So me, personally, I don't even get into that debate. I don't waste my time with that because nobody really knows the truth. So what we need is to get all of our professors, our archaeologists, our archivists, our historians. We have to get all of those people together and decide what is the correct curriculum. Definitely, ma'am. And moving on, how do Kauai languages, traditions, and cultural knowledge contribute to preserving identity and what challenges and opportunities do you see in keeping this heritage alive for future generations? I think our biggest challenge right now, as I've mentioned, is our history curriculum. I think that we are not going to be able to move past the preservation without the correct education. When it comes to languages particularly, because we're talking about the history curriculum being revised, but we haven't even touched on the fact that indigenous languages should be reintroduced into schools. That's key. So I think there are many stumbling blocks, many hurdles, but for me those are the biggest focus points right now. So, ma'am, since we're talking about the language aspect now, since I've now seen we have about 12 official languages in South Africa, and the Kauai language is not incorporated into that, how does ma'am feel about that? I think it's a travesty. I think it's an absolute travesty. And how embarrassing for our country. I mean, we were the first people, first nation, and we were your first by our languages incorporated even, not even recognized in some form. There's that aspect, but listen to this aspect. How embarrassing is it for a whole country to have 12 official languages? You have the oldest language on the coat of arms of that country, and that language is not included. How embarrassing. How embarrassing. I think from my answer you can tell how I feel about it. It doesn't make sense. No, it doesn't make sense. It's completely illogical. And the language is Kwe Kwe Khovab. Kwe Kwe Khovab. And if you want to learn Kwe Kwe Khovab, there are lessons that are offered at the Castle of Good Hope for free, and I believe that UCT, they were running courses not so long ago, I'm not sure if they still do, but you can go and learn it at the Castle of Good Hope. Kwe Kwe Khovab. Kwe Kwe Khovab. Yes. Some people put the emphasis on the last part, so Kwe Kwe Khovab, but again, it doesn't matter. Yes. Okay, so I will be handing the mic over to Njulisi Mazoko. Good afternoon, ma'am. Hi. Good afternoon, Jolene. My name is Njulisi Mazoko. Lovely, lovely to meet you. My heritage is custodian of South Africa. So one of my first questions is regarding indigenous knowledge systems. So the first question is regarding indigenous knowledge systems, what forms of indigenous knowledge do you believe are most important for young people to learn from the Kowe community? So things such as your indigenous plant, oral history. I can say without a doubt oral history. Absolutely oral history. You know why? Oral history as a knowledge system is not just important but vital. So you must understand what the purpose of oral history was to our people. They weren't just telling stories. Locked up within songs, locked up within stories, and all of those are oral histories, are clues to survival. So they are songs which tell you which plants are not poisonous. Yes, this is the purpose of oral history. We think it's entertainment. Oh, no. Oral history, and this goes for a lot of first nation indigenous communities around the world, the Maori, the Native Americans, the Inuit people when you go towards Canada and so forth. They didn't read and write these cultures. So how did they pass along information? You passed it along in a song. You passed it along in a story. How did you tell a young hunter where to find water on a hunt? Right? Because if you are in the Kalahari Desert for weeks at a time, the ancestors helped you. They put it in song. They put it in story that this is where the watering spots are. Also, did you know that that is why ostrich shell as an element is important? It's because they used to empty out the ostrich shell, put water in it, and then bury it because that was, for lack of a better term, the Stanley Cup of the day. Right? So if you got thirsty or if another traveler or hunter got thirsty, yes, isn't it beautiful? Like those were your water stops. It's so beautiful. I know you guys have been to Attu, right? They have a Bushman Stories book, and in this book are beautiful old stories about how the mountain came to being, the love affair between the sun and the moon and the stars, and how the plains came into being. All of those stories are important because they archive spirituality. They archive hints to survival. Same as the slaves did in the Deep South when they sang Negroes, for lack of a better term, Negro spirituals, and songs like, Wait in the water, wait in... You know the song, right? Those songs told you how to escape the plantation. The clues are all trapped in song and in story. So as a knowledge system, oral history for me is very close to my heart. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you for a great question. Threats to heritage. When you speak about threats to heritage, you're speaking about the loss of knowledge, the effects of tourism, the effects of environmental degradation. So from your experience, what are the greatest threats facing Kauai cultural heritage today? It's a hot topic, and it might sound clichéd, and it's very irrelevant being here with you guys because this is an agriculture school, or at least in my view it is. But the biggest threat is the absence of land. I think a lot of people think the indigenous people want land because they want to own the land. Untrue. Untrue. We need land. We need connection to the land. And when you spend time in the Kalahari Desert, or the Kalahari, or the Komani Sun like I have, and you see how a four-year-old is dancing in the sand. They learn that dance, kicking up sand. And in those dances are also clues and secrets because they're mimicking animals. Right? So how can you dance on sand if you don't have land? How can you maintain that culture? And there are rituals that our people have. There are rituals that involve the land. So without land, how do we pass along cultural rituals? How do we pass along our dancing? How do we pass along our cultural practices? You know what I mean? So that's why land is important. So we need to be given cultural groups, cultural descendants, need to be given land. Just like the Native Americans are given land so that they can maintain and preserve their culture. How do we teach children about indigenous plants? What am I going to grow the plant in if I don't have land? You know? So that's my answer to that question. Thank you, ma'am. That was beautiful. Thank you. I've learned a lot. I'm so glad. And I'll hand it over to my co-host. Yes. This co-host ecosystem is something to behold, by the way. You guys are impressing me as a broadcaster. Afternoon, ma'am. Hi. Hi. I'm Lekwunema Kretul, and I'll also just ask, I think, two or three questions. Great. So my first question is, when researchers, museums, or schools document Kori stories, traditions, and indigenous knowledge, how can they make sure that communities and traditional knowledge holders remain respected, involved, and in control of how the knowledge is represented? Oh, quite simple. There is a beautiful First Nation saying or quote that says, and this is around the world, they say, nothing about us without us. Okay. Nothing about us without us. So whether you are curating a museum exhibition or whether you are going to make a feature film about Kotoa or say Rura Bartman, Sarah Bartman, you better be making those pieces of art with the consultation of a credible cultural consultant. Even in my case, when we filmed Koi Koi Saga, the award-winning documentary series, there were so many cultural consultants we had, not just cultural consultants as in chiefs and paramount chiefs and kings and queens, royalty, but cultural consultants from universities. Yes, who have studied this as a life work. These are the people that you bring on board when you are even attempting an exhibition or you are attempting a clothing label or you are attempting a movie or a book. Nothing about us without us. So the other question is, technology gives us the ability to record languages, oral histories, traditions and heritage sites. How can digital technology be used to preserve Koi heritage without removing it from the communities who own and carry that knowledge? Oh, that's deep. Look, I love what the Native Americans have done. In their reservations, they are the perfect meeting point of modernity, contemporary life and tradition. It's the perfect meeting point. So as you and I are sitting here right now, we have this amazing meeting point of high tech. We are recording a podcast at high tech. However, you are sitting here in a springbok headpiece. It's a meeting point. It's a meeting point of tradition and modern life. So the Native Americans have done it perfectly. I'm currently listening to a descendant, a Native American descendant who makes house music with their Native American language. That's how we do it. We don't see modern life as a separate thing to tradition. We marry the two. Now, what the Native Americans have done is they don't allow Hollywood to steal it. They bring that into the reservation. They bring that into their communities. So that's how we maintain it. So actually, in fact, what should be happening with the Koi Koi Saga documentary series that we filmed, that should be returned to the people of the Halahari. That should be returned to rural areas where those kids can watch the history and learn as well. Okay, ma'am, thank you. And this brings us to the last question. If you could leave one message with the young South Africans who will become the next custodians of our country's heritage, what would you want them to understand about protecting Koi heritage, language and identity for future generations? It's your duty. It's not a privilege. It's not a nice to have. It is absolutely everybody's human duty and responsibility, thank you, to preserve culture. I think we need to stop looking at it as though, oh, it's so cute that Jolene is going out and talking about culture. No. What are you doing about it? It's your duty. What are you doing about it? Exactly. And I'm not teaching here. What I'm doing here is passing on. And you're going to pass it on. And we're going to keep passing it on. Beautiful. Well, thank you, ma'am, for such an insightful session that we had. We learned a lot as a group that we can. This information that you have given us, we can take it further, not only in our presentation for provincials, but also as you as a group. We can teach it to others, not teach, pass down and make a way to future generations. And us as the custodians, we now also, we realize and we also fully comprehend the duty and responsibility that we have, not only as a youth, but as well as the future generation of South Africa in preserving our heritage and instilling the value that we will learn in others as well. So thank you once again, Ms. Jolene Martin. Thank you. Thank you for having me. And thank you for being so invested. And having a heart that's placed in the right position. Thank you so much. Thank you so much, ma'am. Thank you. And we'll end it here for this week at acre. OK, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.